Going Volt this time around.

Discussion in 'GM Hybrids and EVs' started by 928Quest, Nov 23, 2017.

  1. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    must be traveling for the long weekend.
     
  2. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    Not too unusual, there's been many times someone started a thread complaining about their car (most times their first post) and then, never heard from again.
     
  3. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    I looked at the Volt a couple times and I still can't get past the lack of room in the back seating area. Now if it were just me and my wife, that's a different story. However, still have one kid to haul around ( although he starts driving in Febuary! )..Yippee!
     
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  4. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    The purpose of that feature is to prevent the wheels from spinning. If it is ineffective, that's a problem.
     
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  5. San_Carlos_Jeff

    San_Carlos_Jeff Active Member

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    The Volt has a lot of different variables and also an overriding two year time limit. In 5 years my oil life has never gotten gotten to the "change me" zone before two years, and at 2 years it automatically triggers a change request. So I've changed it twice in ~80k miles of driving.
     
  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Our latest Honda with maintenance minder, didn't have that, but did have a proviso in the owner's manual, that in low usage scenario, regardless of what the maintenance minder displayed, change the oil yearly.

    The MM also shows codes for other services as well, basically it replaces the traditional maintenance schedule. The format is letter, either A or B, and then number(s), say A1, which would be oil change and tire rotation. Note also, A is oil change, B is oil and filter change, and they alternate.

    upload_2017-11-26_8-19-49.png
     
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  7. DjGruv

    DjGruv Junior Member

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    Hope you have a extended warranty. Volts are known for having problems and bad customer service. I'll never go back to Chevy or Ford

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  8. Zythryn

    Zythryn Senior Member

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    I know what you mean about Chevy. That said, the first Gen Volt had a very solidly good rep. Our personal experience with it was outstanding.
    I have heard of more issues, bringing it into the realm of about as reliable as the typical car, with Gen 2.
    That said, I would never recommend and extended warranty except with a new manufacturer.
    We bought the extended warranty with our first Tesla, but not since, or before. Just not worth the money.

    Agreed.
    My guess is he was mistaken. I tried spinning the wheels in both the Gen 1 and Gen 2 Volt. The only way I could was to turn off traction control.
     
    #28 Zythryn, Nov 29, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 29, 2017
  9. Aaron Vitolins

    Aaron Vitolins Senior Member

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    You've gotta be joking!

    The Volt may have had a few glitches early on, but over all the big ticket items are rock solid! Once of the most over engineered cars of modern times.

    Unlike 2010+ up Prii, Volts don't burn oil, clog EGR systems, headgasket failures, or inverter failures.

    I've been around the block with Prii I know them in and out, I've owned four and have many friends and family with them. Good cars, just don't try to put down a really good car.

    I don't own a volt, personally it wouldn't work for me, too small.
     
  10. eman08

    eman08 Active Member

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    At least the Volt still has an oil dipstick as the oil change timer reminds me of Bimmers relying on some stupid electronic sensor with no oil dip stick. It just stupid to remove the oil dipstick from a car as there's no way of knowing the condition of the oil. What if that sensor goes out, then how would you check your oil level? It's just bad designs. One reason why I steer clear away from German cars as they are complicated money pit machines.

    In general oil gets dirty faster when you're driving in the city with all the cold starts, stopping and going. It's more wear on the engine driving in the city compared to highway driven cars. When you're on the highway you are going at a consistent speed for long periods of time as the oil doesn't get as dirty.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  11. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    Ahh, that's just the usual suspects continuing the FUD. The Volt has no issues with traction control (sigh......). Yes, my 2012 could easily chirp the inside tire (briefly) in a turn from a stop. My Energi can do the same before TC kicks in.

    Nothing to see here folks, move along.
     
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  12. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    Back on topic ( I think? ). Another reason I didn't like the Volt is the lack of highway MPG. The use case for the Volt doesn't seem to be as a highway vehicle. I like the Prime's solution much better.
     
  13. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    I've owned many GM cars with TC and have never had a problem where it didn't perform as designed.
     
  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    By coming to market earlier, the Volt carries a higher MSRP. The new Clarity PHV is a little less, and I don't think it costs GM the same to make a compact car as Honda pays for a midsize. Some shoppers won't dig deep past the MSRP to see the deals available. Final cost is comparable to the Prime, but only if the buyer has the tax burden to take advantage of the full $7500 credit. So the Prime is a better buy in terms of cost for most plug in shoppers.

    Then the Bolt is newer, shinier, and not much more than the Volt in terms of MSRP. The 200+ miles of range is more than most need, so the extra cost could be worth completely ditching the ICE. Then in California,the threat of the HOV stickers for PHEVs expiring always seems to loom. Even if PHEVs were kicked from the HOV lanes, BEVs would still have access.

