Gen 2 2004 Prius 200k miles. Bad battery cells. How hard is module replacement?

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by DCGen2Prius, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    Since you work in hybrids I know when you get a bad module in a original pack you have options (replacement of: module only or the whole battery returning the core) but what happens if you have the cylinder style battery and a module fail after warranty, what are the options?
     
  2. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    @2k1Toaster I am sure you have an answer. assuming it is not a trash CEBA battery.
     
  3. DCGen2Prius

    DCGen2Prius New Member

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    Thanks for the input and discussion folks. Had to put this on the back burner - but am now back on it. Am going to go ahead and pull my battery and find the bad modules - and replace with as good as I can find - and do the best balancing/charging/discharging procedure I can do/have time for/with available equipment.

    If you might share a link to the best procedures/practices/step by step of battery removal, module replacement/testing/balancing that you followed I'd be very appreciative. I am a skilled and knowledgable....amatuer. :) thank you.
     
  4. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    @TMR-JWAP is one of our experienced hobbyists.
     
  5. 8AAGen2

    8AAGen2 New Member

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    How did you make out on the module replacement? I'm in the process of replacing all of mine with new modules from NewPriusBatteries. It's been a learning experience, but so far has not been challenging. It helps that it's not my primary vehicle and I can take my time with it.
     
  6. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    I almost order new modules too but since I already owned the prolong deluxe kit I decided to get my own pack repaired, it’s a pretty easy process, it start with a modules monitoring while driving you looking for something simple which blocks loose voltage overnight, meaning way more than the others and which blocks recharge more rapidly than the others, then you know which blocks to change, (maybe only one module in the block go bad only a simple trick to find out you leave it alone couple days and come back check the voltage days later it will say it’s me by itself when you check the voltage of the modules individually) then replaced modules as needed I recommend you 2ndlifebattery ebay, and by now you have a working hybrid battery, I also reconditioned my other modules with the prolong deluxe kit, for a better module performance, without the DYI prolong deluxe kit you can still do the repair but expect less performance and possibly a quicker DTOD do it to a most likely unbalance modules and less capacity.
     
    #26 Frank1234, Oct 18, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
  7. 8AAGen2

    8AAGen2 New Member

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    I had considered the Prolong system, but it sounded like a lot of work trying to get troublesome modules renewed. I got the impression that it was a better system for a battery pack with no problems and would help extend it's life. I've gotten 16 good years out of the car, and it sounds like mechanically I could get a few more out of it. I'd rather replace the modules with new ones and not have to worry about it for awhile. It would be interesting to experiment with trying to revive modules, but I'd rather get the car back on the road and not worry about it anymore.
     
  8. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    To tell you the true I have a 2014 Prius with a excellent hybrid battery condition and am not way installing the prolong system for not reason, the prolong kit it’s a great DYI kit to do you own reconditioning and am not reconditioning a good battery I understand that discharging it more than 40% and charging more than 80% will shorten the life span of the hybrid battery but on the other hand a failed battery or a close to fail battery can get reconditioned with the help of the prolong kit by replacing modules, balancing and squeezing out the remaining capacity of the hybrid battery, just to keep it clear you can’t revive a dead module, ones a module or cell in the module is dead is gone for good, the prolong doesn’t revive the battery cells or modules it doesn’t, what it does it balance the cells and also take care of the battery memory effect that it’s created by the hybrid battery ECU only charging and discharging between 40 and 80%, that been said between buying a reconditioning hybrid battery or buying the prolong to do you own reconditioning I will do my own but between a reconditioning a battery and buying a new battery sure a new battery is better but $60 dollars plus my time in my battery vs $1600 plus my time on the battery make me give a second thought even I invest on the prolong kit $700 dollars that money it’s not going in to the car it can be use on many more cars and you can sell it after you done with it if that is what you prefer or keep it for you next Prius like me so can’t count those $700 to the car just count toward you tools arsenal, probably it will be a time when reconditioning will be not a option anymore do it to many modules fail at the same time or failing to often so will make no sense to keep reconditioning but in the mean time I’m glad I didn’t expended the $1600 and $60 dollars got my 15 years old Prius back on the road, by the way some dealer in Ohio have great prices on the hybrid battery the cheapest I can recall last time I checked was $1579 brand new dealer Prius generation 2 hybrid battery, Cleveland Ohio.
     
    #28 Frank1234, Oct 18, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  9. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Remember nobody except Toyota has new OEM modules. That is why the kit of new cells is better that other third party solutions.
     
  10. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    The problem is you cannot buy new modules. To properly replace modules in a pack the voltage if the modules need to be properly monitored and balanced. Otherwise you have sacrificed reliability to gain more vehicle life. The pack could fail at any time leaving you stranded.
     
