Just replaced my 12v battery with a Yellow Top Optima and I am experiencing some issues

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by drobinson, Apr 17, 2012.

  1. drobinson

    drobinson New Member

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    My 2005 Prius has 112,000 miles on it.

    Last week I replaced the 12v aux battery with an Optima DS46B24R Yellow Top Battery that I ordered from BatteryMart.com.

    Immediately after installing the battery, I noticed that all the interior lights were noticeably dimmer than before. I tried to go into diagnostic mode on the MFD, but the process of turning on and off the lights draws so much current it causes the MFD to shut off.

    The car starts fine with the headlights off, however if I start the car with the headlights on, I receive the red warning triangle for a few moments and then everything proceeds normally. If I go into diagnostic mode once the car is running, the battery voltage reads between 13.8 and 14v.

    I have had the battery installed for about 10 days and I drive about 2 - 3 hours a day. I was hoping that this would charge it, but it everything is still acting exactly the same.

    Did I receive a defective battery, or is something else going on?
     
  2. sambojoho

    sambojoho Proud conservative

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    First thing I would do is double check that all my connections are secure, including the battery ground connection. If all this is good, then most likely would be a defective battery.
     
  3. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    Buy a voltmeter and check the voltage at the terminals, as well as the resistance from the negative to ground, with the car off, after it has been sitting for a few hours.

    Or buy one of these and check voltage in ACC. I have this installed in my Insight. I am not using the IMA system there so I have to monitor my 12V to make sure that my workaround keeps the DC converter running.
    http://www.amazon.com/dp/product/B000EVWDU0?tag=priuschatcom-20 was another report of a low battery being delivered. If you are driving 2-3 hours a day, and the battery can hold a charge, then it should have been more than amply replenished by now. But if it is a cull and cannot pass a load test, then it should be warranty exchanged with the seller.
     
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  4. drobinson

    drobinson New Member

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    That's the first thing I did. Unfortunately it looks like I am going to have to deal with making a warranty claim. Which would be a lot easier if I didn't buy online.
     
  5. cnschult

    cnschult Active Member

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    I'm having a different issue with my Optima. Yes I know how to install properly. Yes it came fully charged and manufactured this month (my trickle charger quit after 1 minute claiming battery was full).

    The DENSO battery I replaced was dying, so I was trickle charging it overnight every single day, I was yielding 47-48mpg on the mfd, still using oversized (195/65-15) blizzaks on heavy steel wheels (I won't be switching back for another month or so). The new Optima battery is yielding me 45mpg on the mfd, same tires, same top tier Shell gas. I have never grilled blocked or used EBH.

    So what's with the 2+mpg hit? So far I'm not impressed with Optima. Because of the mail in rebate and eBates 12% cash back I also bought a Red Top for my sister and threw it in the trunk of her Corolla (along with a 10mm wrench and gloves) and showed her how to put it in when her 12V gives out.

    I've noticed that whenever I disconnect the 12V the ICE runs more than usual that next week as it seems to take a little time to realize its an economy car. With the Optima the ICE is shutting down at stop lights very well, so why has FE gone down? Is there a "break-in" period or does the Prius need a little time to learn how to work with the Optima for maximum efficiency?
     
  6. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    Your old battery you were trickle charging every day. That means you had a surface charge on the old batt every time you started out. So the DC converter would not have had to work at keeping it charged, saving maybe 25-50 watt-hours per day. Try putting your Optima on a battery tender and see what happens.

    An Optima should not necessarily give any better or worse MPG than an OEM. Its true value is its ability with withstand deep cycling in case a door gets left open overnight etc.
     
  7. cnschult

    cnschult Active Member

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    thanks, but a lot of people claim optimas improve their mileage, that's why I was kind of expecting the yellow top to match the dying denso that i was charging every night.

    I don't really care about my mpg, i just wanted to make sure nothing is wrong with the car, and it seems that 5% drop is due to the charger, as most people who have mpg problems lose a lot more than 5%
     
  8. jdenenberg

    jdenenberg EE Professor

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    It is not the Optima that improves the MPG, it is a faulty original battery that wastes energy trying to recharge (and failing). This particular failure mode may not have been the problem with your original battery. It only happens in some cases.

    JeffD
     
  9. seilerts

    seilerts Battery Curmudgeon

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    A weak battery, whether Optima or OEM, will cause MPG in the 30s.

