Ford Opens Ordering for Electric Focus : $39,995

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Heating the battery while it charges allows it to take in its full charge. The temperature control also plays a part in the shorter charge time. Then keeping the pack within an optimal temperature range allows for more efficient discharge. It also helps in extreme heat, but a real winter is a far more likely climate for the car. Didn't Nissan avoid winter, or snow belt, states on their first roll out? Compared to a Leaf, the Focus should have a narrower swing in ranges through out the year.

The price is steep, but part of Ford's plans with the Focus is also offer a hybrid. Differing styling and name defeats the advantages, mainly cost, of producing a single body and chassis. Has Toyota announced pricing for the Rav4 EV yet?

The build page has more than 2 colors to choose. With the same body and all, I don't know why they would limit it. The base seats are "innovative Earth-friendly cloth seat fabric in Focus Electric is made from 100 percent post-industrial materials - polyester fibers that would have ended up in landfills otherwise. The cushions also use a bio-based polyurethane foam derived from the oils of various plant seeds such as soybeans." That might appeal more to an early adopter than leather. I, personally, have not been a fan of most leather I've seen in cars. The newer stuff is nicer, but most of the ones I've sat on aren't much better than vinyl in the high and low ends of temperatures.

 

You could simply wait until the leaf was made here which I believe is 2013. I'm sure there will be some that like the ford better.

I think ford wants to gain experience with the focus EV, they don't really want to bet the company the way nissan is with the leaf. If they don't sell enough to get customers they can drop the price. They can easily ramp up production. The C-max is their test mule for conventional ice, HV, and phev.

On leather, I thought the leather on my previous lexus was excellant. I tried it in the prius and was not impressed. If its not great leather, and there are many grades, I would rather not have it.

I don't think there is pricing for the rav4 ev yet.

 

Very underwhelming. $5k for range competitive with a Leaf. I am not sure but I think a Leaf is on its own platform and thus built from ground up for EV, whereas shoehorning that into the Focus likely compromised some things otherwise not necessary such as capacity.

$17k actually. Tesla motors says its $50k is after tax benefit (right on their website). I read the link here as $40k before tax benefit.

 

I'm waiting until 2019. It was initially going to be 2012 but they have delayed it, either due to the quake or lack of sales.

 

A Disappointment as Ford Focus Electric Priced to “Sit†at $39,995 - CleanMPG Forums

 

Emphasis mine.

Your wording seems to suggest that you consider lead batteries to be more robust. The opposite is true. While I don't know much about the lithium chemistries in the Leaf and other modern EVs, I can tell you that the lithium iron phosphate (LiFePO4) batteries in my Xebra are MUCH more robust in cold weather than lead. The original (lead) pack seemed to lose half its range in cold weather. The present (LiFePO4) battery pack does not show any discernable reduction in capacity in cold weather.

Thus your experience with lead batteries cannot be extrapolated to lithium batteries.

The Tesla, BTW, both heats and cools the pack, as needed, because it's older style li-ion batteries are more affected by temperature than the newer styles.

 

The warranty only covers defects. Nissan specifically excludes degradation due to aging from its warranty. No EV maker is giving a warranty guaranteeing any specific battery capacity or range at any specific vehicle age. E.g. 80% battery capacity after 7 years. That's about what most of them say they expect. But nobody is giving a warranty.

If you can show that reduced range is due to a DEFECT in materials or workmanship, that's another matter.

Accelerated aging tests are all well and good, but until there is real-life experience, we will not know. Which is probably why they are NOT guaranteeing that.

 

Leaf battery could cost £19k | News | Auto Express

 

Lithium is expensive and not ready for the mass market prime time.

I am concern about the price of C-Max Energi plugin.

 

Oh my gosh, I don't think I've seen a site so badly designed as the Nissan Leaf's one in a very long time. I swear I read a while back on it that Nissan predicts 80% capacity after five years (found it: http://www.nissan-techinfo.com/refgh0v/og/Leaf/2011-Nissan-Leaf.pdf), but navigating through that nissan leaf site now I have no idea what I'm doing, it's a complete catastrophe of bubbles and no obvious hierarchy, a real mess.

More links I'm seeing now say 5-10 years expected life for battery.

Ah, and finally here is the warranty for the battery:
http://nissan-leaf.net/2010/11/16/follow-up-nissan-leaf-battery-warranty/

So basically, unless you have some glaring fault with the battery, your expected loss of capacity isn't covered. Therefore we can assume that 5-10 years after purchase you'll need a new battery for the car to prevent it being a paper weight, and you'll pay for that with your own money.

And the official booklet
http://www.mynissanleaf.com/wiki/images/c/c3/2011-leaf-warranty-booklet.pdf

Nissan hasn't said what gradual capacity loss is, that I can find, but they are certainly not appearing to replace or repair a battery that is aging as one would expect, and that includes no prorated replacement or anything, either.

I wonder how it will impact resale of off-lease Leafs, as the buyer knows they have 2-7 years in expected life and they're likely already going to be seeing less range than a new Leaf even the first day they buy it.

 

I actually believe them on battery life. But they give no promise. Just an "expectation."

Yep. I think the web site was designed by the same incompetent morons who ran the completely screwed-up ordering process which finally drove me away from Nissan.

Actually, we cannot assume anything. There is no guarantee, so any expense is the responsibility of the owner. (One reason many people leased rather than buying, and some walked away altogether.) But the battery could last longer or shorter than "expected."

Think of it as analogous to a transmission replacement at the end of 8 or 10 years. And batteries will cost less by then. Tesla has a program for the Roadster wherein $12,000 today gets you a brand new battery pack installed in 7 years. And the Tesla pack has 2.5 times the range. I'd guess $4,000 for a new Leaf pack in 8 years from now. Not all that bad to bring the car back to its full range. And there might be the option to spend $8,000 and get double the original range, depending on advances in batteries.

This is another unknown, and part of being a pioneer. But see my comment above. It may not cost all that much to restore the car to its original range or more.

Note also that if gas is $25 per gallon in a decade, any EV will be worth a lot more.

 

The Volt warranty covers capacity degradation that exceeds 30% at the end of 8 years or 100,000 miles and says that capacity is expected to be reduced at that point between 10-30% depending upon use.

Beginning with model year 2013 (Summer 2012) the cars sold in states that follow the California emissions law will get their battery warranty extended to 10 years or 150,000 miles. There is no word yet on what the warranted capacity degradation will be for that extended coverage.

See page 14 for the Voltec warranty overview in the following Chevrolet warranty brochure:

http://www.chevrolet.com/assets/pdf/en/overview/2k12chev_lim_wm.pdf

 

The CA emission law only applies to ICE or Hybrid or EREV, not for BEV because BEV has no tail pipe emission.

 

I think we will see a point of competition over battery warranties between manufactureres of ecars, similar to overall initial "bumper to bumper" warranties today. The more ecars we have on dealership floors the better.

I would like to see a good detailed side-by-side comparison between the Leaf, eFocus and the iMiev. Price, tech specs, warranties ..... included.

 

If Leaf SL is capable of quick charge, wouldn't the charger be 6.6kW? You have it as No for both SV and SL.