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Misfire and shaking but only when i turn

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by HSD man, May 21, 2022.

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  1. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    Hi everyone, I have a problem with my hybrid Auris 2010, 160000km. Motor must be a driving temperature. And if a drive slowly a corner and then press acceleretor slowly, the car body shaking a few sekonds. Any fault codes no coming. Techstream shows a few misfire on cylinder 4 or cylinder 3. If i drive a straight no any shaking?? I chek and cleaning EGR valve and intake manifold, but they were not bad. Now i block EGR pipe and problem is gone. But now fault code P0401 ofcourse comes. EGR cooler i not cleaning, but it see not bad. What you think, what is a problem? EGR valve is little bit expensive, but if sure it is broken, ofcourse i change it.
     
    #1 HSD man, May 21, 2022
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    how is the oil level?
     
    #2 bisco, May 22, 2022
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  3. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    Oil level is max. I just change the oil. And engine not burn oil.
     
    #3 HSD man, May 22, 2022
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  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    have you cleaned the egr circuit?
     
    #4 bisco, May 22, 2022
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  5. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    Yes, i cleaned the intake manifold, EGR valve and EGR pipe. I haven't cleaned the EGR cooler.
     
    #5 HSD man, May 22, 2022
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  6. CR94

    CR94 Senior Member

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    He said (?I think) that he cleaned the valve and manifold.
     
    #6 CR94, May 22, 2022
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  7. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    Sorry, Chrome translate my text automatic. I must be exact what i send.

    This is a original message.
    I know I’m new here, but why all my messages stop and wait for moderator approval?
     
    #7 HSD man, May 22, 2022
    Last edited: May 23, 2022
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    translate did not work
     
    #8 bisco, May 22, 2022
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  9. Lares_Mat

    Lares_Mat Member

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    How slowly? How sharp is this corner?

    Are you accelerating while cornering or at straight drive afterwards?
    Is the ICE on? Is the shaking very slight or a passenger would feel it too?

    I ask weird questions, while the shaking is weird ;)

    If you blocked the EGR and the problem is gone, you have the guilty one - your EGR valve could be stuck opened.
    Now - how can the cornering cause that? No idea... Does the connector on the valve good contact?

    Mat
     
    #9 Lares_Mat, May 23, 2022
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  10. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    I accelerate enough to start the ICE. Best place do it, is traffic circle. When i drive closer the traffic circle ICE stops and then i drive out from traffic circle and ICE starts then i feeling shaking. And yes shaking is feeling very well. TS shows couple misfire cylinder 4 or cylinder 3. But no any fault codes. But never shaking if i drive straight. I try it, slower speed ICE stops, then i little bit accelerator ICE starts, but no shaking and engine works well. And yes, If I blocked the EGR the problem is gone. I can't understand that. Connector is good, and EGR valve slide smoothly. IM I have clean twice and I'm sure it is very clean and small EGR ports are open every cylinder. If ICE is cold, no any problem, and TS I see EGR hold closed. Shaking comes when ICE is normal temperature. One point yet. I must be drive the car about 15-20km on highway before problem comes, if i drive only town, no any problem.
     
    #10 HSD man, May 23, 2022
  11. Lares_Mat

    Lares_Mat Member

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    Is the coolant state stable?

    I could imagine (I'm not a mechanic and have a brave imagination ;)), that after the motor is hot (the coolant too and under pressure) and the ICE goes off for a longer while, if the head gasket were faulty, the coolant could sip into the cylinder (very small amount, the motor is stationary, not turning), it could cause misfireing at engine start.

    No idea what were with the turning thou ;)

    Mat
     
    #11 Lares_Mat, May 23, 2022
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  12. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    The coolant level is stable.
    Yes, I thinking same. But why the problem is never come if i drive in the town? And if I block EGR valve, problem is gone.
    Or if I drive about 80km/h and ICE stops on highway if i drive downhill and then starts again, no any problem.
    Very mystiqueo_O

    I go now to workplace and I take couple of EGR test result.
     
