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I scanned my Prius to death /!\

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by goldfinger, Oct 3, 2013.

  1. goldfinger

    goldfinger Active Member

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    I was pulling out of my work parking lot today when all of a sudden my car just stopped working. I coasted into a parking spot and didn't touch anything. All the gear indicator displays were blinking, but it was like being in neutral with the engine off. I have an OBD scanner connected and Torque on a Nexus 7, but I wasn't using them at the moment or so I thought. I pulled out the tablet and scanned for error codes. There was one, U0293 - Lost Communication With Hybrid Powertrain Control Module. I pulled the code scanner out and turned the car off and back on. Now I have red triangle, but the gear indicator is not blinking. I drove the car around awhile and it seemed fine. I plugged the scanner back in and checked for error codes again. Now I two more, U0100 - Lost Communication With ECM/PCM "A" and P0A1D - Hybrid Powertrain Control Module. I cleared all of the error codes and drove around some more. All seems fine.

    I recently purchased a highly recommended OBDlink mx from Scantools. This one is supposed to be well designed and high quality. They claim you can leave it plugged in all the time. I have had it plugged into the car for several weeks now without issue, although I usually don't have the tablet with me. Torque has a settings option for just this scanner to allow high speed scanning. I had my tablet closed which turns off the display, but I had been running Torque on the way to work. I was specifically scanning codes related to the battery (thanks usbseawolf2000).

    So what happened? Did I over scan my can, is the scan tool suspect, or is this just a 1 in 10,000 fluke that I should just ignore? I read on another thread that if the ECU doesn't hear from the battery controller within 0.68 seconds it will throw this error code.

    Thoughts, opinions, or even expert advise welcome. Thanks.

    2005 Prius with nav
    122,000 miles
    original 12v battery

    Scan tool: OBDlink mx

    Codes:
    U0293 - Lost Communication With Hybrid Powertrain Control Module
    U0100 - Lost Communication With ECM/PCM "A"
    P0A1D - Hybrid Powertrain Control Module
     
    Tomass 2 likes this.
  2. dorunron

    dorunron Senior Member

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    You have probably heard this before, but it might be a good idea to check the 12 volt auxiliary battery. Prius is well known to throw weird codes and do odd things when the 12 volt is going bad. You also state your battery is original. Eight (8) years is a long life time for a battery.

    I mention this because our Prius did some really stupid stuff. Battery was original. Tested it, found it was weak. Replaced with a new one. Problems went away and have not returned.

    Click on the link in my signature (Test the battery), then please post all three (3) values. Also please only run the test after the car has set overnight to remove any residual surface charge.
     
  3. jdcollins5

    jdcollins5 Senior Member

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    There was another thread just the other day about the OBDII device causing similar codes. I would just ignore it for now.
     
  4. 2009Prius

    2009Prius A Wimpy DIYer

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    OBD2 scanning shouldn't cause any problem. I run PriiDash daily which scans much faster than Torque (difference between wired and wireless). It's been almost three years and I yet to see any issue caused by the scanning. The CAN bus already has ~ 1600 lines/sec of traffic constantly flowing whenever the car is on (so called passive messages). Scanning at highest possible rate moves that number up to ~ 1800. The capacity of the CAN bus is orders of magnitude higher IIRC.
     
  5. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    Disconnect the negative cable from the 12v battery for a couple of minutes to reset the computers. Hopefully the code(s) will go away and not return. You will have to reset your radio presets and the auto-close feature on the driver's window.

    JeffD
     
  6. goldfinger

    goldfinger Active Member

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    dorunron, here are my auxiliary battery values you asked me to take. Headlights, air, and radio were off for all readings.

    ACC mode 12.1v
    Ignition on 11.9v
    Ready mode 14.1v

    I drove around a little while in service mode. The voltage dropped to 13.4v all of sudden, but returned to 14.0v after I parked.

    I'm still driving around with my scanner and Torque with no further issues.
     
  7. dorunron

    dorunron Senior Member

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    Thanks for the info. Your number's are not bad, they are just weak. Somewhere down the road you probably will need to replace the 12 volt.

    FYI, a new fully charged AGM type battery will read the following running the test you did.

    ACC Mode 12.6 Volts or higher
    IGN Mode 12.4 Volts or higher
    Ready Mode 13.8 to 14.2

    Hope this helps. Best of luck to you.
     
  8. goldfinger

    goldfinger Active Member

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    I did it again. Same codes, red triangle, was able to limp off road after restart. Clearing the codes fixed everything. This is the third time now.

    I hadn't used the code reader for months, but decided to see how my battery's delta v was doing. I scanned all the way to work (40 minuts) with no problems. Later with the reader plugged in to the port, tablet off, but in the car, it coded on me. I saw VSC and minutes later ABS lights come on and then triangle while I was sitting at a stop.

    I can drive around for months with the reader plugged in so long as I don't have the tablet in the car. Actively scanning with Torque seams OK to. The problem only happens when the tablet if off, but in the car.

    Based on comments in this thread I replaced my 12v last fall with the Optima. Checked it this morning after sitting all night.

