Featured More details about Toyota's New BEV plans

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by JosephG, Jun 8, 2019.

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  1. JosephG

    JosephG Member

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    The drive has a new article with some details from Toyota's press conference.

    Toyota, Subaru, Suzuki, and Mazda Throw Their Combined 16 Million Might Behind BEVs

    • Toyota subsidiary Daihatsu is working with Suzuki on small electric cars (possible not news, they already agreed to do this for India)
    • Mazda is likely to join Toyota and Subaru in BEV development
    • There will be a dedicated e-TNGA platform
    • China will be first to get BEV next year.
    • Japan will be next with a variety of mobility devices and small cars next year.
    • Cars will be made for the international market, but there was no timeline given for the US. The US will probably get a performance car as its first BEV.
    • Panasonic, Toshiba, GS Yuasa and various Chinese supplier have been tapped (old news)
    • Toyota hopes to show a solid state battery next year, but they warn it won't be cost effective yet compared to lithium ion batteries.
    • Toyota has moved their electrification goal up 5 years, but 80% is hybrids and PHEV. Of the battery and fuel cell cars, they expect half to be sold in China.
    • Toyota still doesn't believe BEV are as profitable as gasoline cars. They will use their experience with Hino to package services to improve profitability.
    • Toyota warns if regulators don't crack down on emissions they will not meet their electrification goal. Regulation is necessary to drive the shift to zero-emissions vehicles.

     
    #1 JosephG, Jun 8, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2019
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  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    no regulation until at least 2020, possibly 2024 or beyond.

    if something doesn't change by gen 5, toyota may be out of the small hybrid business in usa
     
    #2 bisco, Jun 8, 2019
  3. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    MAKE WITH THE ELECTRIC MR2 ALREADY!

    Or at least an e-Miata!
     
    #3 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Jun 8, 2019
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  4. jb in NE

    jb in NE Senior Member

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    Translated as "people don't want the product we are developing to meet our self-imposed goal, so force them to buy it."
     
    #4 jb in NE, Jun 8, 2019
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    no question. without government incentives, most everyone would be driving land barges. well okay, not counting fossil fuel incentives.

    without any government incentives, i have no idea what we'd be driving
     
    #5 bisco, Jun 8, 2019
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  6. jb in NE

    jb in NE Senior Member

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    Almost all the same cars people drive now. The "incentives" apply to a very limited population of vehicles, less than 1% or so.
     
    #6 jb in NE, Jun 8, 2019
  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i consider corporate tax deductions to be incentives
     
    #7 bisco, Jun 8, 2019
  8. jb in NE

    jb in NE Senior Member

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    And corporate tax deductions apply equally whether the manufacturer makes vehicles you like or vehicles you don't like. How is this related to legislating the use of BEVs?
     
    #8 jb in NE, Jun 8, 2019
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  9. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    .... rather than a fully e-supra?
    ️
    .
     
    #9 hill, Jun 8, 2019
  10. JosephG

    JosephG Member

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    CAFE requirements also drive electrification. That's why companies that are really behind sell their BEV in all 50 states.

    Tesla would not still exist if they didn't have revenue from EV credits from Europe and CARB states (soon also China).

    Both of these are examples of how regulation is driving the supply of BEV, not just tax incentives. If they don't continue to ramp up, then yes ZEV will die since gasoline is so cheap right now.
     
    #10 JosephG, Jun 8, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2019
  11. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    That would be a tall order. That car's already laid out as an FR gasburner. They'd have to do a lot to make an electric version. If they have to go to that much trouble, why not do an electric street toy from the ground up? No compromises needed.
     
    #11 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Jun 8, 2019
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  12. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    just thinking about fossil fuel tax benefits. what would gasoline cost with no government tax benefits to oil companies?
     
    #12 bisco, Jun 8, 2019
  13. jb in NE

    jb in NE Senior Member

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    What would everything cost if the companies making them had no "tax benefits" and paid higher taxes? More.
     
    #13 jb in NE, Jun 8, 2019
  14. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    exactly. so we really don't know the true cost of bev vs gas, all in
     
    #14 bisco, Jun 8, 2019
  15. jb in NE

    jb in NE Senior Member

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    I guess you would have to eliminate subsidies and rebates for fossil fuels, wind and solar and EVs to find out.
     
    #15 jb in NE, Jun 8, 2019
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  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    exactly
     
    #16 bisco, Jun 8, 2019
  17. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Is BMW working on one?
     
    #17 Trollbait, Jun 9, 2019
  18. mikefocke

    mikefocke Prius v Three 2012, Avalon 2011

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    Believe it when you can drive it, when the chargers are up in the parking lot and the service techs have been trained. Then wait 6 months and read owners postings.
     
    #18 mikefocke, Jun 10, 2019
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  19. docboy

    docboy Junior Member

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    If Toyota makes an electric midsize AWD SUV in mid $30k range with 300 mile range, I'm sold!
     
    #19 docboy, Jun 12, 2019
  20. markabele

    markabele owner of PiP, then Leaf, then Model 3

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    Haha, I'd also like it to fly!
     
    #20 markabele, Jun 12, 2019
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