Head gasket?

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by bshef, Oct 28, 2018.

  1. bshef

    bshef Active Member

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    so, how much is typical engine swap out running these days.... I'm guessing roughly $2k?
     
  2. 05PreeUs

    05PreeUs Senior Member

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    When the coils fail, the fuel is still injected, but not ignited therefore washing down the cylinder walls; that is NEVER a recipe for long engine life. When the failed coil is replaced, it does not undue the damage from wash-down of course, but it also does not mean that the coil was not the cause of the problem just because the cylinder is damaged.
     
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  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    A lot of good points sir. :oops:
     
  4. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Common causes for misfires on gen2 cars are related to bad injectors and bad coils.

    But you have burning oil and losing coolant. So you're driving on borrowed time, a newer engine will be needed soon.

    But keep in mind a 2005 will develop other problems as it ages..like paint issues, brake actuator issues, transaxle issues, etc. So once you go down the route of spending money on a 200k+ car, you might soon spend more than the car is worth
     
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  5. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Probably only worthwhile for someone with lots of tools, a hoist, prepared to their own engine swap. Even then...

    Have watched @Ragingfit 's engine swap videos, what a saga.
     
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  6. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    I've heard of people paying significantly more than that :eek:

    And others coughing up under half that amount :whistle:

    Heart Transplant at 278,000 miles | PriusChat
     
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  7. blaisep

    blaisep Junior Member

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    After a heartfelt conversation at Yarnell's in Mountain View, I came to the conclusion that the engine swap only makes sense if you're going to DIY the removal, reinstall.
    Around here, the labor will run about $2,300 and that does not include any parts.
    I'm only considering a rebuild because
    • I can do the work myself (still, a PITA)
    • I have a beat up F250 I can use to drive my engine over to the machine shop.
    • because there is a machine shop in town with a good reputation who will do a long block overhaul for $1500.
    • I'm the original owner and I would rather not take my chances with a used engine that might not be much better than my old one.
    • I am, as they say, between jobs.
     
    #27 blaisep, Oct 30, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2018
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  8. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    Nice approach. That's what I'd have done also. Overhauled that engine, myself than getting a used one. That way, I already have an idea of the state of replacement parts.
    Used engines are just a 50/50 thing!
     
  9. 05PreeUs

    05PreeUs Senior Member

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    To quote Walter, "H0LY [email protected]"! shops get $230/hr in your area!!!!! If so, I AM MOVING TODAY! Folks, swapping a Prius engine is like a 10 hour job, if you've done one before it's doable in under a work day. My god people charge a ton for little work!

    That is a fantastic reason to do it the way you have planned.
     
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  10. bshef

    bshef Active Member

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    Change in Plans.....
    After much research and consideration.
    We've decided to pay ($1500) for an engine swap on our 05 prius.....
    Looking to get another couple years out of the Prius....than sell and go Full electric with our next vehicle sometime in 2020ish.
    Thanks for all the advice/comments and suggestions!
     
    #30 bshef, Nov 2, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2018
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  11. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    After you have the new (used) engine installed and fully road tested, and if you don't mind sharing.. who is doing the swap and how many miles on the said engine?
     
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  12. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Is that $1500 the total? Seems really good; aren't salvage engines going for that kind of money, just the engine?
     
  13. 05PreeUs

    05PreeUs Senior Member

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    Oh no, you can get a running car in good shape for that price, it might have some rust or a failed HV pack, but there are $2k in parts on it even so. I see most Prius engines (G1/2) for sale in the $350-$500 range, there are obviously, outliers to that.
     
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  14. bshef

    bshef Active Member

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    friend found a shop advertising on Craigslist for 1500......I called and it turned out to be Ceasar at hybrid 911 in westminster......no frills no shrills......I dropped the prius off yesterday (Friday) and he said could probably pick it up next day. All Engines are machined locally, right up the street from his shop. Ceasar made it clear that all his engines have new waterpumps. He had probably 10 rebuilt engines, lined-up ready to go along the wall. Said they do about 2 or 3 engine swaps per day. I do not have the specs on the old (new) engine but will get all that info when I pick it up later today. I also asked him to flush the coolant from mine since it was last done at 100k.
     
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  15. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    It would be good to inquire about what “rebuilt” means, other than a new coolant pump. Considering the price, my guess is that the pump is going to be the only new part installed.
     
