HV Battery Rebuild - Success Rate

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by Usman Afzal, Jan 11, 2018.

  1. Usman Afzal

    Usman Afzal New Member

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    Hi Friends,
    I recently got battery deterioration / Check hybrid system code on my 3rd gen 2010 prius.
    I have been looking for battery rebuild and reconditioning for sometime and i figured out my block 3 and 4 have lower voltage then other cells. I want to ask you guys what success rate you get from rebuild battery.

    How much time rebuilt battery continue to work after replacing faulty modules?
    I get feeling that if cells are dying in battery pack those will keep dying since they have done with their cycles and life.

    If anyone has experience with rebuilding battery pack with brand new cells from china.any success with those cells?

    What balance charger do you recommend for battery reconditioning. I am considering hobby king quattro. If there are any better options.
    Any DIY reconditioning guide or thread if you can refer.

    Thanks for helping out.
     
  2. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

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    Do not waste your time buying prismatic modules from Asia. The have not shown to be reliable with the car.

    If you choose to buy cylindrical cells, there is a kit being sold by a member on this board 2k1Toaster. Approx $1600 including shipping and 2 year warranty.

    Else you can check with Toyota for a new battery.

    You are correct if part of you battery is failing now, other parts will likely fail opposed to the ones you replace. Kind of like a game of whack a mole. Fix this, but then that breaks.

    You might get a month, maybe half a year, maybe longer. But in general you can't necessarily rely on your car. No big deal if you have another car or don't really need a reliable car.

    Each time you rebuild your pack your car will be down for a stretch of time. A couple of weeks if you have a hobby charger and want to do all your modules. But you will get good at it. Do it as long as it is fun for you.

    Feel free to call if you want to talk through ideas.
     
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  3. Civiceg94

    Civiceg94 Member

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    How about building a 18650 battery ? Like how the tesla battery are built
     
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  4. Usman Afzal

    Usman Afzal New Member

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    I also heard Li-Po battery in prius 4th generation is long life battery and voltage is almost same as 3rd generation. It would be great if these are replaceable and one can source from salvage vehicle.
     
  5. Civiceg94

    Civiceg94 Member

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    If am not mistaken if those are what am thinking. I heard they are pretty heavy.
     
  6. Usman Afzal

    Usman Afzal New Member

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    Nop those are lighter then Ni-Mh batteries.
     
  7. Civiceg94

    Civiceg94 Member

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    I though 3gen dont use those unless the plug in uses different batteries
     
  8. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    I think the 2016 Prius was the first Lithium Ion in the USA.

    I saw Li-po mentioned above and they are a little different chemistry..
     
  9. Civiceg94

    Civiceg94 Member

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    Lifepo4 cells are the ones i had pictured in my mind
     
  10. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    The problem with lithium cells as a replacement for nickel cells is that the battery management system doesn't know how to deal with lithium. Mess up the charging algorithm for lithium cells and you'll have a fire - just ask Boeing...
     
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  11. Civiceg94

    Civiceg94 Member

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    I need to go and check what kind of battery my plug in has.
     
  12. Usman Afzal

    Usman Afzal New Member

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    each lipo cell comes with current protection and if one replace full battery the battery ecu will be changed so no need to worry about charging algorithm.
     
  13. Usman Afzal

    Usman Afzal New Member

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    Well we left behind main question asked by me, How much time rebuild battery run without giving another battery error?
     
  14. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    You got your answer by Eric:

    If your time is free and modules are plentiful, then feel free to play whack-a-mole. If you want a car to you know... drive... then buy a new battery of some kind. The Toyota original pack has also lowered in price recently in the US. Might be able to get a deal on a new one out there. I will ship mine to the Middle East as well. The ones I've shipped to Jordan have been about $300 extra. If you have a US freight forwarder, I will ship there for free.
     
  15. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    I suspect that the lithium and NiMh batteries in 2016/2017 Prius are interchangeable, but I've haven't seen any actual experience with a swap. Putting a 2016/2017 lithium battery in an earlier Prius is quite another matter. The cases are a different shape, and who knows about the connectors. Maybe the engine ECU firmware was changed to support the newer batteries. Definitely an experiment at best.
     
  16. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    They are completely different "under the hood". May look the same outside, but there is nothing in common. Charging profiles, temperature management, etc.
     
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  17. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    But the battery module includes the management ECU for the installed cells. If I were Toyota, I'd hide the cell difference behind the ECU. But I'm not...
     
  18. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    Yes, agreed. I misunderstood then. I thought it was suggested to make a new pack out of 18650 cells from scratch, ala Hymotion style. There was at least another member on here who tried without changing the management. Never heard from them again. Hopefully didn't die in a vehicle fire...

    But there is a chance the other ECUs would reject it too. I've never tried on a Prius though. But in the Leaf putting a new pack in requires ECU updates and pairing and some will refuse the pair, like putting a 30KW pack in a 24KW Leaf.
     
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  19. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    18650 cells sound like a viable alternative. All you need is the Toyota communication protocols, a custom battery management ECU, and enough knowledge to design the charging/cooling system. Toyota is clearly watching the competition, and ready to reduce their prices enough to not let it get out of hand.
     
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  20. Usman Afzal

    Usman Afzal New Member

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    Lipo batteries are more power dense and if protected with current overload and discharge protection can be more power delivering then NI-Mh. Since current 4th gen Prius is offering choices between ni-mh and lipo it make me assume these are swap-able in same gen Prius.
     
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