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Just need to vent...

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by Mendel Leisk, Jul 6, 2022.

  1. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Luddite

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    Sadly both those pics are systems requiring protracted eyes-off-the-road scrolling through vent modes, to get the one you want. Either a slider or dial with detectable detents along the way, you could set vent mode without ever looking down.

    guess I’m venting about vents…

    from our long-gone ‘86 Owners Manual (neglected to pass it on :oops:):

    43E41225-97E3-4B7A-85ED-2D6DE4BA13C8.jpeg
     
    #501 Mendel Leisk, Mar 18, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2023
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  2. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Yeah, you do have to take your eyes off the road to change the HVAC settings on most cars. But that didn't start recently. Our 2014 Pathfinder was similar buttons and knobs. Then 2015 Gen 3 was the same way. I can't remember what 2008 HCH was like?

    upload_2023-3-18_9-36-16.png
     
  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Luddite

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    Sadly just the usual "mode button".

    upload_2023-3-18_6-44-28.png
     
  4. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    That's what I thought. I can't remember any car I owned that had "either a slider or dial with detectable detents along the way". Maybe a U-haul track I rented years ago had a slider like shown in your pic?
     
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  5. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Luddite

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    That's "progress"...

    Not sarcastically, I think the main factors driving H/V design these days are cost and convenience of manufacture. Driver distraction is rarely if ever a factor, judging from what we have.
     
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  6. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    OK, I found one example. This was a fairly recent Subaru (circa 2018). I think Legacy? but not sure, I test-drove but did not buy.

    upload_2023-3-18_9-55-0.png
     
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  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Luddite

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    Yeah that's pretty good. Recent Honda Fit base levels were similar; the higher levels "upgraded" to touch-screen. And sadly, that car has been discontinued. Even if it hadn't, they mighta phased out the base level H/V controls. Maybe because they cost more...

    There's a semi-bizarre inverted pyramid phenomena, where base level cars are more attractive. Case in point was 4th gen Prius, where base levels had a spare, and upper levels you "upgraded" to the slime kit.

    I think the motto is, if you're going to pull a whopper, be brazen about it, lol.
     
  8. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Subaru has been criticized for interior design a decade out of date.

    I don't care for Auto HVAC, but with most cars having it standard now, the time spent adjusting HVAC during driving by most people is probably less than with the manual knobs. Yes, the knobs let the driver keep their eyes on the road, but it is a diversion of mental resources, even if they don't have to reach for them.
     
  9. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Yeah, I have never paid any attention to the trim levels and options for my car purchases in the past. I bought an affordable used model on the lot regardless of the trim level. For new car purchases, if I had a choice, I almost always go for the base model, unless the price increase justifies the features added, which it almost never does. But, for the last two purchases of new cars, PP Ltd and Escape SEL, I had no choice for picking a trim level. That's all they had.

    I have been looking for a Bolt EV bare-bone base model without any option added (MSRP $26500) for a while so I can get a basic in-town-only BEV at ~$12K. But I can't find any. I think manufacturers and dealers don't want to sell the base model if they don't have to. Higher trims increase their profit margin disproportionally compared to the base model. That's what they are after.
     
    #509 Salamander_King, Mar 18, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2023
  10. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Luddite

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    Been browsing Subarus a bit just now, they seem to be keeping the H/V controls pretty usable. PDF Owner's Manuals are nowhere to be found, but this (video screen-grab) from a 2022 Impreza review looks sim to what you posted above. Kudos to them:

    upload_2023-3-18_7-35-33.png
     
  11. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    All the cars I owned before my Gen 1 Prius had purely mechanical HVAC controls: slide levers that acted on Bowden cables that moved the vanes. I liked those just fine, so the auto controls in the Gen 1 weren't scratching any itch I felt I had.

    I have, though, grown to like the way the auto control starts with low fan and sneaks it up as the heating/cooling capacity comes online. I used to do that myself by remembering to turn the fan switch off before starting, then reaching down several times during warmup to click it another notch. What I was doing was clearly something a machine could do, so I'm glad the machine now does it.

    With one of those earlier cars, I remember wondering "now why did they put detectable detents even on the temperature slider? It just moves a blend vane and there's no reason it shouldn't just be a continuous adjustment." And I experimented with removing the little detent spring from the lever, and found the real reason they had it there: without it, higher fan speeds would just blow the vane around.
     
