EPA gets real on mileage labels for '08

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by jkash, Sep 15, 2007.

  1. jkash

    jkash Member

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    Although the 2008 Toyota Prius isn't in showrooms yet, the EPA back-tested several years' worth of cars using a mathematical formula based on the new testing methods.

    Based on the new test, the combined city-highway mileage for the 2007 Prius dropped from 55 miles per gallon to 46, a 16% decline. The Honda Civic hybrid, also a 2007 model, showed a similar decline.


    Sure won't be hard to beat the EPA figures anymore. :lol:

    Read more.
     
  2. timstorey

    timstorey Junior Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash @ Sep 15 2007, 05:33 AM) [snapback]512974[/snapback]</div>


    We purchased a 2008 Toyota Prius last Thursday, so they may be in dealer showrooms.

    Tim Storey
     
  3. hampdenwireless

    hampdenwireless Active Member

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    The older EPA rating system was fine. I had few problems attaining the EPA ratings in the cars I owned. Thjey should have just said on the sticker "drive smart and you can get this mpg".
     
  4. catgic

    catgic Mastr & Commandr Hybrid Guru

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  5. narf

    narf Active Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hampdenwireless @ Sep 15 2007, 08:58 AM) [snapback]512996[/snapback]</div>
    Look at it this way,
    The old sticker showed the potential best case MPG the car could get under ideal conditions. ( I know some people have been able to beat the old MPG numbers, but they are rare and certainly go to great efforts to do it.)
    The new sticker shows what somebody is likely to get during normal driving conditions. Most people will average close to those numbers. If you work at it you will beat the numbers by a bunch.
     
  6. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
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    Got gas this morning. Probably the last 60+ tank this year: 65.1mpg.
    Eat that, reduced numbers!
     
  7. jwe8f

    jwe8f New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Sep 15 2007, 12:40 PM) [snapback]513057[/snapback]</div>
    Hey Tony, what's your route? 35 MPH through synchronized stop lights each morning? That's the only time I can clear 60...


    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hampdenwireless @ Sep 15 2007, 09:58 AM) [snapback]512996[/snapback]</div>
    Environment counts too..
     
  8. Earthling

    Earthling New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jkash @ Sep 15 2007, 09:33 AM) [snapback]512974[/snapback]</div>
    The new Prius "combined EPA" figure is still 3 times higher than that of a base Silverado with one of the smaller available engines (18 mpg):

    http://www.chevrolet.com/silverado/specifications/

    My "combined" actual number is close to 51 mpg warm weather, and 44 mpg during the coldest part of the winter.

    Harry
     
  9. hampdenwireless

    hampdenwireless Active Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(narf @ Sep 15 2007, 01:29 PM) [snapback]513052[/snapback]</div>
    Well maybe I am the exception but normal driving for me has obtained the epa ratings pretty closely. That is highway at 65mph not 55 or slower. In the city I get the stated mpg too, maybe I know the lights etc. I DO NOT accelerate slowly unless I know the light will probably be changing red on me.

    The new rating system is almost geared to report mpg ratings for lead foots.
     
  10. DaveinOlyWA

    DaveinOlyWA 3rd Time was Solariffic!!

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    i allways thought the old EPA figures were a bit high (although i have attained them SEVERAL times) but 46 mpg??? that is ridiculous.

    we have gone from one extreme to the other. besides, the highway figure was not the one that needed adjustment. 51 mpg was just about right, maybe somewhere around 47-48 in the winter. it was the city of 60 mpg that was tough to make. that i thought should have gone done since you have to be good AND lucky to get that high
     
  11. Wayne

    Wayne Active Member

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    The overall is what changed to 46. The new numbers are 45 Hwy / 48 City / 46 Avg -- down from 51 Hwy / 60 City / 55 Avg.

    I consider myself a pretty darn good "Prius driver", being educated in the various techniques, and attaining as high as 72 MPG over a 2-hour trip. However, my typical routes do not allow me to get anywhere near that mileage. My lifetime average over almost 20,000 miles (including that 72 MPG trip) calculates out to 45.79, right at the 46 MPG they now claim. I know the majority of reasonably decent Prius owners on this board also average in the mid-to-high 40's. So, personally I support the move to 46.

    Half of your MPG is how aggressive a driver you are, half is your daily route (distance, stops, temperature...) Not everyone is blessed on the second half of that equation. In fact, I would say those who are blessed are the exception.

    Look at it this way: You guys with higher mileage can brag your numbers up even more! ;)

    http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/calculatorS...amp;model=Prius
     
  12. morpheusx

    morpheusx Professor Chaos

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hampdenwireless @ Sep 15 2007, 06:55 PM) [snapback]513134[/snapback]</div>
    I agree on my previous car Hwy was rated 29 and I never got less then 32 without doing anything but driving normal and that was with never turning off the a/c in the summer, if I did a few little tricks I could get 35mpg in it. A handful of times I even pulled out 40 mpg and that was driving at constant 70 mph.

