Lowly fluorescent bulbs outdo Kyoto, Solar, Wind

Only two problems: dimming and color. True, halogens aren't efficient when dimmed, but you can do it. The color of CFLs is all over the spectrum, and changes over the life of the bulb.

Most of the light switches in my house are dimmers, to save energy. I'd have to change switches to change lamps. I am used to the spectrum of halogen incandesent, most CFLs I have seen are discontinuous spectrum and make people, food, and objects look bad, and a lamp that looks sort of OK today may become quite blue in a couple of years.

I'm all for saving energy, and reducing CO2, but I'm not sure CFLs are the way to go. Maybe high-frequency CFLs @ 20KHz, which can be dimmed, or LED/OLEDs. Technology needs to advance.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TimBikes @ Aug 28 2006, 01:33 AM) [snapback]310442[/snapback]</div>

I've switched *every* light in my house with the exception of the outdoor porch light over to CFL bulbs. In my opinion, there's no excuse not to do something like this.

 

I had the same objection to the color and feel of CFL lights, but I couldn't come up with a reasonable excuse not to switch all the lights in my house without feeling like a complete hypocrite. So I switched them. Most places you can get rebates or in-store coupons to make them VERY cheap too. I also got used to the new spectrum in a matter of days.

Dimming is a luxury, when you look at it that way, and I don't think my desire for slightly different levels of light outweighs my responsibility to conserve energy (and save myself money).

Maybe the solution for that is some sort of LCD lampshade that can darken itself to dim the light inside!

 

I find that mixing and matching CFL with incandescent or (ick) halogen only exaggerates the color spectrum issue, and I notice it less when I'm using only CFL.

I've never had a delay when turning them on, so I'm not sure what that's about... and as for brightness, they take a few minutes to get up to full brightness, but once they're "all the way on," I'd say a 12 watt CFL is roughly equivalent to a 60 watt incandescent.

Longevity: how long does a CFL have to last to equal the lifecycle of an incandescent? They use less juice, but judging by their construction they cost more and require more energy to manufacture. Stats?

A promise of 5 years without changing a bulb seems optimistic, but I seemed to be changing incadescents a few times a year, and if there was a power spike I could count on a blown bulb.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Aug 28 2006, 09:15 AM) [snapback]310494[/snapback]</div>

Well, I drive the damn thing... so I can call it like I see it. And as long as you have the bulbs, you can say what you want about them.

However, I have found that the 'name' CFLs are better than the generics that I get at the local store. Specifically the Philips (available at Target) seem to have the best 'whiteness' to them. And the response time is fairly fast, generally only a few seconds, so that doesn't bother me too much.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TimBikes @ Aug 28 2006, 12:33 AM) [snapback]310442[/snapback]</div>

To oil companies! Individuals would probably benefit from the new technologies and a stock market renaissance.

 

I converted all my bulbs to CFLs a couple months back. The delay has gotten much better with the newer technology, I hardly notice it - it's certainly no more than a second, but I think less. Maybe it's a brand thing.

 

I have put CFL's in places that I can. I must warn against putting one in the laundry room; it sucks when a stained shirt looks clean, is put in the dryer, and then you step outside...

Nate

 

ha ha! put a daylight CFL in the laundry room if you want that comparison. They seem harsh and overly blue by comparison though.

 

hmm, i guess i'm not too picky about my light then... since i haven't had any problems with the CFLs we installed a while back. we do get a lot of sunlight from the front windows during the day, but it still is fine at night.

we don't have a time delay when we flip the switch. they come on at about 75% brightness and warm up to 100% within a minute or so. all the ceiling lights are CFLs, but we have a couple lamps that take a type B bulb that we haven't been able to find match for.

 

Ikea has routinly had them for $1.33 each <3 for $3.99> and the ones they sell turn on instantly though it takes about 10 seconds for them to reach full brightness. I have had many of my CF's last five years, I have a few that are eight years. Some do die early but not enough to bother me.

The light quality is also quite high on the Ikea bulbs. I find them different but not less pleasent then regular bulbs.

Dimmers dont really save money compared to CF bulbs, a dimmed regular bulb takes more power then a CF running at full. Dimmers do provide a usefull function of course if you WANT the light dimmed.


