Has anyone installed the enginer PHEV?

Discussion in 'Prius PHEV Plug-In Modifications' started by alevinemi, May 28, 2009.

  1. toddwking

    toddwking Average Joe

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    No, Eddiem is right - I asked them and they said not to post since it is copyrighted. But it's probably not too hard to get a hold of it - just go to the ebay auction and request it.
     
  2. kiettyyyy

    kiettyyyy Plug-In Supply Engineer

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    Okay. Just got my paycheck, ordering it by the end of the week.
     
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  3. Anthonyata

    Anthonyata New Member

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    Just got my kit today. Installing next week.
    User manual needs to be redone and clarified.
     
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  4. erev

    erev Junior Member

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    Hey,

    I have read your posts about the enginer conversion with much interest!
    There is a similiar discussion in the biggest German Prius forum

    priusfreunde.de/portal/index.php?option=com_joomlaboard&Itemid=68&func=view&id=83375&catid=13

    But of course there has been no one who did conversions here in Germany yet.
    So I am very curious about the results of your enginer conversion activities!
    Please report!!

    erev
     
  5. hobbit

    hobbit Senior Member

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    I just glommed onto this thread. That manual posted earlier
    looks VERY prerelease, but if these folks are at HF I'll be very
    interested in talking some theory with them...
    .
    _H*
     
  6. erev

    erev Junior Member

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    Here are some more information on the kit. Especially there are some points adressing the critical aspects brought up by "Flying White Dutchman":

    So it seems you do not have that much control over the system (status) but to my minde the system should work safely under every circumstance. Other opinions?

    => As I understand it, the OEM battery should also put out energy in parallel so you should get a reliable longer low-speed EV-range - right?
     
  7. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    I would really like you all to take time to talk to the Enginer guys find out more about them. I don't know any more than you guys do at this point, but I figure by the end of the weekend you'll have plenty to share with us all.

    If you like the product, be sure to tell them. If you don't, be sure to share that feedback with them as well. Try to be constructive, though. I'm sure they would be open to it.

    Hybridfest GDE is definitely going to be the place for us to discover more about this product and the people behind it.
     
  8. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    so the GDE is next weekend.... well lets hope for some info and picture's
     
  9. Florian_steiper

    Florian_steiper Junior Member

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    Hello,

    The Manual is available for download from the enginer wiki-page....

    OK, I am too new to post links... great..

    www dot eaa-phev dot org slash wiki slash Enginer

    you'll figure it out :)

    ciao

    Florian
     
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  10. nveprius

    nveprius Junior Member

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    group buy?
     
  11. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    copy past?
    Enginer - EAA-PHEV
     
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  12. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    I will talk with them about a group buy at Green Drive Expo.

    Also I think we may see some video/interview from the event as well
     
  13. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    hi becky

    maybe you can aks some questions for me?

    if so i will post a list with things
     
  14. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    I want to know where the battery supplies are from. This company's origins in Detroit just have me imagining all sorts of things.
     
  15. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    Pat,
    You are now officially in charge of the list of questions.
    If you can keep them in one post, that'll make it easier for me to copy/paste.
    Fire away.
     
  16. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    pat???
    i am not from australia:D
     
  17. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    He is not becky either..................:rolleyes:
     
  18. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    lol.
    Sorry, Flying White Dutchman.
    Was not paying close enough attention.

    And mrbigh is correct.. my name isn't becky... it's Eric.

    Soooooo now that that's all cleared up, Flying White Dutchman, can you please start the list?
     
  19. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    well.. whatever:rolleyes:
    :D

    Here my peace of text about The Enginer PHEV kit
    -----------------

    All Prius PHEV conversions to date, whether home-brewed, made by small outfits, or by large corporations, rely on changing the reported SOC. This can be by spoofing with a dummy SOC message immediately after a genuine one, or by replacing the genuine SOC message completely, or by raising the OEM battery pack voltage to the point that the OEM battery ECU artificially raises the reported SOC in its SOC drift mode (as in any CalCars type approach)

    The Enginer PHEV kit applies a DC-DC converter output across the OEM
    pack, with the output limited to a maximum of 240v or 12A whichever
    comes first if my info is correct.

    This avoids the much greater inrush currents that any
    contactor approach causes, slapping a higher voltage pack across the OEM pack periodically. But it does limit the injected power to the output of the Enginer DC-DC converter, recently claimed on PriusChat as 2,880
    watts.

    According to the posted manual i don't see that the HV wire's go to the hall effect sensor ( current sensor ).
    maybe this is because of the low current that go's to the HV battery?

    This approach relies on the 12A that is injected, being greater than
    the current draw that the Prius is taking out, in order that there is an
    excess of charging current and so the OEM pack voltage may rise up to
    the ~240v level where the required SOC drift effect occurs.

    During steady state highway driving this is a common state where the current into/out of the Prius pack varies from second to second by only a small amount, often less than + or - 5A or so.
    In these circumstances the 12A injected is ample to raise the OEM pack voltage to near 240v which causes the battery ECU to issue a high SOC which in turn makes the HV ECU draw much more electric power from the battery which offsets gas use and increases mpg. All precisely as claimed.

    Now in low speed EV use, two different situations apply.
    The first is in city traffic with lots of start/stop at traffic lights,
    traffic jams etc, where the car is often stopped or moving very slowly.

    Here the average current drawn may well be less than 12A and so the
    Enginer DC-DC converter's 12A can again raise the OEM battery voltage up to 240v and allow continued EV use.

    The second is on quiet streets with no start/stops where a steady
    current is being drawn at a steady speed. What is crucial here is the
    amount of energy needed to sustain this mode.
    There are enough PHEV users who can attest that they can, if driving
    carefully under ideal conditions below 30mph achieve 160 watt-hours/mile (99 watt-hours/km) That is an average power consumption of ~4.8kw = 20-23amps

    Therefore in order to achieve continued EV operation you need to inject
    at least 4.8kw. If you do not, the current drawn exceeds the current
    injected and the pack voltage decays and so the SOC drift effect does
    not occur and the battery ECU instead does its normal mode of coulomb
    counting until it decides you are down to 40% SOC or so and shuts off EVmode and starts the ICE charging.
    It is unaware of any extra pack capacity so counts down assuming only the OEM pack capacity exists.

    Note that there are a number of PHEV enthusiasts who claim that even
    higher power is needed to sustain practical EV. Early on CalCars
    reported that you should aim for 40A if you truly wanted to avoid
    dropping out of EV mode.
    So my figure of 20A (4.8kw) is very conservative and requires very careful driving. I have tried on quiet roads to remain in EV mode with an average of only 12A and can only say it is extremely difficult.
    I do not think it is possible even under ideal flat no wind no traffic conditions to sustain 25mph with just 12A.

    It is more reasonable to expect a shorter period of EV, then a drop out
    during which the 12A can cause a recovery and then a return to EV at
    some point later, this cycle repeated until the pack is exhausted. If
    this is acceptable then expectations will have been met. But the idea of
    remaining in EV for the full distance without the ICE starting is not
    realistic.

    This should not be taken as a purely negative description of the Enginer
    kit. It appears a very well thought out design that is excellent value
    for money and with the minimum of installation complexity.
    Particularly on highway mixed-mode use and city stop and go, it should perform just as claimed.

    :)
     
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  20. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    Right now Jack and his crew are busy getting ready to come to Hybridfest Green Drive Expo so you probably won't hear anything from them until after the weekend.

    I did get a message stating they have a new web site, though.

    Enginer | Hybrid Plug In

    I don't have time to check it out right now, but I'll read through it later.

    Enjoy!
     
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