  12. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Since Mendel assured me that my 2008 HCH had the AUTO climate, I looked through old photos and found the photo below. I have to go back to our 2005 Sienna for the last car "without" the AUTO climate setting. I am almost sure that my 1998 Civic also had no AUTO climate, but I have no picture of this car.

    This is the first time that I realized that the Sienna did not have an AUTO setting. We have had 2008 HCH, 2015 Gen3, and 2017 PP all with the AUTO climate feature while still driving the Sienna, but I can't remember ever wanting that feature on this car. I never felt the AUTO climate was a convenient or a good feature to have in other cars. BTW, I don't remember if those dials on our Sienna had detectable detents along the way, but it was easily operable without taking eyes off the road. Mendel must approve of it.

    One feature we liked on this ancient 2005 Sienna right away was the dual climate zone control. I think it was the first car we ever owned that had this feature. This feature quickly became a must-have for our family travel cars. I and my wife have totally different comfortable temperature zones. Having dual zone control for my wife sitting in the passenger seat was the best feature we discovered. The AUTO climate, not so much.
    upload_2023-3-18_12-25-40.png
     
  13. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    It's auto and all controls on the screen with the Outback Touring.

    Can't say if it will work for you.
    Vehicle Resources
     
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  14. hkmb

    hkmb Senior Member

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    I hired a Kia Rio recently - it was all that Sixt had in Broken Hill other than mine-spec utes.

    I'm not sure whether you have the Rio in the US. Here it's the cheapest Kia you can buy, and one of the three or four cheapest cars of any brand on the market. It is not a fancy car, but it was, in general, surprisingly OK.

    The air-con controls were really simple, and used proper knobs. It was a lovely thing - safe and easy to use.

    On the other hand, the VW ID.3s I hired in Britain had climate control that was utterly bewildering, and all done through the screen. It was stupid, and it was dangerous. An MG HS I hired in Adelaide also had all the climate controls in the screen. They were a bit less confusing than on the VW, but still far from ideal.
     
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  15. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    I am drooling over all of these knobs and especially the diagrams with the sliders!

    I hate buttons and I really hate touch screens.

    I also hate how the Avalon's HVAC system has a mind of it's own. I can't defrost the windshield with recirculated heat, even though there's no frost on the inside of the windshield and I'm trying to warm up the car. It forces exterior air always in defrost mode. And even if I put it on floor heat and recirculation, it will automatically kick back into exterior air in about a minute after I chose recirculation. JUST LET ME CHOOSE MY OWN STUPID SETTINGS WILL YA!
     
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  16. hkmb

    hkmb Senior Member

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    Context is soooo important sometimes.
     
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  17. hkmb

    hkmb Senior Member

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    That seems silly. So even if you're in a traffic jam in a tunnel, behind a smoky truck, it won't let you stay in recirc?

    Is this a fault, or is it actually supposed to happen? I've never heard of such a thing.
     
  18. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    I had the same thing in the Nissan Leaf. IF it's on defrost you can't choose recirculation.

    I guess Japan isn't cold enough to need the defrost to do just that, defrost the frost on the outside. I guess they think you only need it to get the fog off from the inside, in which case using outside air over recirculated air would kind of make sense.
     
  19. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    It's not just for Japanese cars. Ford Escape will automatically shut off the re-circ setting on HVAC under certain use cases such as max defrost mode. I have read a complaint on this "feature" on the Ford forum. I have never tried it on my Escape for I always like to bring in the outside fresh air, so never push the re-circ button on my car.
     
    #519 Salamander_King, Mar 18, 2023
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2023
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  20. Isaac Zachary

    Isaac Zachary Senior Member

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    Ya, I noticed it first on Japanese cars, but I kind of get the feeling this is a feature on lots of new cars. It's part of the supposedly "idiot-proofing" of modern cars. Apparently people will turn on the defrost/defog and then not understand why the fog won't go away with the recirculation turned on too.

    There are a lot of things I like about new cars, but I also feel like I was born in the wrong era when it comes to cars.

    I wish I had the funds to put together a shop that could custom mod any new car. You want HVAC knobs or even sliders? You want a spare-tire compartment? You want custom gauges? How about a custom infotainment center, or even just a regular old-fashioned radio? You want chrome bumpers? You want a manual transmission? You want your car coated in solar panels?

    The dreams are endless but the reality is cruel.
     
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