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HELP! please

Discussion in 'Generation 1 Prius Discussion' started by Shortcircut, Nov 10, 2021.

  1. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    Well I've owned this little jewel (2002 prius) for almost two years now and it having some problems at 75k miles.
    By my seat of the pants diagnosis is the ECU is confused. As the problem is the engine shuts down randomly at expressway or highway speeds. It does not seem to be getting consistent e-motor assistance unless I give enough throttle, much more than gentle accelleration. Under gentle throttle pressure it seems to be charging the battery.

    But while cruising at speed the engine shuts down and is relying on the E-motor which is not enough to keep things rolling. Putting the accellerator down the engine will refire and keep going, but without E-motor assist.

    I have kept the throttle at even pressure, but the vehicle slowed to the side of the road, without restarting until turning off the ignition and restarting. Then it goes along down the road.

    Please help as I really would like to avoid the steelership.

    Oh Yeah NO FAULT CODES???
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    just a thought, check the inverter pump
     
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  3. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    I did check that. But to bring you all up to date on my pet prius Gavin. Well let me explain my pet name for the Prius. It came from the City of San Fransico with only 55k miles. Wasn't uses much by them in 17 years. So I named it Gavin after the infamous Gavin Newsom. Some may say he doesn't do much either. Well now Gavin doesn't do anything either.

    I noticed some running problems in the past (shutting down). So I took it to the Hybrid doctor today. The report came back as the same as I mine with an OBDII scanner. No codes all good and batteries all in range. Picked it up and got about 2 miles. Then not only one but two TRIANGLES of DEATH lit up and it come to a slow roll and, well you know. On the slide-back tow truck and back to the Dr. I guess I will get another call in a couple of days. Should I see how much an indecent burial will be?
     
  4. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Who was the"hybrid doctor" and what did they use to scan for codes?

    If the triangle is lighting up, there are codes.
     
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  5. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    Well after the Death lite came on, there were codes. They are going to put an accelerator sensor in when received. He has quite the Russian accent so a little hard to communicate. He says 450 for a used one and 890 for a new one. I'm thinking bust loose for the new one and have no problems. I have a used one and it's the fail so. Evidently a very pricy item. I was quoted just over $700 at the local dealer and on line for Genuine Toy at around $500. Cheap car with very expensive parts, that are required. I think he's saying $890 installed and out the door, I hope. $890 plus labor on top time to tow it out I think. I can buy a lot of tools to add the shelf for that. As if I need more.

    Is this a common problem with the GEN I? He seems to think a used one will be fine, but mine is not obviously. Spare time is not on my side to do a pick n pull run. And it will have to be calibrated to computer, so.
     
  6. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    I just looked at some of the previous posts. I'm electing a new one. I'm gettin smoked for sure but. I
     
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  7. Stock808

    Stock808 Junior Member

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    Lookup big hand syndrome, sounds like the symptoms you’re experiencing. Basically the computer doesn’t know the position the gas pedal it’s in. Common issue with Gen 1 Prius given the age. Can be mistaken for sudden power loss, etc.
     
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  8. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    I will find out on Monday on how bad I'm getting smoked for this one. It's hard to communicate due to a language barrier with the shop. I think we're on the correct diagnosis, just not communicating on the estimate. $890 out the door for a new part is on the spot but $890 for the part plus labor is not going to swing well. I am going the new part rater than investing in the used one. He also mentioned that the part needed to be installed and then calibrated to the system. That part sounds like BS to me.
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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  10. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    Ju with sensors just a quick update. I picked up a couple of throttles today with sensors as they come from Toyota for $500 to $700.

    $18 and change at Pick n Pull. Here's what I think. Actual sensor looks just like other models of Toys. Just attached to the rest of the throttle peddle. High inventory of the throttle peddles alone, so attach a sensor to it and change the list price to $700.

    The saying used to be "Get your hands on a Toyota." Now its more like You Toyota has hands in your wallet.
     
