Navigation Clock

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-Current)' started by PiPLosAngeles, Nov 14, 2019.

  1. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    Two questions regarding the navigation clock:

    1. In what sane universe does DST ON mean DST NOT ON? I have DST on, which on every other device that is DST-aware that I've ever encountered means "Automatically adjust for daylight savings time," but in the Prius apparently means "we gave you this redundant way to manually set the clock ahead one hour so you wouldn't have to manually set the clock ahead one hour."

    2. How do you view the current time on the navigation system clock so you can verify if it's set correctly?
     
  2. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    I never bothered to change the time on Nav until just a few weeks ago. I don't use Navi often enough to notice any problem on Navi time setting for the last two years with always DST ON. Apparently, the time setting only affect if you use Navi to show the estimated time of arrival instead of how long it takes to get to the destination. There is no Navi time displayed anywhere except this ETA. Only place you see the set time is on the System Time setting screen on the Navi shown below. You toggle DST On and Off, you will see the time change 1 hour On = +1, Off = -1.

    Navi time change.png
     
    #2 Salamander_King, Nov 14, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2019
  3. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    When I am in that screen there is no time displayed as shown on yours. Just the menu items. I wouldn't care except that clock controls the charging times and I noticed after my power bill reflected charging during peak hours when the car is set to charge during off-peak.
     
  4. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Humm, that's strange. Maybe you were not receiving GPS signal when you did this? My understanding is that Navi clock is set by GPS signal, you just need to let it know wither to observe or not observe DST. AFAIK, the charge schedule timer is set by the MID clock you see on your dash. Navi time has no relation to the charge scheduling.
     
  5. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    It always looks like this, even with a full 180° view of the sky. Navigation shows the car in the correct position.
    [​IMG]

    It doesn't work that way. You have to manually tick DST when DST begins and manually untick it when DST ends. It is not automatic.

    My MID clock is correct, but charge schedule set to start at 10:00pm and it starts at 9:00pm as long as DST is ticked.

    It's interesting (or something) that a fundamental function of the vehicle is controlled by a clock you're not allowed to see and with a DST option that doesn't correct for DST.
     
  6. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Oh, I see, yours is Plus model. Maybe on Plus, there is no Navi clock display even on the set-up screen.

    Yes, it is automatic in a sense that time zone specified time is automatically received by GPS signal. It just needs to know wither to observe DST or not. Therefore, there is no way to set minute on the Navi clock.

    Again, maybe Plus model is different. As far as I know, on Premium and Advanced models with 11.6 inch display, the Navi clock has no relation to the charge schedule. Have you tried to set up the charge schedule using MID display only? In my car, I can set it up on both 11.6 inch display and on MID. I have never tried using 11.6 display to set up my charge scheduling. Using MID display alone should use the system clock set on MID.
     
  7. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    Leave it to Toyota to nullify the potential benefit of automatic time setting by making part of it not automatic.

    In the Plus there is no other way to set the charge schedule.
     
  8. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    I agree. However, the rational had to be that some states and locations do not observe DST. Although you can argue that using GPS, the car should be location aware so it should be easy to know if that location observes DST or not. And the law can change anytime to nullify DST.

    Are you sure? The owner's manual does not specify this function on MID is "if equipped". I think it is available for all the trims.

    scheduling.png
     
    #8 Salamander_King, Nov 14, 2019
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2019
  9. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    I checked 2018 owner manual. Yes Plus model has only one way to schedule the charging timer. That is on MID. There is no other way to link this function to 7 inch multimedia/navigation screen. The set up procedure is the same for 2017 and 2018. It clearly states that only clock you need to set the correct TIME is the one on the MID (on page 185 of your manual). I don't think Navi clock DST setting has anything to do with your charge schedule being off.

    scheduling2.png


    time setting.png
     
    #9 Salamander_King, Nov 14, 2019
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  10. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    No no no. I'm not saying automatically enable/disable DST based on geographic location, I'm saying that US models with DST enabled should advance the clock one hour at 2:00 am on the second Sunday of March and set the clock back one hour at 2:00 am on the first Sunday of November. It doesn't seem to work that way. It seems that the DST setting is just a toggle that adds +1 to the hour in perpetuity until it's disabled.