  11. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    Totally agree that new aftermarket is better than refurbished but when come to cost vs reliability $60 dollars don’t look that bad at all the problem I see here is buying a refurbished battery just doesn’t make sense because you rather get the new $1600 kit as long you doing the job by you self but if you paying someone else you be better with a new dealer battery but in the other hands if you have the right tools and equipment refurbishing a battery for $60 dollars it’s a great option, anyway both repairs have to be done by you self so can’t compare a refurbished installed by a company where you don’t do anything with a self repair because it will look something like this $1500 a installed refurbished with warranty where you don’t touch anything vs $1600 refurbishing by you self with a new kit with warranty only on parts no labor warranty you have to do everything (and hope you never need the warranty because you will be out a car for long time, you still refurbishing because you reusing old parts with the new kit) or $60 replacing 2 modules (normally) also not warranty on labor so comparing somebody else refurbished battery with warranty where they do everything and you just pay to a self refurbished battery it’s a unfair comparison because self reconditioning will never be $1500 for couple modules so people should stop comparing installed refurbished hybrid battery with full warranty with DYI repairs with warranty just on parts because in my scenario was $60 vs $1600 not $1500 vs $1600 that people have in mind when deciding which router to go.
     
    #31 Frank1234, Oct 19, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
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  12. 8AAGen2

    8AAGen2 New Member

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    When I said "new modules" I was referring to the new modules that are included in the kit from NewPriusBatteries. Toyota doesn't sell new OEM modules, but even if they did, I don't think that I would go that route either. Might be cheaper to replace my two weak modules (submodules?), but from what I've read, there is a problem with mixing modules of different ages. There is also the uncertainty of how much longer my 16 year old existing modules will continue to work. If it was easy to replace them, I might consider playing whack-a-mole for awhile. I'd also thought about trying to cycle the weak modules, but didn't like the idea of having to have the batteries clamped together in order to do that. Sounds like an interesting hobby/experiment, but I want to have my car back on the road.

    I'm glad to hear that Toyota is starting to offer new battery packs for a reasonable price in some areas. It's about time. There are a lot of things I like about the design of the NewPriusBatteries replacement kit and it sounds like there has been a lot of good experiences with the new battery design. I'm taking my time doing the exchange, mostly so that I can take notes and lots of pictures (so that I can get everything back together). It's not been hard so far, I'm just the kind of guy that gets things put back together and then have a mystery part or bolt left over. I also know now to make sure all the connections click when putting it back together, and make sure that I push the safety plug in firmly.
     
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  13. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Hybrid Automotive tries to mitigate that by classifying their used modules by number of miles used.
     
  14. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    Toyota do sell them new for under $1600 on some locations you just don’t have to swap anything other than the ECU because everything come in place different than the new Prius kit where you have to remove and reinstall all modules and a new harness.
     
  15. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    That is the battery PACK, not individual MODULES.
     
  16. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    I like the idea but 30 dollars a piece from eBay to my door from a reputable seller on eBay vs $46 a piece plus shipping from hybrid automotive make a huge difference, I believe hybrid automotive modules should be a nice option for someone refurbishing without the prolong deluxe kit and need to get a match for the remaining modules but having the prolong kit and been able to reconditioning to remaining modules take that problem out the way as long you don’t replace with a new module.
     
  17. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    Take them out you got them all in there for the same price.

    By the way you don’t get individual modules either from newpriusbattery you get 28 modules together as a kit “can you call 28 modules outside the housing individuals, that is you call” you get all 28 modules with the hardware for you to install it in you old battery housing and on the other hands Toyota give you everything new including new housing and without the hassle of having to remove and reinstall modules and for the same price on some locations as mentioned before, the only positive advantage I can see using the newprusbattery kit is you can sell you old modules to reduce the price of you new kit but at a cost of compromising the reliability on the long run, because you getting a inferior aftermarket battery modules.
     
    #37 Frank1234, Oct 19, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  18. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Under $1600 must be mythical. We found nobody who got one for a claimed $1625. Dealers can choose not to sell just the pack and they will not ship.
     
  19. Frank1234

    Frank1234 Member

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    Will depend on you location in my case they will sell it for $1579 41/2 hours drive each way to a total of 9 hours drive or my option 2 $1699 1 hour drive each way to a total of 2 hours drive I talked to both places they will sell the battery to me the only problem is that if that is you only car you can’t take the core on hand with you at the time of purchase and you probably don’t want to travel again to drop the core so you may end up doing the job on the parking lot by the dealer and if something go wrong you may be stranded far away from home, not a problem for me I have 3 vehicles.
    Something else my local dealer will sell it to me for under $1995 but all those prices are before tax to be fear.
     
    #39 Frank1234, Oct 19, 2020
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
  20. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Our experts here strongly recommend you keep the core until the new one is installed any to be sure you kept all the necessary pieces. Otherwise you would need to purchase some new parts too.
     
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