    #12 HSD man, May 23, 2022
    Last edited: May 23, 2022
  13. Lares_Mat

    Lares_Mat Member

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    Now I let my imagination go wild - maybe a leakage (very slight, few drops) into the EGR cooler o_O?

    It could then have something to do with the turning and after blockage of the valve would go too...

    Bu this is so unheard... There is a better explanation for sure.

    Do you have any warranty on this car active?

    Mat
     
    #13 Lares_Mat, May 23, 2022
    Last edited: May 23, 2022
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  14. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

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    I'd do that and see if it helps. See first link in my signature for more information. If you're viewing on a phone, try turning it to horizontal orientation, to show the signature.
     
    #14 Mendel Leisk, May 23, 2022
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  15. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    Not bad idea, but coolant level is stable and nothing coolant gone.
    I have seen leaking EGR cooler couple years ago. Little bit difficult diagnose, because coolant fluid gone, but never see a leak and engine works well. But car was with the Diesel engine.
    And I think if couple drops going the EGR cooler, it dry very fast. Water is very long way from cooler to cylinder.
    But all ideas are welcome.
    No any active warranty.
    I think, I do what Mendel says. I clean the EGR cooler and then see what happens.
    I hope, I can do this on next weekend.

    I make some EGR test today. I think results are good.
    15,62 / 15,89 / 15,82
     
    #15 HSD man, May 23, 2022
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  16. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    Thanks Mendel. I know how I can do it. I have worked a mechanic for over 30 years(y). But now i have a very mystique problem.
    I never heard this EGR or head gasket problem here in Finland. But I looking for more information on internet I found this fantastic forum.
    I know better the diesel engine EGR problems.
     
    #16 HSD man, May 23, 2022
    Last edited: May 23, 2022
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  17. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    All of those observations are consistent with a misfire that is caused by the flow of EGR. It does not occur when EGR is not used (such as before warmup); it begins with moderate throttle (when the system begins to supply EGR), and when you block the EGR pipe, it stops happening.

    For the record, the above behavior is not consistent with clogging of the cooler or reduction of overall EGR flow. In fact, it proves that EGR does flow when the valve opens. That is consistent also with your reported test results,

    which confirm that there is decent flow. It is also not consistent with the valve sticking closed (same reason) or open (the valve is clearly able to close, because the engine is running well at the times when the valve should be closed).

    So the question that remains is: what causes an engine to begin misfiring, only when EGR is supplied?

    The usual answer will be the four EGR passages in the intake manifold, being differently clogged. That is, of course, no problem when EGR is not flowing, but creates a cylinder charging imbalance, only when EGR flows.

    I see that your first post mentioned cleaning the intake manifold, and said it was not bad.

    However, on the weight of the combined evidence here, I would consider it worth a second, closer look. The very small passages that connect to the EGR pipe at the side and emerge in small openings at the bases of the manifold ports, those are the passages of concern.
     
    #17 ChapmanF, May 23, 2022
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  18. burebista

    burebista Active Member

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    Those ones were mine.
    admisie.jpg
     
    #18 burebista, May 24, 2022
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  19. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    I have cleaning intake manifold and EGR ports twice. And I'm sure it is very clean.
    I make one test more, but more on that tomorrow.
     
    #19 HSD man, May 24, 2022
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  20. HSD man

    HSD man Junior Member

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    IMG_20220524_213908_resized_20220524_112733384.jpg IMG_20220524_221259_resized_20220524_112734285.jpg IMG_20220524_123252_resized_20220524_112731572.jpg

    I try what happend if I remove The EGR motor.I left the connector on the motor. Nothig happend, only comes fault code P0401 is normal.
    The EGR valve or motor no know how much motor runs. I think EGR valve first opened some cycle and then ECM looking for MAP value too.

    Is it normal MAF value shows 0,17gm/sec, when ICE is stop.
    And MAP shows 31kPa when ICE is idle and maintenance mode.
     
    #20 HSD man, May 24, 2022
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