It's THE PRIUS stupid....

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by The Electric Me, Aug 6, 2013.

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  1. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    The T-100 and 1st gen Tundra were both on the small side of the fullsize spectrum. Considering the model bloat redesigns go through, this was a good thing for some, and the Tundra had better fuel economy than the Americans. Toyota, in order to chase more sales, made the 2nd gen Tundra the largest on the market. Also the thirstiest while the price of fuel went up and the others were starting to match the old Tundra in fuel economy.

    Then there were some structural issues that show that Toyota didn't fully research the truck buyer that actually uses a truck. Early tailgates were bending when heavy loads were going on. The paper specs may have matched the American brands in term of weight limits, but the Americans knew how much abuse an actual work truck takes, and over engineered things like the tailgate. As to the bed shake, if that video was from the Ecoboost challenge, Ford literally did thousands of dollars worth of damage to the Tundra over a track the others were able to handle. Breaking the Tundra's back wouldn't be to far a statement. Toyota has reinforced things since then.

    I think Dodge might be making Nissan's trucks for the American market now.

    They were also suffering from the issue of model bloat, and were small only in relation to the full size trucks. Only the Ranger remained a compact truck under EPA classification. In its last few years, Ford put an oversized, tacky brand emblem on the tailgate. Probably because they were tired of people assuming the little pick up was an Asian brand.

    Unfortunately, the regulations for truck fuel economy is based on the footprint of the vehicle, with the smaller ones having higher targets. With the same aerodynamic issues regardless of size, it is more cost effective for the manufacturers to put a small engine in a large truck than design a small one with a tougher MPG target. Some predict these regs can lead to the end of the regular cab.
     
    #21 Trollbait, Sep 29, 2014
    tpenny67 likes this.
  2. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    #22 JimboPalmer, Sep 29, 2014
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  3. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    I don't know, all I can say is I miss the old stripped down, small trucks that Toyota and Nissan both sold.

    The big drawback from my perspective and this is what might of lead to their demise, is that they weren't very safe. Not very good in crash tests, and my 1991 Nissan did not even have a single airbag.

    But being so stripped down, they sold for incredibly cheap. I bought my first brand new one, for less than $7000.

    Safety standards aside, they were incredible from an utilitarian standpoint. Moving, camping, whatever.
    Being 4 cylinder, I got descent gas mileage (if not great).

    I think it was the need for higher safety standards and equipment and also comfort and luxury appointments that killed the small pick-up.
    But I'd take the safety risk and buy one tomorrow if they offered one at the same economical price.

    I agree that the domestic car companies still dominate the large truck market. But most of your criticism of Toyota's entry, are all past tense. The Tundra is considered a very good truck.
     
    #23 The Electric Me, Sep 29, 2014
  4. tpenny67

    tpenny67 Active Member

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    I also miss the cheap, basic pick-up. I started out with an '87 S10 with a 7.5 foot bed which was a great size. When that started rusting out I got a slightly used full size '97 with vinyl flooring, crank windows, regular cab and long bed. It actually gets about the same mileage as the S10 did, mostly because it doesn't need to downshift uphills nearly as much.

    I've held onto that truck for 14 years because the new ones are just too big and expensive, and I don't want to pay $35k+ for something that is ill suited to my daily commute. So the old Chevy sits in the garage most days while I drive the Prius, soon to be replaced by a low-mileage 2007 F-150 my father-in-law isn't driving anymore. If that lasts me a dozen or so years it will be ready for replacement around the time I retire. :)
     
    #24 tpenny67, Sep 29, 2014
  5. MarcSmith

    MarcSmith Active Member

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    Jimbo...

    you really don't want one of the trucks. we have several on campus on a three year lease... similar to the diahatsu. they just don't hold up that well, interior quality sucks. I would not want to be in one in an accident. I think the prius has thicker sheet metal..

    But is is bare bones nothing fancy type of truck...

    but you you gotta be under 5'10" tall and undr 200lbs to drive one comfortably...
     
    #25 MarcSmith, Sep 29, 2014
  6. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Yes, they fixed the issues, but it is just to illustrate the point that while Toyota may have taken the time to get it right with the Prius, that isn't how they always operate. Considering they had been selling compact to mid-size trucks here for decades, it is actually kinda surprising the errors they made with the Tundra2 at first. The only real cons it has now is fuel economy and price. It is also big. Ford is lowering the beltline on the 2015 F150. Hopefully the rest follow suit.

    Here is another perspective to the post that wasn't yours. Ford, part of Detroit, didn't just rush into the hybrid game. Development on the Escape hybrid started during the PNGV program, and what they delivered wasn't a hybrid poser.
     
    #26 Trollbait, Sep 29, 2014
  7. 2k1Toaster

    2k1Toaster Brand New Prius Batteries

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    Perhaps Toyota just knew what most trucks are going to do. Drive around town on paved roads and never have anything hooked up to them.
     
    #27 2k1Toaster, Sep 29, 2014
  8. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Then they shouldn't have been advertising it as the biggest and strongest upon release.
     
    #28 Trollbait, Sep 29, 2014
  9. The Electric Me

    The Electric Me Go Speed Go!

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    But things have changed a lot. The time period and product I'm referring to are the long gone, true small pick-ups. They started to disappear mid to late 90's.

    But for decades before then, you could buy what both Datsun/Nissan just referred to as their "truck". They didn't even have a name. It was just a Toyota Truck or Nissan Truck.

    For me? They were like model T's. They were so basic and stripped down that there wasn't much that could go wrong with them. And yeah, even with only 4 cylinders and little else, I never really had a job or task it couldn't do. I hauled tons, and as a camping vehicle they were great.

    No doubt, todays mid-size and large trucks are much nicer machines, in terms of power, comfort, amenities and safety, and I don't think Nissan, Toyota or any major automaker could afford to offer a product as basic as those trucks.

    If I remember right my 91 had no airbags, bench seat, and no anti-lock brakes.

    It was a rolling death trap in terms of safety.

    I fully understand why the age of the stripped down, basic small truck has past. But they were amazingly durable and I took my 2 wheel drive, four cylinder truck places I would hesitate to go with many fancy supposedly off road vehicles sold today.
     
    #29 The Electric Me, Sep 30, 2014
  10. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    #30 JimboPalmer, Sep 30, 2014
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