Exploding Grandma's

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 12:42 PM) [snapback]357547[/snapback]</div>

ROFL!!!!

You want to tell us about the by-laws of the bb dbermanmd? What a joke!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 01:03 PM) [snapback]357560[/snapback]</div>

You're really funny today. My stomach hurts from laughing!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 01:04 PM) [snapback]357560[/snapback]</div>

Again, I'm not answering any questions you ask me until you answer the ones I asked you.

 

The quote button did not work. So..
Me:

dbermanmd:

Why must there be a religious nation where people of other religions are second-class citizens? The goal of any civilized person should be that every person has a place in which to live peacefully and with full rights. In my opinion, in the Middle east, this can only be achieved by a one-state solution, in which both Jews and Palestinians live equally, with a separation of religion from government. Clearly, the U.S-style winner-takes-all "democracy" would not be suitable. A proportional democracy, of the type that Israel grants its own people, would work better. Thus the basic structure of government need not be changed. Just get rid of the laws that favor one religion over another, and perhaps prohibit rabbis and mullahs from occupying government posts.

My second point was meant to counter your assertion that the Palestinians are more brutal than Israel.

You want to go farther back than the Ottoman Empire? Perhaps you want to use the Biblical argument that "god gave it to us"? I've already answered this point. See my earlier posting.

In the end, we live in the present, and any solution must be in the present. I have offered what I see as the only solution: an end to the ethic of vengeance, and a one-state solution, where both peoples would have a home. The added benefit (besides peace!) would be the strongest nation in the region. The cost is that both sides would have to give up their hatred. I guess it's asking too much: You can have peace and prosperity but you have to give up your hatred. On both sides they'd rather have their hate than peace and prosperity for themselves and theior grandchildren.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 12:42 PM) [snapback]357547[/snapback]</div>

Give us Germany, or a goodly chunk of it. Nice arable land, instead of a worthless piece of desert with nothing but religious symbolism.

And of course the Romani people should have gotten a goodly chunk of Germany too. Nobody suggested compensating them. Are a mere two million dead insufficient to be considered a holocaust?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(IsrAmeriPrius @ Dec 4 2006, 02:30 PM) [snapback]357539[/snapback]</div>

My most sincere apologies if my statement was taken in offense... Obviously, there were exceptions, i was merely basing it on the more recent history and referring to the immigration in the 1920's which appears to have led to the current conflict.

And to answer your two questions, Doberman:

I never said the Jews didn't have a right to the land. putting words in my mouth again, and reinforcing what i said earlier. good argument. Instead, i gave a brief history of the area and asked some hard questions that i didn't have answers to.

Consequences of the Holocost... lets see... i wasn't even alive then, so i was going to do precisely what i had done for the millions of years prior to that: absolutely nothing. But i see that you would prefer to take a people that were displaced from their homes by a fascist regime intent in exterminating their people and ship them all off into an isolated part of the world where you wouldn't have to see or interact with them. Sounds to me like you're just one step away from Hitler, my friend.

 

What happened to the homes the Jews lived in before the Holocaust?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 03:26 PM) [snapback]357580[/snapback]</div>

LOL do you even know what you're talking about?

Yes, Israel is completely and totally dedicated to peace, their world class, best funded in the area military is clearly not a factor in your arguments.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Dec 4 2006, 01:14 PM) [snapback]357566[/snapback]</div>

You are naive. This is not going to work. The two sides did not get along during the British Mandate days when Palestine was ruled by a supposedly neutral entity. Arab Sunni and Shiite Moslems cannot get along with each other in Iraq. Arab Shiite and Sunni Moslems, Druze and Maronite Christians are unable to live peacefully with each other in Lebanon. There is not a single member state of the Arab League which is a democracy. What makes you so sure that Arab and Jews will peacefully live with or along each other in the Land of Israel? Arab school curriculum, even in the Palestinian Authority ruled areas, still advocates driving the Jews into the sea.

By the way, one state solution is often used as code language by advocates of wiping Israel off the face of the Earth and replacing it with an Arab Palestinian nation.

Obviously you haven't a clue as to the modern State of Israel. The people of Israel literally made the desert bloom.

The Romani are entitled to have a homeland in their ancestral lands, wherever those may be.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 03:35 PM) [snapback]357587[/snapback]</div>

Once again, putting words in my mouth. Get this through your thick head: I NEVER SAID THAT.

I never said i thought one side was more dedicated than the other to peace. I simply pointed out the fallacy in your statement. Make one statement here that isn't putting words in someones mouth or spouting incorrect or slanted information. please. It's getting old having all of our arguments go straight over your head. It's like arguing with a little kid... "I know you are but what am i? your mom!"

 

Deep respect to the first few replies on this thread, folks. Firmly putting this apostrophe abuser in his place. It's reassuring to see some Americans with a sense of reality and perspective, despite your media propaganda.

But I still can't help but wonder "exploding Grandma's what, exactly?"

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 10:46 PM) [snapback]357595[/snapback]</div>

Give it back??? This is the gaza strip totally sealed off by the Israeli military? The one with the demolished airport? The one without control of its own water supply, or coastline? It's a giant, open-air prison.

Maybe if you let them get the airport operational, gave them control of their airspace and let them get a sea port running, you could talk about them "having it back". Otherwise, you're frankly delusional. Or inhuman.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Dec 4 2006, 01:50 PM) [snapback]357598[/snapback]</div>

OMG you don't even get that joke? Can my stomach take much more of this? You really do need help with your English.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(eagle33199 @ Dec 4 2006, 01:24 PM) [snapback]357578[/snapback]</div>

No offense taken. Just setting the record straight.

Modern era return of Jews to the Land of Israel commenced with the First Aliya which followed pogroms in Russia in 1881-1882. Nearly 35,000 Jews came to Palestine during that time.

The next wave of immigration was known as the Second Aliya, 1904-1914. 40,000 Jews immigrated during this period. It ended with the beginning of the First World War.

The Third Aliya, 1919-1923, was a continuation of the Second Aliya at the conclusion of the war. It was triggered by the October Revolution in Russia, the ensuing pogroms there and in Poland and Hungary, the British conquest of Palestine and the Balfour Declaration. It also consisted of 40,000 migrants and by its end there were 90,000 Jews in British ruled Palestine.

The Fourth Aliya, 1924-1929, was a direct result of the economic crisis and anti-Jewish policies in Poland, along with the introduction of stiff immigration quotas by the United States. It brought 82,000 Jews to Palestine, of whom 23,000 left.

The Fifth Aliya, 1929-1939, followed the Nazi accession to power in Germany (1933) and the persecution of the Jews' there. Within a four-year period (1933-1936), 174,000 Jews settled in the country.

By 1940, nearly 250,000 Jews had arrived during the Fifth Aliya (20,000 of them left later) and the Jewish population in Mandatory Palestine reached 450,000.

Israel Ministry of Foreign Affairs - Aliya and Absorption

The Jewish Agency for Israel - The Department for Jewish Zionist Education - New Aliyah - Modern Zionist Aliyot (1882 - 1948)

Wikipedia® - Aliyah