1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Linux at Long Last!!!

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by daniel, Jul 6, 2006.

  1. NuShrike

    NuShrike Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    1,378
    7
    0
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Five
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tumbleweed @ Jul 13 2006, 01:27 PM) [snapback]285793[/snapback]</div>
    This is the dangers of RPM upgrades where haphazard rpms don't preserve current configuration files due to lack of a centralized QA of the packaging/shrinkwrapping.
     
  2. micheal

    micheal I feel pretty, oh so pretty.

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2005
    842
    2
    0
    Location:
    Lubbock, TX
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Jul 10 2006, 10:33 AM) [snapback]283771[/snapback]</div>
    I have found it fairly easy to get the software that I need with Ubuntu (choosing between all of the available options is the hardest part). There is an application in Ubuntu called Synaptic Package Manager that makes it easy to search for a program or other tools if you know the name of the program. The neat thing is that it will automatically install all the other packages that you need in addition to the core application. I am guessing there isn't such a thing in Suse, I don't know if it is on any other distros.

    I do wholeheartedly agree though it can be frustrating to have to install some things to do what can seem like basic functions. To tack on to what others have said though, Windows doesn't always have what you need at the get go, it is just a lot easier to upgrade codecs or programs in Windows. As Johnnycat alluded to, being a newbie really makes the community support crucial to being able to make the switch. I have had my share of annoyances as well (right now trying to get my graphics card drivers to work), but I am willing to pay that price to be making the switch away from Windows.
     
  3. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(NuShrike @ Jul 13 2006, 12:38 PM) [snapback]285766[/snapback]</div>
    As I type this I am waiting for YaST to get the software list (following the instructions in your link. The reason for getting gcc is that some applications, apparently, can only be distributed as source code. However, this may be an academic exercise since I think it unlikely I'll stay with SuSE. The posters here seem to prefer ubuntu or kubuntu. And I'm still thinking about Mandriva, since it claims to be the easiest for the non-technical user.

    Okay. I thought it was going to install from the ftp server, but it asked for the installation DVD, which is now reading a bunch of stuff. Apparently there's a lot of stuff on the DVD that does not install by default, and which I was basically given no indication of. We'll see what happens when it's done. It installed gcc and now I told it to install the games, of which there appears to be a bunch, including Crafty (chess player). Cool.

    I'll post again when I know how it went. It's still installing.
     
  4. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Well, it's done. It seems to have gone on line for some stuff, but gotten most from the DVD.

    The computer still runs. More tomorrow.

    And thanks for the link to the instructions on installing programs from Yast. (P.S. the graphics on the chess program are dreadful. Simple symbolic graphics would have been fine, Instead it's a perspective view that makes it nearly impossible to distinguish the pieces. Sigh!)
     
  5. EricGo

    EricGo New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2005
    1,805
    0
    0
    Location:
    Albuquerque, NM (SouthWest US)
    Hey Daniel,

    Glad to see you are still fighting the good fight.

    I presume you have figured this out, but just in case: ubuntu (and many other, but not all, distributions) only prepackage free software. Proprietary software such as a codec to watch a commercial DVD is your businesss, and therefore the requirement to get it yourself.

    As mentioned, ubuntu has an excellent installer called synaptic I think that also acts as a front end to find what you want. Be aware though, that the same consideration as above applies: you have to tell synaptic to search the repositories that hold non-free software. I cannot remember the details, but a quick google, or read on the ubuntu website should get you up and running pretty quickly.

    Good Luck !

    BTW, depending on what it is in Linux that attracts you, Mac OS X might fit the bill, and be a whole lot more newbie user friendly.

    Is: Really good unix
    Software rich, both commerical, shareware, and free
    *Much* safer security wise.

    Not: free software from the kernel through the OS layer.
     
  6. NuShrike

    NuShrike Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    1,378
    7
    0
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Five
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(EricGo @ Aug 3 2006, 02:24 PM) [snapback]297287[/snapback]</div>
    I currently programming against it for work, but it nicely combines all the usual software you can download (like Windows), plus all the other extra unixy software such as through Fink/DarwinPorts. It may be a somewhat rougher around the edges than Windows for certain things such as the lack of a polished IDE like Visual Studio (Xcode isn't that polished), it's still a shiny mirror compared to Linux desktop.
     
  7. NuShrike

    NuShrike Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2005
    1,378
    7
    0
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Five
    For another Linux-based alternative, check out this review of Freespire. It might be everything you're looking for, and not getting with SUSE.
     
  8. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    My mom had a Mac. I didn't like it.

    During my trip I discovered that SuSE 10.0 did not recognize my wireless. I could get on line via an ethernet lan plug, but not via wireless. First thing back home I dumped SuSE and installed ubuntu. But when I went to edit the config file to eliminate tap from the touchpad, I discovered that I do not have su rights on my own system. During the install it never prompted me for a password for root or su!

