ICE vs hybrid vs PHEV vs EV

Discussion in 'EV (Electric Vehicle) Discussion' started by bwilson4web, Sep 21, 2019.

  1. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    You really have to be a geek to like this video:


    From a systems engineering standpoint, it makes sense but for public policy ... well you pays your money and takes your chances.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  2. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    Nice video. I think the Crv took a bashing more!
    A convincing proposition for EV/HEV.
     
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    each one makes sense for someone
     
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  4. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    I think this was what Toyota was trying to say earlier in the year (but critics claim that was Toyota's way of getting around the fact they can't produce EVs or they don't want to produce EVs). Toyota is reducing emissions by producing lower cost hybrids and PHEVs and getting it out to more people.
     
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  5. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    Toyota sold me on a Prius Prime with TSS-P in 2016. Then came Tesla on February 2019, I don’t fault Toyota but I really liked driving our 2014 BMW i3-REx. I did not like the long BMW repair times dealing with infantile problems. But for driving enjoyment, the Prime became driveway art.

    Today the BMW is backup for the Tesla. Toyota is after a different set of customers that does not include us. The Prius family was a great transition but no longer meets our requirements.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  6. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Makes sense. Not gonna deny that the Prime is slow and while the improvements are good, it’s still not a BMW.

    But that’s ok. I want a competent car that’s comfortable but won’t flop in the corners and that’s the Prime. The only thing I wish is that it’s faster. <10 secs to 60 please.
     
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  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i would like a heat pump and more ev range, but i won't give up 600 mile range (yet)
     
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  8. plug-it-in

    plug-it-in Member

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    I fully agree. I think the obsession with costly EVs gives a bad rap for hybrids, and especially PHEVs. I think it will take minimum 3 but more likely 5 years before a real 'people's EV' at $25-35k will be available. Like Volkwagen says they will have it in 3 years - well I bet they will be later than that. Battery availability and cost are the main issues. In the meanwhile PHEVs are a good investment.

    It would be nice if Toyota could double the pure EV range of the Prius Prime. But I somehow don 't think it will happen. China will force them to concentrate on EVs or loose the Chinese market.
     
    #8 plug-it-in, Sep 21, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
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  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    vdumb: 3 years to develop, 5 years to produce, 10 years to mass production, 15 years to make inroads in china, 20 years to begin n/a sales,

    3 to life for their executives
     
  10. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web i3 and Prime

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    My suggestions for a better Prime:
    • Cylindrical cells in a dense package conformal to the spare tire well
      • +75 mi EV
    • Traction battery heating and cooling independent of the cabin air
      • excess can be used for cabin aux heating and cooling
    • +32A L2 charging
    • CCS-1 fast DC charging
      • Early 100kW then taper down
    • Power electronics and control laws for 0-60 mph in 8 seconds
    • Kill the 'creep' for one pedal driving
    • Lane auto-steering
    • non-lead 12V battery with solar tickle charging
    • 1.5 kW, sine-wave, power outlet in cabin and external charge port (optional)
    Gosh darn! Looks like an enhanced BMW i3-REx after Bob-mods.

    Bob Wilson
     
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  11. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    You're obsessed with that BMW Bill!
     
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  12. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Now it actually isn't available yet, but VW's ID 3 standard range(120 miles EPA estimate) is supposed to be priced €30k. Subtract out Germany's 19% VAT, and convert to US dollars and the price is on the low side of $27k.
     
  13. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    How do you estimate a 205 mile base range WTLP to 120 mile EPA? That seems off. The base LEAF is rated at 168 miles WTLP so I would think the ID.3 will be rated more than the LEAF in the US. 170 miles seems more reasonable.
     
  14. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Oops, I used the NEDC to EPA conversion factor.
    The ID 3 standard range EPA estimate would be about 183 miles.
    Here&#039;s How To Calculate Conflicting EV Range Test Cycles: EPA, WLTP, NEDC
     
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  15. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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