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Help Diagnose Electrical break down while driving?

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Technical Discussion' started by plastermaster, Jun 8, 2017.

  1. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    First the brake light came on after abut 1/2 mile of driving, (like the parking brake was on). I pulled over to check fluid but it was OK. Started up again and same thing after about 1/2 mile. Next a warning whistle came on along with the light. Then the brakes started behaving funny. The pedal felt hard and if I put on the brakes when creeping a few mph the brakes would make a bit of a grinding sound and the car would rock a bit. OK, enough on the brakes. I don't think the brakes are the problem but rather a symptom.

    Next the yellow warning lights come on a few minutes later. Then a minute later the red triangle lights up, Followed by a message on the main display, something about "locked" and "parked", (don't remember exactly). I checked to see if I was in park and no, I was in Drive. (I was still driving at this time). a few seconds later the car goes into neutral and I coast to a stop. all the green lights for fuel, gear mode etc are now blinking at me. I put on the emergency flashers and both are blinking but sometimes only one. I go outside and the blinkers are very dim.

    AAA comes and needs to be able to roll the car which has locked itself in Park once I turned off the power. He hooks a battery up to it to get me started (would not power up on its own) and it all looked fine. He followed me to my mechanic (where I was heading anyway LOL)

    I figured after all this it was just a bad 12V battery. After all the battery is going on 11 years and 215K miles!

    Today the shop calls me and tells me that the battery isn't testing all that bad, but just a little low, not low enough to cause the problems I experienced. They cannot reproduce the failure that I had. They did find a few stored error codes that indicated a low voltage situation. One was the ABS. The shop isn't convinced that the battery was the cause of the low voltage codes because the battery isn't testing bad enough. BTW the AAA guy didn't charge the battery, he just gave it a quick jump after which it sat all day and last night. Plan now is to replace the battery anyway and see if it happens again. I really want to avoid a repeat because I often drive up the Northern CA coast and have no cell reception and am hours away from a tow.

    Any ideas would be appreciated. One other thing is a couple times in the past few years I was driving and all the dash lights came on. I pulled over and powered down and when I started up again all was fine for another year or so. These events did not show up in future code checks.

    Thanks for reading! :)
     
  2. DonDNH

    DonDNH Senior Member

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    Start by replacing the 12V. Strange issues are well documented by a failing 12V battery.
     
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  3. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    If the battery isn't bad, then is it getting charged? I.e. has the inverter that charges it, started cutting out? This would explain the failure while driving.

    Try putting in a voltmeter. OBDII engine monitors (Scangauge and very many other newer products) will display the system voltage. But you can also get a simple voltmeter display that plugs into the 12V outlet. This will tell you whether or not the system is charging, and any intermittent problems will show up.

    Inverter cooling system problems can cause intermittent shutdowns.
     
    #3 fuzzy1, Jun 8, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2017
  4. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    That's the plan for now. I hope that takes care of it. Thanks for the encouragement that it might just be the battery. Thats my gut diagnosis too but maybe I'm just an optimist :)
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    agree with don above, many shops don't understand batteries. is it a toyota dealer? you need prius specific software to properly read trouble codes.
     
  6. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    Good point about the charging. I will give them a call and ask if they checked that.

    THanks!
     
  7. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    Its at a good shop but not a dealer so you might have a point there.
    Thanks
     
  8. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    I'd also point out that many traditional shops don't understand hybrids. This thread is about a Prius-specific issue, so should be addressed by someone experienced in Prius issues. The 12V charging system is very different than those of non-hybrids.

    At this age, the battery ought to be replaced even if it isn't the actual current problem. It will die someday, probably very soon, and nearly all its cohorts have already been melted down in the recycling smelter.
     
    #8 fuzzy1, Jun 8, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2017
  9. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    Yes it is being replaced as I write. But, really I was quite fond of that battery for lasting so long. I might just have to keep it on display somewhere in my house. LOL

    I called the Toyota dealer and he said that pretty much any shop has the ability to read and understand prius codes for the engine and hybrid system, and that the Prius specific codes that the dealer has are "body codes" (whatever that means). The dealers advise was that if the battery is replaced and no codes show up after clearing the codes and a good drive that I should be good to go.
     
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  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    unfortunately, when you call the dealer, the only persons who will talk to you are the incompetent service writers.
    although, i must admit, he got me with 'body codes'.
     
  11. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    I would second fuzzy1's question on how consistently the battery is charging. When the DC/DC converter is working properly, the voltage seen by the car's computers and components while in READY mode is not determined by the battery.

    -Chap
     
  12. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    If there is a charging issue, would that throw a code?
    Thanks
     
  13. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Various reasons for the DC/DC converter to shut itself down will be logged with codes in the HV ECU (where generic code readers often won't see them). That's only if the problem is somewhere the system can detect it. Some sort of intermittent wiring issue preventing charge voltage getting to the battery consistently might not be detected by the computer. As the battery voltage slowly declined, codes reporting low voltage reaching various components would start showing up.

    Your whole original description reminded me a lot of a drive home from Cleveland that I was making back in the '80s, where somewhere around Toledo my alternator failed. I did, in fact, make it the rest of the way home, with the heater fan and radio turned off to save juice, the lights getting gradually dimmer, and the engine just starting to run rough toward the very end. (I didn't live in Indiana then.)

    -Chap
     
  14. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    do not know. I'm defaulting to how I diagnosed a sporadic charging system problem in my spouse's 1989 car, just last year. The 12V outlet plug-in voltmeter was decisive.
     
  15. plastermaster

    plastermaster Junior Member

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    Thanks All for your helpful input. I have my car back with new battery, so we;ll see how it goes. Also finally after 215K miles it was time to replace the front brake pads. My sons Honda needs the every 30K or so and he drives with a light foot. Love that regenerative braking!
     
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  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    congrats, all the best!(y)
     
  17. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    Probably the inverter pump is not pumping well at all and the inverter is crowbaring. Put the car in ready and take the cap off the inverter coolant reservoir and with a flashlight look in at the coolant it should show very aggressive bubbling or movement. If no movement the pump has failed if very slight movement the coolant is worn out and needs to be replaced. Probably original coolant.

    First issue sounded like the abs unit failed. There's a tsb out for that free replacement.
     
  18. eman08

    eman08 Active Member

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    I would snatch up a copy of TechStream. It's the same software that Technicians use that charges you a $100 bucks for a scan diagnostic at the dealer. You can't do much with a genetic scan tool on these complex systems. I fixed my own airbag recall something I couldn't have done without it as the occupant sensor was out of calibration. But yes anything with ABS, you need a dealer level scan tool.

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