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Multiple problems with my 2008. Please help.

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Cathy Cravens, Nov 25, 2016.

  1. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    Hi. Newbie here. I am having multiple problems with my '08 that all came about rather suddenly. Here are the issues:
    no cabin heat
    intermittent illumination of red triangle/exclamation point light
    intermittent check engine light
    three other lights to the right of the red triangle the I can't recall the names of
    battery level shows one or two bars, then shows 5 or 6 within a very short time
    ZERO acceleration on hills, in fact, I lose speed
    ZERO acceleration when driving 70 ish at highway speeds and then want to pass or merge
    seems to be using oil, but mechanic SWEARS there is no evidence of a leak, nor can I find leaks in parking spot
    Also, the engine sounds....loud/mildly rough at speeds 45 and below (surface streets)

    What on earth gives? This has been a super reliable car with 225,000ish miles.

    Does it seem reasonable that it is the main battery? My thinking is that the power is random and the memory is having issues which causes the light issues. I am not clear on how that would affect acceleration or heat. I also think main battery because everything is happening at once.

    Where do I even start? I did read on one of the threads that no heat could be a faulty valve or low coolant, so I will check the radiator for coolant level in the morning.

    Please help. Thank you.
     
    #1 Cathy Cravens, Nov 25, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2016
  2. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    1. Start by checking all engine compartment fluid levels including engine oil and the engine coolant. Remove the large black plastic panel over the radiator for access to the radiator cap. Do not rely on just checking the level in the overflow container.
    2. Since the check engine light is on, the engine ECU has logged diagnostic trouble codes. You need to have those codes retrieved. If you wish to DIY, get Mini VCI.
    3. Having logged 225K miles, your car's drivetrain may be wearing out especially if you have allowed the engine oil level and/or the coolant level to be depleted. It is not surprising that the engine may be consuming oil due to worn piston rings or valve stem seals (which is not the same thing as a leak.)
    4. Do you see a warning icon in the upper left corner of the MFD: either the outline of a car with an ! superimposed on it, or else a battery shape? If you do not see either of those, then I would not worry about the traction battery.
     
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  3. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    Patrick, thank you very much for those starting points! I added coolant to the overflow tank, but not the radiator yet. Should the level be just below the neck of the radiator fill tube as with my conventional vehicles? Regarding the oil, I had added a little over a quart before posting.
    I used a Bosch scanner from O'Reillys and got 4 codes. P1116, P1121, P1151, and P1121 for a second time. Also, I checked the dash lights again and it is the low tire pressure, ABS, VSC, and maintenance required, along with the random triangle of doom. I just learned (belatedly) that the daily driver "sort of" had AC this summer.

    From the hours I have spent reading threads, it seems that as far as no heat/no AC are concerned, they may be connected to P1116 and P1121. The cure appears to be flushing the cooling system and replacing a valve.

    The P1151 seems to be corrected with a new coolant tank.

    Opinions?

    Thank you again for your time and expertise.
     
    #3 Cathy Cravens, Nov 25, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2016
  4. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    How much coolant did you have to add to the overflow tank? Was any coolant in the tank prior to your refilling it?
    Yes, the radiator coolant should be at the top of the radiator neck.
    Yes, DTC P1116 and P1121 may be caused by the engine coolant valve failing. They also may be caused by a low engine coolant level. If you find the engine coolant level is low, first refill the coolant and see what happens.

    You also need to figure out where the engine coolant is going. Look at the engine coolant pump. That is the most likely place for a coolant leak to occur, as the pump bearing will start to weep coolant. If you see a pinkish stain on the inside of the pump pulley and on the air conditioner compressor housing, that is indicative of a coolant pump leak. In that case the pump should be replaced.

    DTC P1151 is associated with the engine coolant heat recovery system canister failing. Again, a low engine coolant level may cause this code to appear. Unless the car was in an accident which impacted the driver's side front fender (where the canister is hidden in front of the tire), it would be unusual for that canister to fail.
     
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  5. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    Patrick, thank you again for your time. I added about 1/2 gallon to the radiator and tank combined. The overflow tank may have been about 1/4 to 1/3 full.
    I will follow your advice and look for seepage around the coolant pump tomorrow. Is that also referred to as the water pump? If so, that was replaced several months ago. Maybe there is air in the system?

    Thank you very much!
     
  6. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Sounds like air in the system and lack of coolant. The coolant loop wasn't completely filled during the repair.

    It takes a long time to fill this thing back up after draining all the fluid out. Turn your heat on full blast and get the rest of the air out

    Btw, are you adding pink coolant?
     
    #6 JC91006, Nov 26, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2016
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  7. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    First, here are a couple of my threads which are relevant to this topic:
    How to replace engine coolant pump and thermostat | PriusChat

    See my posts #22 and #42 here, as well as the surrounding discussion:
    Changing engine coolant | Page 2 | PriusChat

    The second thread explains how to refill the engine coolant and how to run the coolant heat recovery system pump to refill the canister. See if you can add more coolant, and get the cabin heater to be effective, by following those instructions.

    As JC pointed out, you should be using the correct Toyota Super Long Life Coolant which has a pink color. If other coolant was used instead, that is indicative of poor service practice.

    Yes, the engine coolant pump is aka "water pump", although the former name is more correct as hopefully you do not have plain water in the system. Make sure the newly installed pump is not leaking coolant.

    After you have added as much coolant as you can add to the system, clear the existing engine DTC by disconnecting the negative terminal of the 12V battery for a few minutes, where the negative cable bolts to the car body. Use a 10 mm socket wrench for that task. While waiting, make sure the terminal connections at the battery are tight. Then reconnect the 12V battery and take the car for a test drive on the freeway.

