Ford C Max, Prius killer?

Discussion in 'Ford/Lincoln Hybrids and EVs' started by UTBuckeye, Jul 5, 2012.

  1. guachodan

    guachodan Junior Member

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    Consumer Reports has some first impressions at We get a charge out of driving the new Ford C-Max Hybrid, C-Max Energi . Nothing too deep but hopefully we'll get some good information after they spend more time with the car. I'm particularly interested in what type of fuel efficiency they get and any reliability concerns they have.
     
  2. HeyKB

    HeyKB Not so new member

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    I just noticed EV+ mode on our C-Max for the first time on our last trip with the car. We were coming home from the movies and when I got into our neighborhood (certainly less than 1/2 mile from home) I saw the EV+. I'm not sure when it came on, but I noticed that I was 100% electric even going up a pretty steep hill.

    Since the C-Max tends to use gasoline when it thinks it's going uphill, I was surprised and pleased that it decided to run all electric for the last few minutes of the drive home. It's going to help with the mileage, for sure.
     
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  3. guachodan

    guachodan Junior Member

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    HeyKB, do you have an Energi? I definitely understand the benefit of switching to EV mode when close to a charging point (home) but I'm curious what the benefit would be with a non plug in. It looks like Ford has done a good job of packing a lot of very advanced tech into this package, if they can make it all work together reliably it's a really compelling vehicle.
     
  4. HeyKB

    HeyKB Not so new member

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    Ours is not the Energi. It won't be available in our state for another few months.

    The advantage of the EV mode close to home is that there is plenty of battery available for that last leg, so why not use it, especially on terrain that would normally force the ICE on.

    Why not the Energi for us? We don't really fit the profile for a plug-in - I tend to drive 50 miles at a time, a few times a week, so the benefit of an Energi would not be all that much. I drive the Prius on those trips anyway, averaging about 45 mpg. If I slowed down a little, I could probably do a bit better on the mpg, but generally I'm more interested in arriving as quickly as possible. :cool:
     
  5. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    For a non-plug in, the benefit is during the next start up. There is more room in the battery for energy produced during the warm up cycle. It lessens the negative impact of that inefficient operation.
     
  6. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    I'm a little hard pressed that Ford can deliver a quality anything. Recently a post was out that Ford had the lowest Consumer Servey at the Consumer Reports web site. I can say that in my long evolution of owning cars in my family Toyota and Honda had the best car owner experience for me and BMW, Fiat,Ford, Chev the worst. Heck I had problems with my Honda and Toyota but not as troublesome and expensive as the others. After a while you develop a sense of Experience and you just know what to avoid and Ford is a product I would avoid.
     
  7. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    If you read the report on that survey, it excluded the fusion and escape, two cars that cr rates very high because new models are out, for too short a period of time for CR. It mainly attacked the explorer and fieseta for sync and powershift transmissions. The c-max does not have a powershift, and uses a diferent version of sync. One of the reviewers liked the sync in the c-max much better than the toyota entune. There is a learning curve to these systems. I really put no stock in these initial reliability reports, especially when they rate an automaker.


    Hey that is your opinion, and you are welcome to it, but until there are reliability estimates on these specific vehicles I would say your opinion is worth about what I paid for it. Did you notice the new recall on prii? Its no big deal if you like the toyota brand, but if you hate the prius, it is another example of toyota quality being over rated. YMMV
     
  8. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    Where there is smoke there is fire. You're right I do not have hard facts, but after owning a few cars in my time I firmly believe you don't throw good money at bad and fool me once shame on you Ford, and Fool me twice shame on me. I'm sure it is a matter of time before those new models fall into the Hall of Shame at Ford. In this junction I'm looking for reliability and Toyota and Honda have set the standard.
     
  9. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    The only thing C-Max will kill is the hearts and minds of EV enthusiasts when the troubles are made obvious. Toyota Prius is a market maker at this point and the 2015 Prius generation 4 will WOW the EV community again with original patents and game changing technology. In 2020 when the Sulpher battery with a 600 Mile range is on the market it will change battery technology.
     
  10. born_again

    born_again Member

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    There are 2 types of hybrid vehicles:

    1) Prius
    2) those that wish were Prius.
     
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  11. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    The author has nerve coming on a Prius Chat board and claiming a Ford C-Max is a Prius Killer. Prius welcomes the competition in this dog eat dog fight but frankly Ford has no fight in this game or any game for that fact.
     
  12. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Did you miss the question mark in the title?

    This might be Priuschat, but we are in the Ford hybrid section. There are many sub forums here for other makes and models. In the early days here, the idea of competitive hybrids from other manufacturers raised some excitement since it confirmed what we knew about the potential for hybrid cars. Guess that now they have arrived Priuschat should just become another mindless fanboy site then.
     