    So far in my Prius I have only gotten less then 50 mpg tanks 3 times (2nd, 3rd, and 4th tank) and it was all from a cross country trip. My avg is at 55.1 (mostly highway) and I just drive normal and with the cruise.
     
  13. patsparks

    patsparks An Aussie perspective

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    I get 4.3L/100km (55mpg) city and 5.2L/100km (45mpg) country easy, without trying just driving sensibly although I'm almost always quickest off the lights. If you read a few high miler threads on here you will see that I object to the methods some use to get very high miles per gallon.

    I believe manufacturers have no choice what is written on the sticker, maybe they need a second sticker pointing the potential buyer here!!
     
  14. jonjonbear

    jonjonbear New Member

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    We were at Champion Toyota in Austin Texas yesterday and they were delivering two 2008 models yesterday.
    We stopped by to check up on our '08 order and saw them. What clued me in that they were the new ones was the lower EPA ratings..But indeed..They have arrived in Texas too...

    John
     
  15. ihparker

    ihparker New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TonyPSchaefer @ Sep 15 2007, 01:40 PM) [snapback]513057[/snapback]</div>

    I would love to know how you possibly got 65.1 MPH. I am not attacking your credibility, but I do not see how it is remotely possible under anything but totally open roads where you have total control of your driving habits. And even then, those numbers, according to everything I have read, would put you in the top .0001 percent of Prius drivers.

    I have tried every trick I know in a 30/70 (CIty/Highway) driving and the most I could get was around 50 mpg. I have tried keeping my highway speeds to no more than 65 mph and have coasted as much as I could. I have tried other "tricks" that some of suggested in driving styles.

    This last tank, I drove the Prius like I drive my BMW 750 (normal, not trying to get great gas mileage) and I got 47.7 mpg (which is darn close to the new EPA numbers).
     
  16. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bostonimann @ Sep 16 2007, 09:08 AM) [snapback]513319[/snapback]</div>
    traffic mostly. I'm in a hilly area and got my first 60mpg tank. Traffic (and traffic lights) is what kills the mileage, along with short trips (which you can control).

    I think the highway sprint is the one taking a bite out of your mpg. At 70mph, I get 5.1L/100km or about 46mpg on the highway so I know it's pretty bad. At 65, it's probably inching up closer to 48mpg so that extra 2mpg is probably from your city drive.

    Oh and my tank was 100% city lol. If I take it out on the highway (even only at 60mph), it'll drop.
     
  17. MegansPrius

    MegansPrius GoogleMeister, AKA bongokitty

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bostonimann @ Sep 16 2007, 11:08 AM) [snapback]513319[/snapback]</div>
    You can find Tony's mileage logs at http://www.chicagopriusgroup.com/MileageLo...chaefer/All.htm
    and the Chicago Prius Group driving tips page at
    http://www.chicagopriusgroup.com/the-prius/driving-tips.htm
     
  18. MikeSF

    MikeSF Member

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    The old highway miles I could get fairly easily (51mpg) as long as the highway didn't go up any hills/mountains... the city one, no way in hell I ever got closer to 60mpg, but then again I don't live anywhere near what people would consider an ideal city for driving i.e. "flat", in fact I get better highway mileage than city mileage.

    I mean sure there are some flat areas in neighboring cities where I can simply cruise along at 35 using hardly any gas (or electricity for that matter) but those areas are far and few between for me normally, so don't apply.

    I mean Toyota used to have an ad campaign for the Camry hybrid(?) "40MPG in the city... ANY City" it's crap like this which does lead to deceptive advertising (aka lying)... now EPAs numbers, I have no problem with those, I can see how someone in a nice flat city can get 60mpg without issues.
     
  19. ihparker

    ihparker New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Sep 16 2007, 12:40 PM) [snapback]513333[/snapback]</div>

    Interesting. I think my biggest issue is that I use this car mostly on short (15 minute commute to and from work). Given the warm up 5 minutes, with its awful mpg, I then only have 10 minutes at the 30/70 city/highway ratio. So, I guess that 47.7 mpg makes sense under those conditions.

    One day, I am going to try an all city trip, using the tricks to see if I can be part of the 60mpg club :)
     
  20. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(bostonimann @ Sep 16 2007, 11:45 AM) [snapback]513363[/snapback]</div>
    Yeah 15 mins isn't enough. My commute to school is 15kms.. usually takes 20-30 mins. 30 if it's raining and everyone drives to school. Even then it's not fully warmed up. Sure the engine shuts down (eventually...) but you can tell that it isn't quite warm when you can't really glide.


    Don't forget to make sure the engine's warm and the temperatures are warm before the all city trip. Plot your route out. Find the most efficient route for a in-town (or cross-town) trip. That includes picking a time with less traffic as well as topography.

    If you've got the skills down (and it seems like you do esp. with 47mpg), then you should be able to get close to 60mpg.
     
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