Low Block voltages via Torque Pro App (P0A80)

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by iskoos, Nov 7, 2019.

  1. iskoos

    iskoos Active Member

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    This is for my buddy's 2010 Prius III @ 155k miles.
    We did check the voltages via Torque Pro app. We put the hybrid pack under load when the A/C was running at full blast and the shifter was at Neutral to prevent the engine to start up.

    Here are the lowest voltages of each block recorded by the app.

    Block 1: 14.6
    Block 2: 14.4
    Block 3: 13.7
    Block 4: 13.5
    Block 5: 14.2
    Block 6: 14.1
    Block 7: 13.4
    Block 8: 13.8
    Block 9: 14.1
    Block 10: 13.8
    Block 11: 13.8
    Block 12: 14.1
    Block 13: 14.2
    Block 14: 14.3

    I was expecting 1 or maybe 2 blocks showing low voltage. I got so many. Needless to say these are block voltages. So each block has 2 modules connected in series. Most likely only one will be bad out of each pair.
    Is it logical to replace so many modules or should we be looking at a refurbished hybrid packs?

    I am kind of undecided on what to do.:unsure: We can definitely replace as many modules as needed but if it doesn't fix the issue, it will be a huge disappointment plus time and money wasted.

    If you could share your thoughts, it would be appreciated.

    P.S. I did the same test on my 2010 Prius III @160k miles. And the voltage difference between blocks under the same load (Car is at Neutral, A/C running) were around 0.2volts. Maybe there was one 0.3volts and that's it. And I drained all my blocks below 14volts. The ICE got a hiccup during the initial start (mostly due to very low hybrid voltage).
    My friend didn't let me go that low on his Prius.
     
  2. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    What was the ending SOC before starting car up with ICE to recharge?
     
  3. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    I believe this car has been sitting for a very long time to have that many blocks fail. If you're going to attempt fixing it, you should charge the entire battery and see if those low blocks have actually failed.

    Replacing so called failed modules in this case without a proper charge and balance would give you poor ending results
     
  4. iskoos

    iskoos Active Member

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    Well, I checked the screenshot, unfortunately I didn't pick that parameter to see the SOC. But on the MFD, the charge state was going into one-bar while the warning sign popping up continuously to start the ICE.
    Was it important? I can convince him to redo the test. He was worried that the car wouldn't start up; he didn't want me to continue a bit more.

    His battery pack is really not doing well. Once his car was at my driveway with 6 out of 8 bars showing on the battery. It was a hot day, he turned the A/C on while we were talking and the bars got down to 2 within a minute or two. I couldn't believe how quickly the hybrid battery lost voltage under just the A/C compressor running. I followed the load through the Torque Pro app. When the car is at powered up state (not moving and no electronics on), it drains about 1.5amp from the pack. With the A/C turned on, it goes up to about 5 to 6 amp. 5 amp isn't too much of a load for a pack that is over 1.3KWh
     
  5. iskoos

    iskoos Active Member

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    It hasn't been sitting for the past 2 years I know for sure. He bought this car in last 2017 and put almost 60k miles in two years.
    The original owner was a retired guy and wasn't driving the car much.

    I don't have a charger to charge/discharge the whole pack but I can do cycle each module individually. It would take too much of time though. I am not sure if I would be willing to spend that much time.

    I am still thinking what route we should take with this.
     
  6. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    This is an interesting thread. I also have a 2010 prius battery I'm currently testing. This was removed from a members car and replaced by one of my gen 3 batteries built with Gen 4 modules. This 2010 is one of the worst batteries I've ever seen. Very similar to the OPs description. I've done hobby charger cycles, prolong cycles, more hobby charger cycles and currently doing Prolong cycles again. No significant improvements have been found on probably half the modules. First battery I've ever seen in this kind of condition.

    Based on this thread, the OP is running into the same situation and probably doesn't have near the capability for testing. @iskoos , if your battery is similar to what I'm seeing, you're better off just looking at a replacement. The one I have would need 20 modules to make it a good battery.
     
    #6 TMR-JWAP, Nov 8, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
  7. iskoos

    iskoos Active Member

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    You mean you rebuilt a gen2 hybrid pack by using Gen4 modules and installed it on Gen3 Prius?

    Did I get this right? I am very confused. I know Gen2 and Gen3 battery modules are same but I was thinking Gen4 is totally different form factor and chemistry.

    I have some capabilities to test and cycle the modules. I have hobby grade charger/discharger but can't do the whole pack at once.
    Based on all the inputs I got so far, I am inclined to repeat the test I did. And this time, I will try to record the screen so I can post it here.

    I will see if my friend will be okay with it.
     
  8. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

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    Avoid draining the hv battery to 1 bar. The bottom end of 2 bars is 37%-40% SOC, which ICE starts up to charge. Anything lower than 2 bars, hv battery is in major trouble.
     
  9. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    Corrected my mistype. Gues I'm just so used to typing Gen 2, lol. It was a Gen 3 battery, built using Gen 4 modules (NiMH style)

    Gen 4s had both lithium ion and NiMH batteries available, depending on the model. The NiMH modules are direct replacements for the Gen 2 and 3, just slightly different aesthetics on the top.
     
  10. iskoos

    iskoos Active Member

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    Will gen4 modules interlock with Gen3 pack modules without a problem? Really?
    Are they made off 6500mAH cells?

    I was really thinking all Gen4 cells are lithium. It is interesting Toyota still goes with NiMH technology.
     
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