    I'm certain that it is initiating charging at 9:00 pm even though the MID clock says 9:00 pm and the charge schedule is set to start at 10:00 pm. This will be easy to diagnose by setting the MID clock some random minutes out of phase and observing when charging begins.
     
  11. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Agreed. The Nav clock has nothing to do with the charge timer. That's controlled by the clock in the MID. And as has been mentioned, the DST on and off is simply a quick way to adjust the time by one hour when you enter and leave DST. Nothing automatic about it. Governments are constantly monkeying with DST, so making it automatic would be challenging. It's too bad that the car can't ask the connected cell phone for the time.
     
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  12. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    OK, I see it now. I completely agree with you on that. DST ON should mean I am in DST observing location so it should automatically change the time accordingly, as you said. But again, this is only for Navi's Estimated Time of Arrival display, so for me it did not matter.
     
  13. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    DST has been changed twice in the last 40 years. I wouldn't call that a programming challenge. Every other electronic device I have that is DST-aware manages it: my thermostat, my wall timers, my clock radio, my sprinkler controller, my weather station ...
     
  14. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Aha! I have Casio MT-G wrist watch that has DST setting AUTO, ON, OFF. It is even the atomic clock aware. However, every year twice at the time for the DST time change, even having it set to AUTO, it fails to adjust the time automatically. I have to figure out manual change of time setting. It maybe a Japanese thing.
     
    #14 Salamander_King, Nov 14, 2019
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  15. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    Weird. I have the MTGM900DA-8 and it sets itself accurately several times a day, including DST. I have some "atomic" analog wall clocks that also set themselves every day, but on DST days they tend to change about 7 hours before they're supposed to. I suspect what happens is that they advance the moment they detect the DST status bit from WWV rather than at the correct time.
     
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  16. Salamander_King

    Salamander_King Senior Member

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    Yap, I think it has to do with where I live. I am too far away for the "wave ceptor" function of the watch to receive the radio signal from Colorado where the atomic clock signal is emitted. My atomic clock setting and automatic DST function has not worked on this watch for a long time. Still it keeps extremely accurate time and never needing a battery replacement being a "tough solar".
     
  17. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    Take your watch off at night and set it down with the face up and the band extended forward. Orient it in the general direction of Fort Collins, CO like a compass needle. It will probably pick it up.
     
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  18. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    True, but it was chaos before that. And it's about to start changing again. I've read that there are movements in several places, including Florida to either make it permanent or do away with it. Hawaii and Arizona don't use it -- except for the Navajo Nation, which does. And then, I read that some Amish communities don't observe DST. It's a colossal waste and confusing mess.

    But yeah, the car could have been made to act like your devices. There are lots of things they could have done better. But then I think about my friends living in basically shacks in Honduras and even worse in Africa and I have a hard time getting worked up about the clock in my car. We are SO blessed here! (y)
     
  19. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    I had to do the same with my old Casio. Worked great, even down in Honduras once I did that.
     
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  20. PiPLosAngeles

    PiPLosAngeles Active Member

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    Don't forget that the Hopi do NOT observe DST, and their reservation is entirely surrounded by the Navajo reservation. I have fun keeping track of the time driving across northern Arizona. However, none of this is a problem for the car or the DST setting. It is up to the driver to tick the box when applicable. I just want that box to make the car actually adjust the clock for DST at the appropriate dates.
    Of course we are blessed. Sometimes having something like the Prime that's so advanced in many respects only serves to bring into relief those areas that are not so advanced. It's just frustrating when the really technical, complicated engineering is dang near flawless and then stupid stuff that works even on junk $0.50 electronics doesn't work in the Prime.
     
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