I switched to nickel plated copper busbars

Discussion in 'Prius v Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by PriusV17, Oct 18, 2018.

  1. PriusV17

    PriusV17 Active Member

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    How do I read this data? Do I need techstream?
     
  2. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    I think Mendel posted the XGAUGEs back in #26. Those will work as-is with a ScanGauge II, and can also be (probably already have been) translated for use with the Torque phone app, and other similar things).
     
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  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    i knuckled down and entered the X-Gauges for hybrid battery resistance values. Have set up the gauges to display the first four, but for some reason it just shows the gauge "name", not a value. Likely something absurdly obvious; it's been so long since I've had the ScanGuage hooked up. I'll give it another look tomorrow.
     
  4. PriusV17

    PriusV17 Active Member

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    Dr. Prius was already monitoring resistance so this is what I got from this morning:

    At Park and no engine running: Resistance between 20 to 21 milli-ohms

    Screenshot_2018-11-05-10-08-29.png

    While driving on the freeway: Resistance went as low as 18 to 19 milli-ohms

    Screenshot_2018-11-05-11-27-38.png
     
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  5. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    And I still hobble along with ScanGauge. :cry:
     
  6. PriusV17

    PriusV17 Active Member

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    So that 80 mpg fluke just got a little flukier.

    Now I got 92 mpg on that same commute. It's a 20 mile bumper to bumper freeway commute normally getting 72-76mpg.

    20mile.jpg

    Anyway what matters is my overall mpg. Weather has been getting chilly and I'm seeing low mpg at fast highway speeds. If it does drop I will accept that and just keep the nickel plated bus bars. If it gains mpg, great! I will keep track for the coming months and report my overall results.

    All nuts are torqued and I will not be opening up the pack for a long time. These module threads are apparently really easy to over torque and break the threads. I did a test over torque on a module I bought from ebay (for load testing). Over torquing will tear the threads very easily.

    I installed a harness to be able to charge the pack to 80%. Have not use it much but tests showed pack always tops at 80%. For now I just want to monitor the effect of the bus bars w/o interfering with the results further.
     
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  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    I'm still not clear: are you able to fenangle the case off, get to the cells, without removing the battery from the car. I'd be interested to take a peek at ours, but don't relish complete disconnection and dragging it out of the car.
     
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  8. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

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    There are nuts on the bottom side of the modules, so not as easy as it seems;).

    I’d be wary of doing bus bar swaps or module swaps in the car as voltage transfers are easier with metal:cool:.
     
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  9. PriusV17

    PriusV17 Active Member

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    The pack does not need to be removed from the car at all. I just open the case, remove the module covers for the terminals and get to work. The v is designed to be very easy to access the pack w/o much work. Not sure about the other Gens.

    pack.jpg
     
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  10. lovemy02prius

    lovemy02prius Member

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    Hello how did these bus bars work out for you??? were they manufactured NEW or re plated? 36 in the kit but wondering how much ? THANKS!
     
  11. Soh

    Soh Junior Member

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    so how are you going with the nickel plated bars. Has your mileage been consistently increase, would love to hear about it.
     
  12. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    It is possible for one PID to return multiple values, packed into the bits of one message. You can see that if you look closely at XGAUGEs for two adjacent bits of data and they have the same TXD but different RXD.

    Toyota definitely has packed some values, like the battery block volts and resistances, together like that.

    Some ScanGauges are old enough (mine is) to have a bug where if you have two or more XGAUGEs selected for display at the same time that are packed into the same PID, it will display blank values for all of them. You can go ahead and program in the XGAUGEs for all of the block resistances, for example, you just have to make sure if you select more than one of them for display at the same time, they're at least two blocks apart (or four blocks, however many Toyota packed in per PID, I forget).

    Later ScanGauges don't have that problem. I think it may be possible to send an older one back and they'll return it with updated firmware. So far I haven't done that, not wanting to be without the ScanGauge that long. Right now I guess would be the ideal time, as I'm using the car so little.
     
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  13. rjparker

    rjparker Senior Member

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    Similar to my factory battery. The Car Scanner app was run after Dr Prius this afternoon while stopped.

    Dr Prius 22 milliohms
    9955EC1C-949F-41E5-8010-AA95AAF0E20B.png


    Car Scanner 0.02 ohms
    (rounding or truncating the lsb digit) D3793849-4797-4FF6-8C16-21269EB84604.jpeg
     
    #53 rjparker, Sep 20, 2020
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2020
  14. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Which part of California are you near that would create that level of oxidation in under 2 years?

    Do you generally park inside, outside, sunny, shaded, and with or without the windows down some?
     
  15. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    On a side note...this is not true. Gen 4s NiMH batteries do NOT have plated busbars. Stated from the experience of having several disassembled Gen 4 carcasses in the shop.................
     
  16. Soh

    Soh Junior Member

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    So I installed Dr Prius app yesterday and connected it to assess the battery. This was in a stationary car, does the increased resistance indicate corrosion??

    Thanks
    Screenshot_20200921-164621.png
     
  17. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    IIRC I got similar resistance numbers. "DELTA SOC" warning regards voltage variation; getting out of balance?

    Someone that knows should be along shortly.
     
  18. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    @Soh

    Are you under the impression that you have a problem with the HV battery? Your highest voltage is a 16.33 and lowest is a 16.27. With voltages >16, I would assume the battery had recently been in a 'being charged' state, even though it is now showing a 1.6 amp discharge.
    The resistances are all 22 or 23 mohms. Going just by these numbers, you have no problems at all.

    A more accurate indicator would be to let the car sit unused overnight or for an entire day, press the power button 2x with your foot off the brake (this prevents the engine from starting, which would charge the HV battery for a few moments) and then read the voltages. Any time you look at idle voltages shortly after the engine has been running, they will be high and fairly even, which hides weak modules.

    When looking at resistance values, I wouldn't become concerned unless you have a 3 number divergence, like if one was reading 25. That would be indicative of a module or connection issue.
     
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  19. Kenny94945

    Kenny94945 Active Member

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    FWIW
    I thought copper was the best conductor of electricity ...ref: Spark Plug test - copper vs platinum etc.

    My thought for preventative maintenance would be to coat the buses with di-electric grease.

    Whether removal of the busses to coat their undersides it a debatable, especially for the risk of over torqueing and experiencing a broken part.

    Interesting thread.
     
  20. Soh

    Soh Junior Member

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    @TMR-JWAP
    Thanks for the response. Yes it is a 2009 car so I was concerned about the battery.
    Car runs very short distances and due to the prevalence of cold weather the engine keeps running. That is also a sign of a poor HV battery, ergo my concern and to rule out other causes of high engine running.
    I shall update with the testing method you have advised.
    Getting a good supply of bus bars and nuts is a bit difficult here in Oz specially as I live regional.
     
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