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Keep and fix? Or sell? 185k

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Main Forum' started by possumcar, Nov 6, 2022.

  1. possumcar

    possumcar New Member

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    Another one of these threads. I have been looking at replacing my car with a 2013-2015 Honda Fit with around 50k-60k miles. A Honda Fit in that range will run me about $15,000 plus tax/title and fees. I paid $9300 for my 2010 Prius with 66k miles in the summer of 2017. I have put an average of 23k miles per year since I have owned it. I would buy another Prius but they are so cost prohibitive currently it doesn’t even make sense buying another used one.

    the cost of keep or sell I need help with. I think it makes sense to keep it if I can get another 2 years or 25,000 miles out of it. However there are some things about this car that have been driving me insane.

    the constant mice coming in the car
    The violent engine shudder on cold damp mornings
    The violent engine shudder when driving in any conditions at certain rpms
    The extremely loud and concerning whine that sounds like a motor whirring up to speed (maybe inverter)
    The insane amount of oil consumption, maybe a quart or more every thousand miles
    The damaged front bumper that needs to be replaced and makes the car look like crap
    Ac doesn’t work, every time I have it recharged it seems to last about 2 years then bleeds off
    Car absolutely ragged out inside and out. I carry a lot of construction tools and lumber, potential newer car I plan on pulling a small trailer.

    then there’s the potential unknowns that are bad:
    Hybrid battery failing
    Brake booster failing
    Concerning whining part exploding and failing
    Other unknown maintenance, wheel bearings, definitely needs new struts
    Someone stealing the catalytic converter
    Something on car failing and it has to be in the shop for several days or a week. I lose $300 a day not going to work or have to get my motorcycle out of storage but it’s 250 miles out of state.
    The extremely poor winter performance that has left me high and dry on ice and snow, even with chains on flat ground. Any other car with better ground clearance and powerful front wheel drive would be no issue and with chains it would go almost anywhere.

    the good:
    New Bridgestone ecopia tires this year
    All common preventive maintenance done that are common to this generation and mileage, (no oil catch can though)
    New AGM battery this year
    New inverter coolant and and replaced pump with oem toyota pump, this year
    New iridium ngk plugs this year
    If I sold the car I can probably get almost $6,000 out of it in this area
    Driving the car at highway speeds feels like you are driving a new car, no shudder or noises and drives straight.

    I’m not driving as many miles as I used to so there’s that, if I buy another low mileage car I can keep it longer with less maintenance. Running the numbers assuming I drive 15,000 miles in one year at current gas prices I save about $500 a year assuming I buy another gas car that gets 35 mpg combined vs my current 46 mpg. That’s a worst case scenario, I will not be driving that many miles a year ever again, most likely closer to 8,000-10,000 miles a year.

    would it make financial sense to run it another 2 years versus buying a Honda Fit? I cannot afford a comparable Prius in this market. I can pay cash for the fit, but I lose dividends because I will have to liquidate a few things out of the brokerage account. The silver lining is that I can potentially sell my Prius for a premium and putting that money towards the high inflated cost of a fit. The other thing, I will be storing the Prius for 6 months or more at a time when it’s not being driven I expect battery problems and more mice problems storing it long term. With the Fit, I put the trickle charged battery in it and use stabilized gas and off I go.

    I guess the flip side, is have the bumper repainted and replaced, get the AC fixed again. Have the violent shudder investigated and fixed. I’m thinking what, 3k total? The taxes alone on the fit would be around $800-$1000. Also insurance cost doubles I’m paying $53 a month liability with towing and a fully insured car would cost $95 a month full coverage.

    I would expect the Honda Fit to last 10 years with the miles I plan on driving. It must be a car that gets about 35 mpg combined so Subarus are out, and more expensive hrv, Corolla hatchback etc. also the car must be a hatchback.

    I would appreciate some thoughts on this because I’m going to make a decision soon. I’m looking at another fit Monday.
     
    #1 possumcar, Nov 6, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2022
  2. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    2010, sell it before you have to dump $3000 in for engine or battery or brake actuator or…. You get the idea
     
  3. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Seems like you've already made up your mind. And convinced yourself.
     
  4. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    All you need to do is go buy you a generation 2 for about $2,500 bucks. And that's somebody has used the car similar to you so you're not getting a real nice one in trashing it I bought a four-person commuter car that went to work daily and sat in the sun so the interior was just turning to poo poo but the car was in near perfect mechanical condition so it was perfect for my pool business and electrical business I can load it up carry all my garbage never think about it Don't have to vacuum it for months at a time No worries it's 47 to 49 MPG and I don't even think about the car until the hybrid batteries messing up or something along those lines and that's once every 10-13 whatever it is years.
     
  5. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    I’m with bill norton, with the price of gas as it is just go all electric.
     
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i would sell before you have a major expense
     
  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    Ugh…

    regarding the first quote: my brain is full; what’s the odometer currently reading? Closing in on 200k miles?

    Prime territory for head gasket failure if EGR not touched. See first two links in my signature.

    For the runaway oil consumption Toyotas saying “go pound sand”.

