Jerry's Evolving Thoughts on "new-to-me" Prime Premium

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-Current)' started by jerrymildred, Mar 12, 2019.

  1. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    I know about it. I just probably won't have need of it till about December. :LOL: Well, there is one other possibility. After we see my sister in AZ in May, we'll head up to Colorado. Might need it there in the mountains. The PiP was awesome in the Smokies. Can't wait to experience the Prime in the Rockies. :)
     
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  2. Washingtonian

    Washingtonian Active Member

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    Heat pumps are air conditioners, too.
     
  3. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    I confess that my knee-jerk reaction was, "Duh! Of course they are." Then I remembered that lots and lots of people don't know much of anything about how much of anything works, so I'm glad you added that detail for later visitors (if any) to the thread. (y)
     
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  4. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Your earlier response to me indicated that some dumb electrician thought it was just for heat. My Gen 4 just has an electric compressor and recovers some extra heat from the exhaust.
     
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  5. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Well done Jerry! I've got a ways to go lol. (And I thought my 4.2-4.8 miles/kWh was good.. that's 12.9-14.6kWh/100km for metric users).
     
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  6. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Thanks! That means a LOT coming from a pro like you. So far, I'm getting usually between 5.2 and 5.9 miles/kWh. But not needing heat and very little A/C is surely helping. We'll see what the summer brings.

    Today was kind of unusual but it was also educational. An out-of-the-routine trip. For those who want to look at maps or know the area, it was from home in New Port Richey over to Carrollwood, run errands around there, and then back home. It was just under 80 miles altogether and I started with a full battery. This was about 30% rural roads with 45-50 mph limits and then 50% city with 45-50 mph limits. The rest was more residential at 35 mph. The PiP would have returned about 60-70 mpg over that distance with those conditions and a full battery. And that would have impressed me. For the Prime, the total mpg was just under 149.7 indicated for the trip!!! Ho. Lee. Cow! :eek:

    Here's what impressed me besides the battery range:
    From our last stop in Carrollwood to Sam's club near home was roughly 30 miles. The meter showed 78 mpg over that stretch. I only had two miles of EV left when we began that leg, so I just put it in HV when we started and kept it there except for one mile of 40 mph road. And now I think I know how it got such crazy mileage numbers. It seems to do its own version of charge mode at speeds at least up to 60 mph. That's the highest speed I've seen so far where it pops itself into EV. What I saw was that, when in HV mode with a couple miles or more of available EV available, at a steady speed on level ground, it puts itself in EV for one or two miles (maybe more), letting the EV range run down quite a bit. Then it recharges the battery. It does this all by itself with the cruise control set and just keeps going back and forth.

    That's interesting to me because the prevailing wisdom here with other generations has been to not force EV mode like that because there were more losses involved in regenerating than could be saved running in EV. But the Prime seems to be so efficient that that's no longer the case because I was getting some amazing numbers in those rare times when I could maintain a constant speed for more than a couple minutes.

    These are all from mental notes along the way since traffic here doesn't permit keeping records along the way, but the final score impressed me. Aside form a few ergonomic issues, I think Toyota knocked it out of the ballpark with this car.
     
  7. heiwa

    heiwa Active Member

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    Because of this, I stop trying to control EV/HV manually. Focusing on minimizing ICE warm up cycle seems to yield better MPG for a long trips than micro managing EV/HV IMHO. Thank you for sharing your discoveries. Your enthusiasm is contagious!


    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  8. bruceha_2000

    bruceha_2000 Senior Member

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    I have no way to track that. I ASSUME there is nothing in the car that tracks charge cycles and kWh??

    We don't have that here. Only have "we control your electric water heater in the evening" rate.

    I've been charging during the day when my solar array is producing. Figure I might as well put it directly in the car than put it in the grid just to take it back later at night.

    And interesting pricing/timing. Vermont is looking at all kinds of renewable energy things. One I heard they were thinking about was paying more for net metered power at night (can you say wind?) because there are areas in the state where there is more than enough solar going into the grid during the day. Our power company will lease you a Tesla powerwall for 10 years but they own it and can draw from it whenever they like though they guarantee a minimum charge so you can use it during a power outage. You no ability to choose to use power from "your" battery otherwise. Not sure why there is even a monthly charge ($10) since you have no control. And you have to pay for the electric upgrades to have it put in. Still, I guess it is a lot cheaper than buying a generator big enough to run some critical things when the power is out. Without the battery, grid outage shuts down the array (so it won't maybe send power to a line someone is working on even though there are automatic breakers that shut off when there is no grid power.)

    I would LOVE to have your rates! Ours are $0.16/kWh year round.

    Hmmm, sounds like yet another feature I don't know about!

    Yep, I've noticed the same thing. Switching doesn't throw it immediately into "ICE to the wheels, electric assist" if the engine is cold. More the other way around until the engine warms up.

    And clean! Hard to find that around here in the winter. And since we are 1/2 mile down a dirt road, hard to find on our cars in the "not winter" as well.