    There was a guy several months ago who was planning a project to connect two 12V in series (i.e. 24V) and attach downconverted 14V to the 12V bus, so as to effectively prevent the DC converter from drawing power. I don't know if he ever got it to work, but the idea was that, by keeping the DC converter shut off, it would cut overall power consumption by 200W. Anyway, it is possible to get higher MPG by starting out every day with a fully charged 12V, just like it is possible to have lower MPG with a mostly discharged weak battery.
     
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  10. usnavystgc

    usnavystgc Die Hard DIYer and Ebike enthusiast.

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    Good info Seilerts.
     
  11. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    It might just be a case of losing the historical data that the Prius stores to tweak the accuracy of the MPG calculations. Many people report their MPG being a little off for the first few tankfuls after the 12V battery is disconnected.
     
  12. cnschult

    cnschult Active Member

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    Oh I know what happened, I had dropped my car off at a body shop with strict instructions to disconnect negative terminal, I even opened everything up in back to expose the battery, when I arrived to pick my car up I see this gigantic charger connected at 10 amps. The shop owner is a good friend so I simply gave him a kind suggestion that when working on hybrids (he is across from the toyo/lex dealership so he sees a lot of them) in the future he disconnect the battery and only charge at 2amps if necessary.

    makes sense, especially when I mentioned how that for the first week or so after reconnecting a battery (used or new) both my Prii seem to run the ICE more than normal, like I said earlier it feels the Prius has forgotten its an economy car and takes a little while to get back to "normal"

    I'm happy to accept advice from lots of knowledgeable people here (Brit, Patrick, uart, qbee, etc) but when it comes to batteries if Seilerts advice is different than someone else's always, always, always take Seilerts advice he really knows his battery stuff.
     
  13. RRxing

    RRxing Senior Member

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    All of the following info is in the owner's manual -
    When the 12 volt battery is disconnected, the following data will be reset:
    -Average fuel consumption
    -Distance to empty
    -Average vehicle speed
    -Clock
    -Display settings
    -All radio presets are erased

    Also, when the battery is reconnected:
    -Unlocking the doors using the smart key system may not be possible immediately after disconnecting the 12 volt battery. If this happens, use the wireless remote control or the mechanical key to lock/unlock the doors.

    -Start the hybrid system with the “POWER†switch in ACCESSORY mode. The hybrid system may not start with the “POWER†switch turned OFF. However, the hybrid system will operate normally from the second attempt.

    -The “POWER†switch mode is recorded by the vehicle. If the battery is
    reconnected, the vehicle will return the “POWER†switch mode to the status it was in before the battery was disconnected. Make sure to turn off the power before disconnect the battery. Take extra care when connecting the battery if the “POWER†switch mode prior to discharge is unknown.

    In addition, I remember seeing some verbiage regarding one or more of the ECUs having to "re-learn" your driving habits when the 12V battery is reconnected. This could be the source of the MPG hit.
     
  14. cnschult

    cnschult Active Member

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    This is pretty obvious stuff, in addition the auto up/down windows have to be reset and the GPS (if equipped) takes a few seconds to reload. During the "failed" start attempt you get a message not to turn the car off during the loading of the GPS. After that you can power down and restart, the second time is always a "successful" start.

    anyone who disconnects the battery of ANY car while the car is not completely off is just asking for trouble and deserves whatever comes of it.

    This is what I had suspected and given my experiences with the Prius I would have to agree with this assessment and hope my FE returns to normal soon . . . thanks
     
  15. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    Yep, that's the "historical data" to which I was referring.

    It's interesting that many people report the opposite to what I've experienced. That is, when they clear their historical data they often report that their displayed MPG initially goes up. For me however, my displayed MPG went down considerably, and slowly rose back to its correct value only after about 5 or 6 full tanks of petrol. BTW, it's also worth noting that it seemed to be mainly just the displayed MPG that was off. Manual tank measurements tended to indicate that the loss was not a real one!
     
  16. cnschult

    cnschult Active Member

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    That's music to my ears, do Australian Prius have extra fuel pumps since you drive upside down?
     
  17. Britprius

    Britprius Senior Member

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    NO they fill them the other way up.
     
  18. uart

    uart Senior Member

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    LOL no. We do use a liquid fuel (petrol) instead of "gas" in the tank though. :)
     
  19. cnschult

    cnschult Active Member

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    funny, liquid fuel is much more stable and has a much lower flash point than its gaseous counterpart.

    an airplane landing on fumes is much more like to explode than an airplane full of fuel.
     
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