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  16. Chamutas

    Chamutas Junior Member

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    My 2010 Prius started shaking on start up just like you would think it’s a misfire. It only would happen when ICE starts after being parked for 20-30 min. After initial clutch rattle the car would drive normal without any other signs. I know little bit about cars so I thought well the car has 150k miles it’s probably a good time to replace spark plugs and see if that will fix my problem. Just like any person I started to eliminate simple and the least expensive problems. I replaced spark plugs with OEM iridium set from CarQuest, that set be back $50. Immediately after replacing them, the car was acting the same way with same rattle. So the next sensible step I ordered new aftermarket ignition coils and replaced them, still same problem. The next step I removed fuel injectors and cleaned them with carburetor cleaner and air blower with my compressor. Guess What - still no change, the engine still does shake and misfire when starting cold or after ICE was off for a 10 minutes. I asked a mechanic what could it be and he suggested to pay attention at coolant level and YES it was low. He said he have done a few taxi Prius head gaskets recently with around same mileage 120-150k miles.

    If engine misfires because of bad head gasket, what is happening is coolant is slowly dripping in to one of the cylinders while engine is off and on starting the engine that cylinder cannot ignite fuel for a few cycles until all the moisture is pushed out and causes engine to run on three cylinders and causes engine rattle.

    After trying all inexpensive ways to repair my car I came to conclusion that I might have the bigger problem and that was a failed head gasket. I was still driving my Prius for work every day and putting more miles on it. On daily drives I tried many different things like lower the pressure in cooling system by having coolant cap not tightened all the way. Having less pressure in radiator and cooling system would stop the coolant from entering the cylinder and eliminate engine shaking on startup but the engine would eventually “spit out” most of the coolant from system if the cap is not sealed all the way.

    I knew what I had to do, I knew that the “head job” was inevitable, but my job depend on my vehicle to make money and it just was going to be inconvenience to go rent a car for a week until getting mine repaired. After putting on another 20k miles on the car since initial signs of cylinder 1 misfire I was driving car to work as usual when I noticed a knocking sound when I apply more load to the engine when passing cars, on the freeway. The sound was like valve knocking. At that point I knew that this is the end of my free ride and I need to get to repair shop asap. I pulled to nearest exit and googled for the closest San Diego tow truck. All my trips are local so the tow wasn’t that much just about 13 miles to a mechanic shop.

    I paid for head gasket set $200, new set of head bolts $80, oil and coolant $80, paid machine shop for inspecting machining the head $200 and new OEM coolant pump $300. Plus cost of labor $800 and car rental.

    During tear down process my mechanic showed me that a little plastic ring-guide that guides the direction and flow of coolant had been broken off from the propeller of the pump and was stuck inside pump housing. It is very possible that this was the cause of the whole breakdown. If the flow of the coolant was not sufficient inside the engine block it could have caused just too much heat at the top of combustion chamber and it caused the gasket between cylinders 1 and 2 to fail.

    Since the electric coolant pump was working properly and spinning just like it should, the ECU did not register any trouble codes from the pump. If you look at the pictures of the pump, the attachment points of that ring to assembly are so tiny that it looks it’s just matter of time when they will crack and fail.

    The head gasket repair took 6 days. I towed my car on Friday and pick it up running on Thursday afternoon. If you are in San Diego, CA and have similar need for Prius head gasket repair I recommend Israel at Hernandes Mobile Auto Repair.

    Since the repair I have driven 12k miles and all is good. Car runs just like it should with no issues. I hope this helps you diagnose your problem or help you understand what is happening with your car.
     

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  17. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    From seeing the colouration of the head gasket, you'd definitely conclude that was the main cause. That broken plastic stuff aggravated the coolant temperatures to its extreme.
    Glad you're back on the road.
     
  18. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Though this was posted in a gen2 forum/thread, let me thank you for sharing.

    Since your mechanic had done this job a few times before, could you please ask if he has noticed this kind of pump failure in the past?

    Many here have replaced this gen3 water pump, curious if anyone else has noticed this "little plastic ring-guide" being loose or stuck.
     
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  19. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Seems like most everyone reporting here with misfire issues does remedies in that order,, and I can't recall one case where it didn't end up being the head gasket.

    Plastic water pump propellor, and the lack of an engine coolant display on the dash, don't help.

    How many miles on it?

    Has the EGR circuit been cleaned?

    Has the intake manifold been cleaned?

    Consider an Oil Catch Can install.

    EGR & Intake Manifold Clean Results | PriusChat

    Oil Catch Can, Eliminate that knock! | PriusChat
     
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