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HV battery

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by rosner, Jan 22, 2019.

  1. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    Hi all,
    I took my 2010 prius to the annual check and they found yhe code P080A saying the HV battery needs a replacement.
    It was a shock because everything works fine. average fuel consumption as usual.
    After two days, suprisingly, I got the yello triangle and the HV system was dead.

    After investigating the web I decided to take the battery apart and see whats worng.
    I found the copper plates full with corrosion. Cleaned them and put everything back inplace.
    Got the OBD2 reader and Dr Prius app - yellow triangle gone, no error codes - all good.
    However the Dr Prius battery test shows the Battery is about 30% capacity.
    Attached are some screenshots from the app.

    The voltage distribution between max and mon about 0.5 volts. Is it ok?
    Do i need to replace pack #6/7 ?
    How reliable is the Dr prius app lofe expectancy test?

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Screenshot_20190122-133019_Dr Prius.jpg 20190119_112247.jpg 20190119_092956.jpg 20190119_112247.jpg
     
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  2. tankyuong

    tankyuong Senior Member

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    I would use a multimeter and check every module individually. Replace the ones with the biggest difference
     
  3. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    While that sounds logical........there should be some lower limit where they don't NEED to be replaced until they go that low.

    And I am of the opinion that when you have to replace the second one, you should do them ALL. That is if you are doing it yourself.

    Most of the reports here indicated that it isn't worth your time and money to buy a rebuilt battery because it is likely to fail again soon if only the bad cells are replaced.
     
  4. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    I check each individual cell unloaded and loaded. they all seem to function properly. The difference between Max and Min is 0.2 Volt both loaded and unloaded.

    The question is - what is the threshold for the system to indicate a failed battery?
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    well done o/p!(y)
     
  6. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    Take the "30% capacity" with a grain of salt. The "Dr. Prius" app is not really that scientific. It can show good data, but it is easy wrong and manipulated. So, good data point but not gospel.

    Your pack shows the classic signs of heat death. The middle of the pack, where the heat gets stuck, is degraded far worse than the outsides of the pack. This is the most common and most classic case of a bad battery.

    500mV of difference between the highest and lowest while not good, is far from the worst it can be. You may be able to extend that pack with a Prolong type system. I don't think it is too far gone for that to be of help.

    And you are correct, if you go with a whack-a-mole solution or a rebuild pack, you'll be back. New pack is the correct long term answer. If the car drives fine now, I would use this time to think about what you want to do.

    If you want to trade in the car do so in the next few months. If you want to keep the car, then for how long? If you want to keep it for another decade then buy a new battery. If you want to keep it for a year or two and you have infinite time (retiree that loves working on cars for example) then playing whack-a-mole may work for you.
     
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  7. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    Thanks alot for this answer.
    Is there a way to increase the ventialtion in order to minimize the heat effect?
    And what do you mean by "Prolong Type System"?
     
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    hybrid automotive.com
     
  9. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    Yes, lower fan on temp on Dr Prius.
     
  10. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    So the car rides Ok but now I see that MPG is around 38 (mostly city). And it happened twice that after driving in EV mode I get the yellow message Check Hybrod System. I than open Dr prius and see that Delta%SOC is high and red (above 8%). I use the app to clear the error and restart the car. It happens only after EV mode.
    I attach another screenshot of another app.
    Iguess I need to change Block 6 and 7.
    Do I need also balancing? And how can I do it without paying 700usd for prollng euipment?
    Or, will it be enough just to balance without replacing cells? Screenshot_20190126-180142.jpeg Screenshot_20190126-180156.jpeg Screenshot_20190124-120711_Dr%20Prius.jpeg

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  11. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    You have a dead HV pack. I don't understand why you're surprised things don't look good and you're getting errors...

    If your goal is a temporary quick fix or your time is worth $0/hr, then go ahead and change out the 2 battery modules and balance everything up. You'll be back in there before Spring starts but the car will be back on the road. It's all tradeoffs. I personally hate doing repairs of the same thing over and over again, but I also value my time very highly.

    You can balance with a lightbulb and a multimeter if you have the skills, time/patience, and ability. Lightbulb as current limit to charge and as a discharge. This is not recommended especially if this is your first rodeo. There exist cheaper NiMH chargers made mostly for remote controlled vehicles and you can generally do one battery module at a time (6 cells in series). Assuming it takes about 8 hours to do a couple charge and discharge cycles (which is what balancing partly is) that's 224 hours of work from a single charger. Over 9 days if you have them going 24 hours a day and will babysit it every 8 hours-ish to swap the next module. One of the reasons why if you go cheap, it is recommend to buy multiple cheap chargers. Now you've spent $200 for a lot of manual labour that will buy you a few months.

    If you're keeping the car, that is just completely wasted money when you buy a real brand new battery.
     
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  12. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    Thanks. All i need is several months to be able to replace is with another toyota.
    And I am going to use the Hybridautomotive prolong system which is charging rlthe pack rather than each cell.
    Hope it will give me enough time.
    Thanks

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  13. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    I did a Load test with H4 bulb (55W) for 120 seconds.
    1. Do I need to replace any of the cells?
    2. Will the Charging/Discharging/Balancing (with the hybrid automotive prolong system) fix the system?
    3. Do I need to do both (Replace and Balance)?

    Thanks

    Load test - Eylon.jpg
     
  14. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    you can probably resuscitate it with a model charger
     
  15. rosner

    rosner Junior Member

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    Do you mean using something like Prolong Charger from Hybrid-automotive?
     
  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    prolong would do the entire battery at once. a model charger does one module at a time iirc. they are priced accordingly
     
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  17. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

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    I’d argue the model charger is more expensive if you factor time and money into the equation ;).

    That’s why I invested in the Prolong equipment (y).
     
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  18. sam spade 2

    sam spade 2 Senior Member

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    And I would "argue" that if you think you can materially affect individual cells properly by doing anything to the whole battery, you are just fooling yourself. By that, I mean "rejuvenating" an individual cell without connecting directly to only that cell.
     
  19. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i won't argue with anything cause i know nothing but what i read here
     
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  20. The Critic

    The Critic Resident Critic

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    If you are only keeping the car for several months, I would replace the affected modules and hope for the best. Why bother with the reconditioning?