Featured Is Tesla revisiting Battery Swaps?

The CleanTechnica article is not showing the patent grant that they claim, they're showing the publication of a patent application, for what it's worth.

Also, this patent is effectively a continuation of their original 2014 application - basically, this is all part of the original battery swapping tech.

As far as the Tesla Supercharger network, here's how I predict it's all going to shake out:

Tesla is a member of CharIN, which the Western automakers are also all members of, as well as Hyundai.

Tesla has also made a variant of the Type 2 DC-Mid connector that supports higher currents, that they're using in regions where Type 2 is the standard AC charging connector. This is more compact than the DC-High "frankenplug" used in those markets.

My prediction here is that in European markets, Tesla's DC-Mid variant will become the primary standard for ~150 kW DCFC, and the CCS standard will be modified to include it. Existing cars in the field can be retrofitted fairly easily to match.

In US markets, it's more complicated, because Tesla uses a 100% proprietary connector. However, signalling is based on the J1772 standard, so I could see Tesla somehow getting it to be adopted as the unified standard.

For high-power DC fast charging (350 kW+), like what Volkswagen wants, the current CCS frankenplug could be used, or variants of it.

 

My understanding is that Tesla had to develop their own standard, because nothing else available at the time would meet their needs. I do thing it is a more elegant one for home charging in that you don't need to buy another EVSE to take advantage of faster rates. Just install a RV outlet, and swap the car supplied cord's end. Want to use the dryer outlet, or other outlet more powerful than 15 amps found in a home, just get the <$100 cord plug from Tesla.

When Musk opened Tesla's patent books, didn't that include those that cover the Supercharger? So the other companies can make a plug in with a Supercharger connection, but they likely simply don't want to pay for access to Tesla's network.

 

basic human nature; "I want all the free stuff & I don't want to pay for ANY of it"
Heck, outside of dealerships, they won't even build Chargers that accommodate their OWN vehicles.

could be worse ..... the # of Alabama SC stalls is relatively puny. How'd u feel cruising past some of the 16 slot locations ....



Now reversing the empathy; imagine your Model X or S pulls up to charge - but every stall is filled with Nissan Leafs & BMW's charging? And yet these inconsiderate drivers have gone off to watch a movie even though they get relatively small amount of miles due to their smaller pack sizes ? And due to their smaller pack size - they can only charge at ½ the speed of your car anyway? And they haven't paid diddly-squat for infrastructure? And you paid 6 figures for your car so the infrastructure could get built in the 1st place ?

the only known variable is that the Roadster is not designed for either the swap station or the SC Network. Weather the model 3 is swapable, is moot for now, as the process is dormant for now.
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hang on, yes & no. 1st - CHAdeMO use is enjoyed by any manufacturer that wants to build that type - or an adapter for that type of L3. So for CHAdeMO - you already have as user/members Nissan, Mitsubishi, Scion/Hyundai, even Toyota is a member of CHAdeMO - but for political reasons, many of the manufacturer's limit use in the US. Most public CHAdeMO stations now days are for-profit, weather Nissan, Mitsubishi, Tesla or Hyundai/Kia. So hey, as long as your money is green, they don't care .... they actuallt WANT anyone to use them, & the longer the better. Dealerships? They set their own use/standards/hours too. Now from personal experience, many of the different dealerships don't allow anyone - except their own brand of vehicles (even tho stations are 3rd party/profit units) & some dealerships, even if you didn't personally buy from them, they won't let you use them.

Therein lies the true issues ......
GM, Ford, Fiat Chrysler, BMW or whomever could easily make their own adapters for alternate networks, just as Tesla sells different adapters, so Tesla owners can charge at public high power and L2 stations. Similarly, the other manufacturers could negotiate deals with Tesla, making the largest infrastructure an even LARGER joint venture, but they don't even like there OWN ev's for the most part - as ev's require less maintenance, which is often ½ the profit at a dealership - so it's unlikely that'll ever happen.
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Seems like a fair restriction.

Bob Wilson

 

That whole notion of parity seems to leave a bad taste in their mouths. That's why I edited and added to my post (#43) above.
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The Kohl's stores that were originally Bloomingdale's MainStreet stores have EV charging stations. There is one I used to frequent in Downers Grove, Illinois. Picture to come.

 

Well .... ?
We're waiting ..... !

Segway'ing back to the OP ~
Recently was reading a post of one owning all 3 tesla models. Comment was X & S have different pack setups from 3, which, due to its mounting make it appear highly unlikely it'd work in the old swap out bay - in his opinion.
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Never knew that was there. One needs a ChargePoint card, even to use it free, do they not?

 

We do have additional information, from august about the changes. There are now bolts holding the battery pack in place - which require removal of interior trim to access. That means no drive through automated battery swap. It is likely a human will be required to swap the battery pack. This adds to cost and may restrict hours of operation.

The battery pack also now includes the charger, fast charge connections, and dc-dc converter. The change in packaging probably reduces manufacturing costs and likely will reduce maintenance costs but may encourage owners into getting packs serviced at tesla after warranty versus a 3rd party. There are a couple of things we have more recently found out. The battery pack likely can be charged faster than current Tesla super chargers, and the warranty now includes 70% retention after mileage or years.

My guess - tesla thinks batteries 5 years from now will be good enough, making investment in battery swap a bad bet. If things change, tesla will be ready with a swapable battery pack design, but designed for whatever battery tech is state of the art when it is released.

currently the 80.5 kwh tesla model 3 can charge faster than 170 miles/half hour to 80% if its above 10%. In a decade there should be a 110 kwh battery that can fit in the same space, cost less money, and probably charge at 200 kw or about 12.5 miles/minute, and have range of 425 miles. Say it takes 5 minutes to park plug and condition the pack for full charging rate. That would be about 125 miles in 15 minutes, or 310 in 30 minutes. If you need it faster you probably want a phev not a bev, and those should be much better in 10 years too.

 

Impressive charge times. Starting to be practical.

Now what needs to be the density of the chargers to match the convenience we are used to?

I just got back from a 4 store run this afternoon. In 5 miles I had my choice of stations with 12 and 16 nozzles with none of the nozzles more than 75 feet from the road I'm traveling. When I am on an interstate, I'm used to availability every 25 miles or so and no more than a half mile out of my way. And I'm used to every nozzle the same and every refill at approximately the same rate.

If I'm going to pay $50k for a car it better not degrade my experience.