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  13. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    Mindless hardly. Ford is not raising any excitment beyond the initial product launch. Ford's track record is deplorable and in the Hybrid universe less than deplorable if that is possible. This may become there modern Pinto. I give Chevy kudos with the Volt but Ford that remains to be seen. Time will tell if the C-max will be a game changer or another disappointment. :)
     
  14. guachodan

    guachodan Junior Member

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    I certainly can't comment on the long term reliability of the C-Max (or Ford's other new launches) but having test driven a C-Max (not Energi) I have to say I'm very pleased with the additional competition. I have a Gen II Prius and while Toyota does have outstanding reliability and efficiency, the C-Max feels more exciting to drive. I've only sat in a PiP but I plan on test driving one for comparison purposes. The C-Max has a lot of really nice features though that just aren't available in a Prius (multiple displays, active sound cancellation, automated lift gate, etc...). It's also more powerful but this comes at the cost of fuel efficiency I'm sure (EPA numbers not withstanding). I can only hope that this forces Toyota to make the Prius even better as competition is good for all of us. If Ford can demonstrate good reliability for their latest vehicles I might make the plunge.
     
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  15. JMD

    JMD 2012 Prius 4 Solar Roof

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    You hit the bulls eye RELIABILITY. Prius was never and will never become a sports car. It is not in the DNA. Ford is exciting to drive but that excitement soon wears thin when you faced with expensive trips to the repair shop. Check out the Prius 100K Mile Club and read a few of the posts 28 pages long. Many say nothing more than routine maintenance and tire changes. Many have the original brakes thanks to regenerative braking. That is worth its price in gold. I only say that after giving up on a BMW 325i I purchased new in 2006 that was a nightmare in problems. I gave up on the exciting drive and latest fangled gadgets to buy the most economical and reliable car I know the Prius. It does have some bells and whistles like the solar powered roof and entunes & navigation is a charm. The few hundred dollars I save in gas and thousands I save in repairs goes toward investing or a life style upgrade. The 2015 Prius Generation IV will be over the top. The gen 3 had 500 patents that will expire and the next gen will surpass that. Look forward to all wheel drive option and 60 MPG Hybrid and a longer range PIP and much more. :)
     
  16. guachodan

    guachodan Junior Member

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    The gen IV Prius family does sound very exciting, I just wish it was here now :) I've never had any problems with my Prius although it's also only gone 53,000 miles in 7+ years. I'm on my third recall with it but I don't really mind proactive recalls. I don't expect Ford to beat Toyota at reliability but they've improved massively recently and I would love to see that momentum keep up. It's exciting to see how much interest there is in hybrids and EV tech, the more competition in this space the better. I just want the fuel efficiency of a Prius with all the bells and whistles that Ford has, the EV range of a Volt, and the space of a Prius V. Oh ya, and under $20k.
     
  17. born_again

    born_again Member

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    I don't see why you guys are still at this. Like I said previously, there are 2 types of hybrid vehicles:

    1) Prius
    2) those that wish were Prius.
     
  18. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    And here I've had no problems with my vehicles that left soured on Ford. Same with the Lincolns my immediate family have owned. The only Fords we had that spent time undrivable were a '69 convertible and '66 fastback Mustang. They weren't bought new.:)
    Same can be said of the family GMs. Going by my and family's experiences, I'd say stay away from Honda. My brother got an Accord with one of the bad transmissions. That was $3000+ out of warranty. Of course he drives a Civic now.
    I had no problems with the Matrix and Prius. Scratch that, I had a loose exterior window trim piece on the Prius. I didn't put the miles on them that I have with the Fords though.

    Long brake life is a boon of regenerative braking no matter the brand. Hypermiling has extended the life of the HHR's brakes:D.
     
  19. F8L

    F8L Protecting Habitat & AG Lands

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    Too much fan boy cheering is this thread for me.
     
  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Yeah, it drifted.

    Back to the OP. No, the C-max won't be a Prius killer. The Prius claim to fame is in high mpg. Which should get higher in the next generation. To beat it a competitor will have do better in fuel economy, price, or possibly other perks. The C-max has the other perks; drive experience, cabin noise, interior, options, etc. Its big one is form of cargo space. This though works more for catching Prius v sales. If the slope of the Prius hatch didn't work for someone, they probably wouldn't have bought it anyway.

    So, some may opt for it over a Prius, but most C-max sales will be by someone looking at another hybrid, or, even better, a non-hybrid/ low fuel economy vehicle.

    Which sums up the early portion of the thread I think.
     
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