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  11. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    let's go places!
     
  12. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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    Well she's running again but, GAME ON!

    Apparently I'm dealing with an unscrupulous repair facility. I picked it up today and went home and relaxed for a while had coffee. Went to look at the repair they did. Well not what expected. They put a used Throttle pedal sensor assembly in. Clearly I had asked for a new one rather than a used one. So off to California Bureau of Automotive repair. I could have had a chat with the shop but they clearly charged me for a new one, installed a used one and charged me for a new one. Carful out there in Sacramento CA.

    Moral to the story?
     
  13. Shortcircut

    Shortcircut Junior Member

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  14. landspeed

    landspeed Active Member

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    How are things going now? If you are getting this issue, it still really, really sounds like the inverter pump. This is exactly what happened to my Gen 1.5 (I bought it with a dead battery and only found out about the inverter pump later). It's going strong now.

    The symptoms were identical to what you had. If you were using the air conditioner, a clue would have been the air-con shuts off at a certain point (the inverter shuts off 'unnecessary' loads to try to prevent catastrophic overheating of the inverter). This happens even on Gen 1.5, because the air-con pump is mechanical, but draws a LOT of 12 volt current to engage the 'clutch' of the air-con compressor. However : don't use this as a diagnostic - this could still be 'too late'. On my car (and my Gen 2), when the inverter pump failed, they entered a strange 'mode' where the engine revs were high. It seemed like MG1 and MG2 were feeding current almost directly (it felt instinctively like a 'bypass' by the inverter, to reduce overheating of the transistors).

    The main question with regard to the inverter coolant pump : *DOES IT LOOK NEW* (or newer than the rest of the engine). That would be telling that the previous owner replaced it... the Gen 1.5 Prius is notorious for air getting trapped in the inverter coolant circuit when you replace the pump. If they didn't fully bleed the air using *both* the bleed valves, they you can get inverter fluid flowing with good turbulence, but the inverter itself has areas where the coolant isn't flowing at all!

    Don't try to bleed the inverter yourself - but obtain a container (maybe a litre or two) to fill with water. Obtain some fish-tank aquarium air-line tubing, perhaps 4 metres if it's cheap. Then (with advice from PriusChat) you can use these things to re-bleed the inverter coolant in case that is the issue.

    I agree with the posts saying 'don't get the Gen 1.5 as a daily driver'. It is a hobby car now, but also a great car. I keep a hobby charger in toolkit for my car, so worst case scenario I can rebalance an unbalanced part of the battery on the roadside to limp home.

    What you should get is a scan-tool. The OBD ones are good but a lot of the iOS software and even Android doesn't always work on the Gen 1.5 (at least not my one from Japan, but mine doesn't have an immobiliser so it is an odd one).

    The scan-tool you need, in fact which is *vital* to figure out what is going on, is something like this : Mini VCI for Toyota TIS Techstream V12.10.019 Single Cable J2534 Obd2 Minivci for sale online | eBay
    -> I'm not saying to get that particular listing. But the 'Mini VCI' with 'Techstream' is needed to diagnose problems. It is even needed for some service activities (like certain work on the brakes / brake pads).

    Along with the Mini VCI, you need a computer to plug it into. I managed to get it to work fine on Windows 7. The best option is a small, cheap laptop, with a working battery, and install Win7 on that. Techstream is Toyota software, so all the listings on eBay are actually 'pirated' copies of Toyota's software. This means high risk of viruses, malware, trojans... and quite possibly 'ransomware' these days. Running Techstream on a 'dirty' laptop only used for techstream is a way to keep your home computer safe. It is possible to use a 'virtual machine' to get the job done. This is Windows 7 running in a window on your computer desktop. This is useful if you have a macBook or something.

    I'll check my messages and if you reply here I should be able to give more info (I've been away a lot due to the pandemic, but will be around more from now on).