    There is a local Linux club that meets a week from yesterday, and I plan on going. I also planned on searching the ubuntu forums, and if necessary, posting a query.

    But maybe Linspire or Freespire is for me. That description sounds like what I'm looking for. $20 a year for access to proprietary software, and one-click installation, sounds like a good deal to me. I have no emotional attachment to the free software concept. I think it's great in theory, but I'm happy to pay for software that works. And $20 per year is cheap!
     
  9. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2004
    1,748
    1
    0
    Location:
    New Brunswick, NJ
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Aug 10 2006, 11:20 PM) [snapback]301293[/snapback]</div>
    There is no root in ubuntu. :) It uses a sudo based system... if you want to edit a file as root, you just do

    sudo <insert editor here> <insert file here>

    It'll prompt you to re-authenticate. And then you're off.
     
  10. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    JonnyCat: Thanks for that. It worked...

    But ubuntu didn't seem to do it for me, so I did some browsing about regarding Freespire, and ended up buying and downloading and installing Linspire. (While I approve of the totally-free software movement, I am happy to pay for good software.)

    It looks like Linspire may be the one that does it for me. It provides free software where possible, but also provides proprietary software for a fee. And in fact, a free trial subscription to CNR got me programs that play multimedia content and can play DVDs, and it seems to be the easiest Linux I've seen yet for installing software.

    Now I need to take it to an internet cafe to see if it recognizes the WiFi.

    I even lost (of course!) a quick game of chess against Crafty. I was able to view a movie preview on NetFlix and listen to a snippet of Car Talk.

    This really looks like it may be the one that works.
     
  11. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Well, I've had Linspire on the laptop for several days and it seems to be working pretty well. But one important thing I do with the computer is manage the iPod. I have some music on it, but mostly I buy audiobooks to listen to while travelling (I cannot read on the plane, and obviously cannot read while driving) and lecture series from The Teaching Company.

    Apple has chosen to blackball Linux. There is no version if iTunes for Linux, and they won't reveal the information needed for the Linux community to write a file manager program for the iPod. There appear to be work-arounds, but they seem to require a deeper understanding of the OS than I have, and every firmware update intentionally negates them.

    CrossoverOffice allows iTunes to run on Linux, but apparently does not run with all its features, and it sounds from their discussion as though moving files to the iPod is one of the things it has trouble doing, requiring confusing modifications to the iPod software.

    Audible.com also does not support Linux. Perhaps because Linux does not support DRM.

    I am not committed to the iPod. I could use a different player. But I will not switch my main computer over to Linux if I cannot buy audio books to listen to on some sort of portable player. It's looking pretty grim right now.

    Tonight I'm going to my first meeting of the local Linux user group. I hope to come away with a definite answer: either it is or is not possible to purchase DRM-protected content with Linux, and play it on a portable player, or it is not. If it is not, that will end my experiment with Linux (though I may continue to use it on the laptop.)

    That would leave a Mac as the only way to escape from Windows. And that decision would not even come into consideration until my desktop computer needs replacing.

    Sigh!
     
  12. Jonnycat26

    Jonnycat26 New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2004
    1,748
    1
    0
    Location:
    New Brunswick, NJ
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daniel @ Aug 16 2006, 09:56 AM) [snapback]304032[/snapback]</div>
    Dude, you're actually in luck. The iPod may be better supported on Linux than on anything else. Seriously.

    Amarok (probably the best media player I've used on any platform) has built in iPod support. You should be able to browse the iPod via Konqueror, as it's supported. I can't count how many iPod managers there are for linux, but Amarok probably is among the best as an iTunes replacement.

    But I don't know if Linspire removes that code. I know they tweak things, and it's not as easy to install the normal stuff with them.

    You can also buy from iTunes with SharpMusique, which is a very minimalistic graphical interface into the iTunes store. It doesn't support playlists, play media, or anything like that. It just lets you buy music. It does it's job and does it well. :)
     
  13. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Jonnycat26 @ Aug 16 2006, 07:22 AM) [snapback]304050[/snapback]</div>
    I installed amaroK. That, at least, was easy (CNR in Linspire makes installation easy). But that's where the "easy" ended. When I open the iPod from amaroK I get the same jumbled display that I get when I open it with Konqueror: Instead of seeing my playlists on the iPod, I see a very long list of folders. When I open those folders, I see my songs in a disorganized jumble. And I see none of my audio books or lecture series. I see no way to manage my playlists, which is what I need to do. (Albums of music each in its playlist; Teaching Company lecture series each in its playlist, etc.)

    By contrast, Lsongs shows me the iPod with its proper playlists, just like iTunes does, but I seem to have no way to delete files or playlists from, or add them to, the iPod. It reads the iPod but will not edit it.

    Tonight I'll see what the folks in the local Linux users group have to say.