    ACC mode 12.4v
    Ignition on 12.1v
    Ready mode 14.1v

    I now have 130k on the car. my tablet is a nexus 7. Other installed apps include Elm and Diag my Toyota. Obviously I know how to avoid the problem, but not why it occurs. Could the OBDlink mx be defective? If I had bought a $15 doller China clone reader I would blame this. Could my car's can bus be marginal? Does the nexus 7 do weird things in it's sleep?

    Ideas or similar experiences appreciated.
     
  9. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    It's obviously corrupting the Can. Too much polling? I'm almost positive I saw another post about this a while ago. Same symptoms.
     
  10. Prius_Cub

    Prius_Cub Member

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    Sounds like Torque on your tablet is setup to auto-detect the protocol. You should set it under the vehicle profile to use ISO 15765-4 CAN 11bit 500k baud.

    I ran into the random ABS VSC lights on occasion until I set it to the correct ISO protocol. I just wouldn't leave Torque running when powering the car off because Torque on my tablet seems to default back to auto-detecting when it loses connection with the ECUs and can trigger the warning lights.

    HTC Evo 3D
     
  11. Former Member 68813

    Former Member 68813 Senior Member

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    Yep, I had one and and posted about in gen 3 forum. I also saw several more threads. People just don't do searches anymore these days. not sure why.
     
  12. ccdisce

    ccdisce Active Member

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    I have seen this problem before, it is a sinking feeling when the dashboard lights up like a Christmas tree, the ICE shuts off and you cruse to halt to your parking spot because you have somehow glitched the CAN Buss...whew
    The computers have abandoned the CAN Buss, following the 'Buss-off'' protocol, waiting for you the undo whatever you did wrong.

    The 'auto protocol detect' that the interface chips use seem to cause problems, I have noticed this, and others have noticed this also.
    Problems also occur with the vaunted SGII so much so that they will send you a new cable with the PWM/VPW pins used by ford/gm removed but I do not think that it will fix the issue.
    You may need to change the CAN terminator/filter/driver arrangement to an ARNIC compliant driver, surge suppress the CAN lines, minor cap terminate and /or possibly Vcc/2 normalize the CAN lines.

    Good luck.
     
    Silver Pine Mica likes this.
  13. ftl

    ftl Explicator

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    Perhaps because the search hasn't been working very well for quite a while :(

    Better to do a google search starting with:

    site: priuschat.com (remove the space)

    followed by what you're looking for.
     
  14. goldfinger

    goldfinger Active Member

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    Prius_cub, thank you. I've set the protocol to ISO 15765-4 CAN 11bit 500k baud per your suggestion.

    Other Torque settings I have are faster communication and power savings which are both specific to the OBDlink mx. I'll play with these if the protocol doesn't fix it.

    I searched the gen 3 forums, which I never do. Sure enough same problems, CANtamination. There's a generic forum for OBD2 apps. Maybe there should be a forum for OBD2 hardware or common problems.

    This seems to be wide spread problem, not just Toyota.
    I'm bummed wondering if this tech is really ready for use while driving. If an after market device can upset braking and engine function someone could get killed. Auto makers should isolate the consumer OBD2 bus from anything critical. Said isolation would limit bus traffic giving priority to things like the brakes. It would be ironic if one of those insurance dongles causes a crash.

    I'll report back after some careful driving.
     
  15. 2009Prius

    2009Prius A Wimpy DIYer

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    I have been scanning daily on every trip with my own software running both OBDLink and OBDLink SX simultaneously without any issue. I also tested OBDLink MX and LX for a few weeks. So far so good. I do set the communication protocol for the Prius - no auto scanning of protocols.
     
  16. Prius_Cub

    Prius_Cub Member

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    Best of luck goldfinger, let us know if that works for you.

    A500 ? HD
     
  17. goldfinger

    goldfinger Active Member

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    Knock on wood, no further problems since disabling automatic protocol scan in Torque.

    I've been trying to make my car code for a week, over 5 hours of driving. I did the following tests multiple times while driving (carefully traffic permitting).

    • Scanner attached to OBD, but no tablet.
    • Actively using Torque to monitor nimh battery.
    • Power up sequence: car then Torque, Torque then car.
    • Torque running, but screen off (cover closed).
    • Hot plugging adapter, allow Torque to connect to car, repeat.
    • Shutting down and restarting Torque.

    There's allot out there on this issue, not just Prius related. Some search terms to try are:

    obd auto protocol u0100.​

    Thanks everyone especially Prius_cub.
     
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  18. Sindre Stang

    Sindre Stang New Member

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    A question I hope someone here can help me with. I tried using a OBDII reader to reset warninglights after changing ABS sensors. The result was that now, all warninglights are on, and speedometer no longer function. NAV, fuel meter and temp are working, and the car starts and run as normal. But the dashboard looks like a christmastree, and I have no idea how fast i'm going.
    I have tried the reboot with the key in and 30 sec startbutton, and I have tried the disconecting of 12V battery, and the 2 i combination. No result.
    I have purchased a new OBDII software for Toyota with a OBDII - USB cabel, but the computer gets no respons from the car.

    Any ideas or suggestions anyone?
    Much obliged for help.
     
  19. valde3

    valde3 Senior Member

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    Did you scan it in ig-on (power button twice without brake)? How long did you leave 12V battery disconnected?
     
  20. Sindre Stang

    Sindre Stang New Member

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    ig-on but motor not running. (power button once) 12V battery disconnected over night.