    Hopefully you will find the car's drivetrain performance has been restored. However it is possible that the engine may have been permanently damaged due to insufficient coolant in the system which caused engine overheating.

    Continue to check the engine coolant level on a daily basis (in the radiator as well as the overflow tank) after the engine has cooled down, until the coolant level no longer drops. Then you can declare victory.

    Good luck.
     
    #7 Patrick Wong, Nov 26, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2016
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  8. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    I used the Xerex Asian Vehicle formula, although the blue was all they had. I showed the relevant owner's manual page to the store manage at O'Reilly's, and he swore that there was no significant difference between the pink and the blue. He stated that the blue is newer and that it is backwards compatible. I also read that "it does not have to be Toyota red or pink coolant, as long as the ingredients are the same. As long as it's a phosphated OAT or HOAT...you are good to go."

    I do not know if any of the above is true, however, it appeared to be a pressing issue so I purchased the blue.

    Based on your patient advice, I plan to have the car scanned on Monday and have the system flushed and have new coolant added. I will also have them thoroughly check the canister for leakage. Do you suppose any reputable radiator place can do this? Is it truly more difficult to purge the coolant system on a Prius than other vehicles?

    I will also clear the code once the system is flushed and refilled. If it illuminates again, I presume that the next step may be pump replacement?

    Thank you again. I am very appreciative of your help.
     
  9. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    The Xerex Asian coolant is OK. If you have some time on Sunday, I suggest you see whether you can add more coolant to the system and run the CHRS pump to move coolant into the CHRS canister, following the steps listed in my second thread cited above. You should be able to do the job better than a mechanic who doesn't know what needs to be done on a Prius. Presumably your motivation level is higher, being the vehicle owner.

    No
    Yes

    If the engine coolant is full and DTC P1116 and P1121 come back after clearing the codes, then the engine coolant valve needs to be replaced.

    How do you know the coolant is full? Your visual inspection at the radiator and the overflow reservoir shows full at both places, and the cabin heater works well in producing heat. You do not hear air bubbling in the cabin heater core.

    If you see that the engine coolant pump is leaking fluid at the bearing, then the pump would need to be replaced.
     
  10. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    Thank you, JC!
     
  11. daveatm14

    daveatm14 Junior Member

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    My base line experience I have 240K on my 2005 and all coolant pumps and valves have been replace other than the mechanical belt driven water pump on the ICE on my car. Not sure what codes are but for coolant refresh and proper fill I use the trick of bleed hose from radiator ICE loop radiator bleeder valve barb to radiator ICE overflow tank using the Allen Wrench to control.

    Also on the trans-axle loop use a box end 6pt wrench on valve screw and a loop of clear hose to the plastic fill tank for trans-axle then bleed the valve to exhaust the air. Make note of the ripple wave with the cap off before you drain to aid in proper filling.

    Run in inspection mode after warm to aid in filling and bleeding both loops. Heater on max fan high and run AC compressor if you want. After a warm up cycle or two the coolant recovery pump sounds normal if the bleed screw for ICE loop is used to purge air for filling in my experience.

    When you think it will not take any more coolant shut down. Restart in normal mode and drive hard to get a beverage to take home. When you get home see if you can squeeze any more coolant in. Squeeze radiator hose to burp it as you go. Maybe add some but not much if the bleed goes well.

    First time I had it done at 80K paid the dealer $600+. Now I buy Toyota fluids and spin the wrenches cause it is a dump and fill. Easy to do after you lift a few inches on RV Blocks to get under the car and fit a funnel with a long hose to fill the trans-axle fluid. Had to buy the large socket but I like investing in tools.

    Do the translate fluid at the same time. See 60K service event for the proper nuts to turn..
     
  12. Breef

    Breef New Member

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    Does blasting the heat really work? I'd be interested to know.
     
  13. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    Yes. How else would you expect to get air bubbles out of the cabin heater coolant loop?
     
  14. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    UPDATE
    The mechanic hooked the system up to a pressure thing and it stayed under pressure for 2 hours, leading him to suspect the head gasket.
    I am going to try K W coolant system leak sealer, and I will update as soon as I know something. I am very concerned that it will not work, but I feel have to try before dropping a bit over a grand for a head gasket job.
    Thanks again to all who have offered suggestions.
     
  15. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    if it doesn't work, consider a low mile salvage engine before dropping a grand on a head gasket. all the best!(y)
     
  16. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    I have already found some 50k+ JDM engines at a good price. Still spendy to install. Fingers crossed.
     
  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    no question, just less likely to have another problem.
     
  18. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    UPDATE: After driving for a few days, it appears that the problem could have been either a leak in the head gasket or one in the water pump. I felt sure the water pump wasn't the issue because it had been replaced in the summer. Yeah. Water pump replaced. Gasket sealer introduced in the system following the directions EXACTLY. No leak. The pink crust of doom was seen on the water pump. The leak only occurred when the vehicle was moving, which is why no leak was observed when the car was idling for 2 hours.
    Now I have a heater that blows hot when it's warm outside and not so much hot when it is cold outside. That's my next research project.
    Thank you so much to all of you for the help you provided. It is very much appreciated.
     
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  19. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    well done!(y)
     
  20. Cathy Cravens

    Cathy Cravens Junior Member

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    Nope, nope, nopity nope. Worst Christmas present ever. Blown head gasket and cracked radiator. 1300.00. Ugh.
    Thanks for all of the assistance, though. It was nice to think that I had hope!
     
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