    The main reason is the cheap gas that has had people going back to SUVs and larger vehicles. GM and Ford are offering great deals on even their traditional cars to balance out the trucks they sell for CAFE.

    Most cars allow the driver to easily turn TC off, and some prefer driving that way. Giving owners the option was an improvement for the gen4 Prius.

    Having it come up on dash like that sounds like a step up from GM's in that regard. In the manual, it says do this every even time the OLM alert comes up, and then do this additional stuff every other one, with a one page chart for the longer interval stuff like spark plugs, transmission fluid, coolant, and timing belts.

    The majors all part owner's manuals PDFs online, and GM's are pretty comprehensive.

    I came to age on '80s and '90s Chevies and Fords, and don't recall any of our cars having any major manufacturer based issues. A friend did have a Pontiac Grand Am that could have been covered by lemon law, so I know the American's reputations weren't undeserved. A friend also had a Hyundai around that time, so I'm emotionally hesitant when considering them now even though the metrics say they have vastly improved. I doubt he'll reconsider them.

    The Sonic had some issues. Though not as serious, so did my 2005 Prius. The dealer and manufacturer of both fixed them without giving me gruff. The Sonic water pump has a free extended warranty on it from GM because it was problemsome during that time.

    The dipstick for transmission has disappeared on my recent GMs though.

    Oil getting dirty isn't what results in the need for a change. It is the depletion of two main additives. The first are the antiseize compounds that protect the engine from momentary metal to metal contact, important for cold start ups. GM's OLM is based upon known consumption rates for a commonly used compound under different engine conditions.

    The other is the base package that neutralizes acids. The acids naturally form when degraded oil and contaminant bits mix with water. Short trips use them up faster as less water is boiled off the oil. The switch to ultra low sulfur gasoline will also reduce the amount of acids formed, so we should see our oil change intervals get extended in the future in the US.

    Well, I can no longer say "remove the Prius tinted glasses" these days with more models getting 50mpg ratings, but when compared what cars are mostly selling in the US, the Volt still gets better fuel economy. Then when looking at PHEVs, the MPG is not the important metric, it is the fuel used per week, month, or year. The Volt's EV range can go a long way in reducing that.

    With current batteries, and EV range of 20 to 30 miles seems to provide the best balance between cost and space compromise. If only Toyota hadn't half assed the Prime's battery packaging.
     
  15. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Then it wouldn't be affordable with tax-credit subsidies... the very big problem Volt is about to face.
     
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  16. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    The federal tax credits is based upon battery capacity, and has no bearing on how the battery is packaged within the car. Stick the Prime's battery on the roof, and it gets the same amount in credit.

    The Prime loses about 6 cubic feet of cargo space in comparison to the Prius Two Eco. This is the like comparison because both aren't equipped with a spare tire. That is about the same amount lost between the C-max and the Energi. One of those models is built upon an ICE platform, retains the rear middle seat, and is a company's first PHEV to market. The other uses a hybrid platform, and is the company's second PHEV to market.

    Since the Volt was mentioned, the Prime would have been better served by using a T-shape battery like the Volt if the original plan was 4 seats. This would have shifted the car's center gravity closer to the center and lower for better handling, while retaining more cargo space. Since the gen2 Volt manages to add a "STFU, here's your fifth seat"*, Toyota shouldn't have a problem keeping the arm rest and storage bin.

    If cost is the priority, Toyota should have started with a PHEV for the platform. The major change would simply have been to replace the cargo area's bottom pan with a spare tire well with a mostly flat one down to the same depth. This would have given more space to better package the battery, instead of having that 4 inch gap of space under the pack the Prime has now. Prii without a spare tire equipped would have gained a little bit more cargo space. Those with a spare would just need to use more Styrofoam than they do now, or perhaps get more inventive with cargo cubbies.

    *I should trademark this.
     
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  17. john1701a

    john1701a Prius Guru

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    Clearly, you haven't been following the discussions. That would have significantly increased cost.

    MSRP speaks for itself. That's what matters for high-volume sales.
     
  18. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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  19. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    If I had used that reasoning, from past experiences my dad had with Toyotas, I would never had purchased the Prii. ;)
     
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  20. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Please explain how.
    The costs of developing a car platform are going to be fairly fixed no matter the vehicle type; salaries, modeling time, physical testing, etc. are only going to increase in cost in the event that issues arise.
    If gen4 development had started with a PHEV design, how would that have increased development costs over starting from a hybrid?
    What about a PHEV prioritize frame would require a greater increase in cost than going from hybrid to PHEV?

    The only way I see it costing more is if they already started with the hybrid, and would have switched to the PHEV. Which means Toyota read the market trends wrong.
     
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