    IIRC, Priuschatter @The Electric Me, went the route you’re contemplating: traded from a 3rd gen Prius to a Fit; he’s discussed it some.

    Couldn’t find much off the bat, but here’s a thread on Prius vs Fit:

    Should I buy a Gen III or a Honda Fit? | PriusChat

    (post 7 at least mentions @The Electric Me)

    my 2 cents: ditch it; it’s junk now.
     
    #7 Mendel Leisk, Nov 7, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
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  8. possumcar

    possumcar New Member

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    As of today 186,000. Not sure where you guys are finding gen 2 Prius for $2500. That doesn’t exist here. As for all electric, I don’t have a driveway and cannot install a charger, often times I am in places for work that have no charging infrastructure so that’s out. Otherwise in another scenario I would entertain an electric car. The prices are insane here, I saw a 2010 just like mine except it was a 3 in much better shape that had 110k miles on it and they were asking 17k. Prius prices are insane here.
     
  9. possumcar

    possumcar New Member

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    You are the best, thanks for the thread links. I will check them out.
     
  10. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    At this time, the hybrid is the best option.
    Unless you only drive a few miles everyday.

    It will probably be at least 20 years before they have enough charging stations up
    and batteries that can easily go at least 500 miles and charges in 2 or 3 minutes.
     
  11. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    If you keep it, a thorough head gasket job (couple of relevant links in my signature) should stop the shakes, which are likely due to (incompressible) coolant seeping past head gasket, into cylinder.

    Any check engine light? The typ code is P0300 and P0301/02, which points to misfire cylinder 1/2. Head gasket failure tends to be at one of those two cylinders, failure usually at the shared wall between the two.

    The simplest albeit more pricey fix for oil consumption is a new short block, with the revised piston rings. Or a rebuild, replacing the pistons/rings with the revised ones Toyota came up with, partway through model year 2014. See attached for more info.

    cheapest route would be a lower mileage engine transplant.

    whatever repair route, clean the complete EGR circuit.
     

    Attached Files:

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  12. possumcar

    possumcar New Member

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    Well,
    Yes I did clean the egr and it was almost 100% blocked by carbon. Seems like I caught it at the right time. Like I said I did all of the recommended maintenance except the oil catch can. The engine didn’t shake until I cleaned the egr circuit. Especially didn’t shake when driving it. My passenger noticed that the check engine light was on because I can’t see it because I have a Bluetooth speaker on the dash. I need to get that code read at an autozone. I may consider dropping another engine in it. I’m having a hard time paying a premium for these old used Honda fits when a new one back in 2017 was about $17,000. They want about the same amount of money as when they were new. I made a few offers that were 10% off of the dealers list price and got scoffed at several times. I’m not paying full asking price for anything. That’s why I drive a Prius haha.

    also not sure about coolant seeping past, the car has never been low on coolant. That is/was the next thing on my list was to flush coolant on the engine side and replace that electric water pump as well.

    I see your links, any idea what a rebuilt engine would cost bought and installed? I have seen what the used Prius engines cost but the used engine is likely to have the same problems as the one I have. My car started guzzling oil around 110k and it seems to have gotten progressively worse over time since then. What I’m saving in gas I’m paying for it in oil.
     
    #12 possumcar, Nov 7, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
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  13. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    At what miles did you clean the EGR? You did the intake manifold as well?

    Regarding misfire codes: more than a few have gone to coil/plug/fuel injector replacement when getting the misfire code. And almost invariably it's the head gasket. If you get a misfire code, say the usual P0301 or P0302, try swapping the plugs/coils from the reported cylinder to another, see if the code moves. Usually it doesn't, which rules out the plugs/coils.

    Leak-down test and/or boroscope inspection of the combustion chamber while the cooling system is pressurized are the usual/best tests for head gasket failure.

    Where is DMV btw.
     
    #13 Mendel Leisk, Nov 7, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
  14. possumcar

    possumcar New Member

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    I did not clean the manifold just the egr. I will report back with the tested codes. DMV, Delaware Maryland and Virginia, it’s also written as DELMARVA.
     
    #14 possumcar, Nov 7, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
  15. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    The intake manifold is the final leg of the EGR passages. There's capillary passages, one per cylinder, about 1/4" ID. I suspect you'll find them all near-fully blocked, cylinders 1 and 2 for sure.
     
  16. possumcar

    possumcar New Member

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    Alright, I got those codes tested today.
    This exactly what it told me:
    Cylinder #2 misfire detected p0302
    Control module performance p0607
    Low or high supply voltage c1241
    ABS

    thoughts? I was not aware the car had this many problems haha. More or less, what’s the least amount of money I can spend to at least get the car in superb drivable condition? I’m not sure how theses codes and problems overlap. Not sure what supply voltage means also, not sure what’s going on with the ABS.
     
  17. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Misfire on 2010, uh oh
     
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  18. nicoj36

    nicoj36 Active Member

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    Just get the newly redesigned 5th generation prius!
     
  19. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    I prefer the poster get a $56,000 Tesla evehicle instead.
     
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  20. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    DIY head gasket job, and clean the long neglected intake manifold, particularly it’s EGR passages, right after.