In the next few years expect to see LED bulbs with better light color and more durability compared to CF. At some point they will cost less too but that may be a decade from now.

 

I had never seen/heard of the CFLs until last spring when my power company sent me a free one with my Earth Day Care Package. It's a GE 60 watt bulb and I am using it now in the floor lamp beside my computer desk. Haven't decided if I like it well enough to invest in more of them. I haven't observed any delay mentioned in above posts. Color takes a little getting used too, but not too offensive.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TimBikes @ Aug 28 2006, 08:53 PM) [snapback]310959[/snapback]</div>

OK, the full story is that I have lots of X-10 switches and the lights are computer controlled. I uses "scenes", like a button for early morning that turns on the kitchen downlights at 30%, the light over the sink at 50%, the light in the utility room where the dog food is at 40%, and some of the living room lights at 30%. A gentle way to start in the morning. As I wake up I raise the light levels and turn off the lights in the utility room.

These electronic switches do not use as much electricity as a regular circuit when dimmed. If full bright is full voltage all the time, the dimmers reduce the voltage and cut the on duration. At 50% bright, the circuit uses about 50% of the energy as full bright would use.

I'd like to have LED lights with red, green, blue, yellow, and while LEDs, with controls so I could adjust the brightness of any particular color to manipulate the overall color temperature of the light output. Still discontinuous spectra, but a better color balance, and adjustable. The circuitry to allow dimming LEDs actually just cuts the on time, so 30% bright is really on 100% for 30% of the time. If you increase the base frequency from 60 Hz that comes out of the wall to 20,000 Hz going into the fixture (this gets it above human hearing so you don't hear the dimmer whine) you can choose which time-slices to power with fine granularity.

The nature of a flourescent bulb is that a tiny bit of metal, frequently mercury, is used to start a plasma from one end of the tube to the other, even the curly tubes of CFLs. Wall voltage of 110V is stepped up to several thousand volts. The plasma emits high energy photons and electrons which strike the coating of phosphors on the inside of the tube. A mixture of phosphors are used to get a particular color, but each phosphor only emits in a fairly narrow spectral range. The phosphors which produce the biggest downshift, from the ultraviolet of the plasma to a reddish color, also degrade the fastest, so the bulb becomes bluer over time. It's not easy to start and stop a plasma, so dimming is not simple. If the voltage goes too low, the plasma stops. Increasing the frequency and cutting the on cycles can get around this some.

Maybe a better choice in the near term are high-intensity discharge lamps, like the Prius headlights. By mixing the right gasses, you can get a good white. Bright without much wattage. I've noticed what look like PAR lamps in commercial fixtures that are clearly HID. But there's still the problem of having fewer lumens when you don't want them, like first thing in the morning.

 

Sort of off topic, but what the hell...

I just picked up a solar motion detector floodlight for my backyard. I had wanted to get a regular one put in, but on a whim googled to see if there were solar powered versions available, and after seeing that there were, I bought one. It's one of the better ones because the solar panel can be placed up to 15' away from the light itself, which allows me to find optimal placement for both the light and the panel.

One of my friends suggested getting 5, but I doubt the neighbors would like my backyard lighting up like the late, great Veteran's stadium every time a raccoon made a dash across my yard.

I'm not sure how much energy this rig will actually save because I'm not sure how much power the detector actually takes to run. But even if it saves very little, the little it saves won't be coming from the grid.

 

Yeah, the old dimmers just jacked up the resistance across the circuit, I believe. Glad to hear that the newer ones are a lot smarter than that. The small added benefit is that the incandescent bulbs installed in the dimmers will put out less heat thus saving on cooling costs. Personally, we use CFL bulbs and have generally been pleased with their performance. During the day we don't use any artificial light simply because we don't need too. It keeps the house cooler and we turn the swamp cooler on later in the day than we would otherwise.

One thing that gets me about the CFL bulbs is how some light sockets seem to allow the bulbs to come on directely at some level close to 100%. Other fixtures seem to cause the bulbs so ramp up to 100% much more slowly. I've used the same bulb in different fixtures and gotten different results. Any ideas?