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Mars 2020

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by tochatihu, Jul 20, 2020.

  1. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    UAE orbiter is already en route. PRC and US rovers are about ready to go. All 3 sets should arrive 2021 Feb and do their things. An EU/Russia rover will slip 28 months to the next 'fuel-economy launch window'. Its parachute got a bit rippy.

    Other than last one, I don't know what else is planned for subsequent window. Maybe we won't talk about that until seeing if the new ones splat.
     
    #1 tochatihu, Jul 20, 2020
  2. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

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    Then would it not be Mars 2021?
     
    #2 ETC(SS), Jul 22, 2020
  3. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    #3 ChapmanF, Jul 22, 2020
  4. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    First two are en route, with US scheduled to launch July 30.

    I watched PRC launch narration with English translation. Be assured one cannot learn astrophysics that way :)

    For 'the books' PRC had a previous orbiter attempt. Co launched with Russia Phobos Grunt, it got as far as the Pacific Ocean.
     
    #4 tochatihu, Jul 23, 2020
  5. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Phobos-Grunt would have been the first sample-return mission and thus A Big Deal. Colorful art at

    Failed Russian Mars Probe Crashes Into Pacific Ocean: Reports | Space

    Their next shot (mentioned firstly) includes delivery of ESA rover Rosalind Franklin, making it a big deal in a different way. But no sample return. I don't know who will take next shot at that, nor when.

    (Known) Mars bits delivered to Earth as meteorites total less than 30 kilograms I think. They are not nearly as revealing as fresh material would be. Will be.
     
    #5 tochatihu, Jul 23, 2020
  6. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    You may have been following NASA's Perseverance launch. It had an early issue that has been resolved. The way I read it, comms back to Earth overloaded the Deep Space Network because the little guy was still too close to the big guy. One over R squared usually bites the other way :)

    But now all 3 little guys are in cruise and 2021 February will show orbital capture by Mar's gravity. That's the plan. Later the 2 down-goers will demonstrate their skills. Then there will be a helicopter on Mars!
     
    #6 tochatihu, Aug 2, 2020
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  7. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    A bit of antenna mis-aim is one possible solution. Though there are others too.
     
    #7 fuzzy1, Aug 2, 2020
  8. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    disoriented antenna on the little guy would not be my preferred explanation. A long trip ahead and earth and its dishes are going to get a lot smaller.

    So, at what velocity are these 3 little guys? Earth escape is 11.2 km/sec (corrections welcome) and they must be just a bit higher.

    My other question, because 'Percy' is about 5 tons overall - Is this the biggest thing that has been thrown past GEO?
     
    #8 tochatihu, Aug 3, 2020
  9. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    I would offset only the pointing of the ground station antenna. Don't add any new complications to the newly launched piece now beyond the reach of our hands.
    The S-IVB, the third stage of the Saturn V launch vehicle for the moon visits, had a dry mass of 11 tons. I believe these were disposed into solar orbit. At least one came back somewhat recently, was captured for a while by the earth-moon gravity well, then expelled again.

    For active devices that could kept reporting back to us, I can't think of anything heavier. Galileo and Cassini where about 2.5 tons each.
     
    #9 fuzzy1, Aug 3, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2020
  10. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    So little mass we have boosted past GEO and Molniya orbits. How 'local' we still are. Maybe in late 2020s, some substantial mass will be thrown at Mars. Kinda looks like a 2030s thing though. Hope I get to see it, but ooops - mortal being.
     
    #10 tochatihu, Aug 3, 2020
  11. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    At first, by GEO, I didn't know if you meant Earth's gravity well, or geosynchronous orbit. But now I see references to it meaning the later. So all the Apollo moonshot payloads lofted to lunar injection orbit qualify to that question. That adds a lot more mass above CEO, though still below Earth escape.

    While one line suggested that the S-IVB (third stage) launch vehicle had a dry mass of 11 tons, another suggests 13 tons (total third stage dry mass, less the interstage adapter that remained bolted atop the non-orbiting second stage).

    Then add in the payload -- around 53 additional tons, varying by mission. Adding payload and boost vehicles, that comes to about 66 tons per moon trip lofted above CEO.

    And there were 9 of these trips, Apollos 8 and 10-17.

    Not all of those S-IVBs were disposed into solar orbit. Starting with Apollo 13, there were crashed into the moon to stimulate the seismometers left by prior missions.
     
    #11 fuzzy1, Aug 4, 2020
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2020
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  12. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Please, calm my friends. Sure this is the time for least energy launches based upon orbital mechanics. Just a new launch system appears to becoming online.

    Bob Wilson
     
    #12 bwilson4web, Aug 7, 2020
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