    Curious speed limits. Around here anything "city" is max 35, nearly every road in Burlington (biggest city in the state) is 25, nothing higher than 30. Residential is always 25.
     
  9. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    When I installed my 240V outlet for L2 charging a couple years ago, I put in a meter that tracks that stuff. I'm pretty sure that you're right that the car doesn't track it. The PiP did show kWh used (but not received).

    Yeah, I kew about that long ago with the PiP and wrote about it a few times. But with the PiP, I felt the change. It was subtle, but still there. So far, I've never felt it with the Prime. But I've only made the transition maybe 5-6 times since I got it. Almost all my driving is in EV (94% so far).

    Florida is just weird. :D
     
  10. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    A couple more things occurred to me this morning.
    1. I think I like the lightweight tonneau cover in this better than the retractable one in previous generations. It's easier in day-to-day use and takes less space when stowed even though it's a little more hassle to stow.

    2. It looks like I'll be feeding this about twice as many kWh per month from my own electricity as the PiP. But only getting gas when I go on vacation. LOL! Stats will come later. It's only been two weeks.

    Edit to add: Here are a couple stats so far. 610 miles so far on this first tank. Gas gauge still reads "full." I've bought 68 kWh for it so far in two weeks plus lots of free plug-ins. PiP was usually 45-65 kWh over a tank of gas that would get me roughly 800-1,000 miles in 4-6 weeks.
     
    #70 jerrymildred, Mar 24, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
  11. Sparkly Markley

    Sparkly Markley New Member

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    I am considering purchase of a Prime and my only concern is NO SPARE TIRE! What are you supposed to do if you have a blow-out? What comes in the Tire Repair Kit? The only solution I see is to either purchase an extra wheel and tire to keep in the trunk, unless hte tires are RunFlat - but I don't see that information anywhere.
     
  12. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    So, more electricity & less gas and hopefully less money spent.
    If you enjoy it so much you drive more, that negates some of the cost savings though.;)
     
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  13. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

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    Dang it Jerry...the more I read your stuff..the more I want one! Must...resist. o_O
     
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  14. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    They’re not run flats.

    You could purchase a spare tire separately and leave it in the car or in the garage until you do a long trip or a trip out of town.
     
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  15. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    They’re not run flats.

    You could purchase a spare tire separately and leave it in the car or in the garage until you do a long trip or a trip out of town.
     
  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sidewalk Supervisor

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    Yeah maybe get a temp spare, or full size. For temp spare just follow the 3rd or 4th gen spec. I believe the 3rd gen 16" temp spare is actually closer in OD, virtually the same? Whereas the 4th gen 17" temp is a little undersized?

    The supplied kit may inflate the tire, if the hole is minor, and it's guaranteed to gum everything up.

    Consider a plug-repair kit too.

    Or, if you really want to wake up the manufacturers: don't buy a car that doesn't have a spare.
     
  17. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Funny you should mention that! Ever since I got the PiP 2-1/4 years ago, I've been lugging around a Gen 2 full size tire and wheel as well as a plug kit and for real 12V compressor. Never needed either except to rescue my wife once when she put a huge drill bit through a tire.

    Edit to add: I forgot to answer your question about what comes in the tire repair kit. It's just a compressor that blows tire sealant into the tire and pumps it up. It may or may not get you to a tire shop. And it's only for one use. And it's expensive to replace. And the tire shops hate them. And I think it's a stupid idea. Hence my plug kit and compressor that doesn't need to connect to the sealant canister for the easy-to-fix flats.

    But, I finally sprang for a proper donut spare. Second hand from Ebay, but looks completely unused. The Prime does have threaded bolt holes right behind the rear seats in a similar place to where they are in the other models. The holes have plastic plugs in them. I discovered that you can't pull out the plug; you need to unscrew it. I was never able to find D-rings that I was sure would be the right size. I went to the dealer yesterday. He looked up the factory originals and they are $19 each!!! Plus I'd have to do some modifications to make it fit. I told him, "Thanks, but for that price I'll make my own." He smiled and said, "I don't blame you." So I made one myself out of two 2-hole D-rings. A little cutting, a little heating and hammering, a little welding, and a little grinding and I'm good to go. My wife says I should make more and sell them. But that one took about two hours so I don't think anyone would want to pay my rate for two hours. (Although it was kinda fun figuring out how to fabricate it and remembering how to use my welder. :LOL:)
    IMG_0178.jpg
     
    #77 jerrymildred, Mar 24, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
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  18. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    You will be assimilated. Resistance is futile. :ROFLMAO:
     
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  19. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Ummm isn’t it time to replace that Gen 2 spare tire? Rubber ages faster than you.
     
  20. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Looks OK to me. No cracking, but I will be replacing it when the donut gets here in a few days.

    Edit to add, the tire was slightly worn, so it was probably not the original.
     
    #80 jerrymildred, Mar 24, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2019
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