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Need help with relay logic for underbody lighting

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Accessories and Modifications' started by DavidSpivey, Sep 11, 2015.

  1. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    I would like to have a relay turn on my underbody lighting when either the dome lights or the headlights are on. I say the dome lights or headlights because when I unlock the car, the dome lights come on, but not the headlights. I want my underbody lighting to welcome me when I unlock the car. I also want the underbody lights to be on with the headlights.

    However, I really don't know that much about electronics. I know how to purchase a 12v 10a relay circuit, but I don't know how to wire the signals that turn on the relay. Please help me to understand how to wire up a relay circuit like this one:

    One Channel DC 12V Coil 10A 250V 125VAC 30V 28VDC Relay Module Board | eBay

    I expect to put the underbody lighting on the normally open portion of the relay.
    I don't know what to do with VCC/IN. Can I just tap the wires heading to the headlights and dome lights, and pass them both to IN?
    Does VCC need to be connected to 12v+?
    I hear that the dome lights are controlled by GND instead of 12v+. If this is true, how do I determine when the dome lights are on? Is there another signal I can use if the dome light signal is difficult to work with?
     
    #1 DavidSpivey, Sep 11, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2015
  2. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    OK, so I have answered some of my own questions via testing. I now know what to do with VCC/IN.

    I have found out that the voltage change that makes the dome lights fade on makes using them as a source of signal impossible.

    Can someone tell me of a voltage source that comes on full power when the dome lights are on?
     
  3. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    I do not think that there is one that will drive the relay circuit.
     
  4. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    mrbigh, I see that on the signal mirrors, someone has figured out how to get a light on the mirror when the car is unlocked. Do you know where this signal is coming from so I can tap into it?
     
  5. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    I do have the signal mirror covers.This lines are very low current lines to power an LED array.
    The relay circuit you want to implement more likely will overcurrent such lines and probably ruin one of the body ECU.
     
  6. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    In your other post, you said your under body lighting will pull 18 amps. Why are you using a relay rated for 10 amps? :confused:
     
  7. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    xliderider, that was a stupid mistake based on the manufacturer's recommendations. They said (and I stupidly believed them) that each 5 meter strip would need a 10 amp power supply. I therefore figured for a little less than 10 meters, and came up with the figure of 18 amps. Again, that was my assumption based on the manufacturers recommendation. However, today I measured the amp draw when the LEDs were connected, full brightness, white. Guess what? Each 5 meter strip uses 3.94 amps. DUH ME. That means that I will be using less than 8 amps for the entire car.

    mrbigh, do you have any alternate suggestion/location/wire for handling the relay? I really want my car to provide a puddle of light underneath when I unlock it.
     
  8. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    Yes, the OP's proposed relay has a coil that is spec'd to draw 3A at the coil? That is crazy high current draw. :eek:

    Compare to this run of the mill automotive relay that draws current in the mA (milliamp) range, that could be used with the dome light wire as the signal wire to switch power to the under body lighting from the fuse box.

    http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&id=291469674220&alt=web
     
  9. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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  10. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    Ha, good question. I don't know where that 3A came from. :confused:

    Thirty something milli amps should be fine. :)

    The dome illumination wire should be fine.
     
  11. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    Well again the problem is the voltage change for gradually dimming the lights in the dome.
    I tried it with a relay I have. I pulled the back dome cover and connected a wire to the signal for the relay. The thing was flipping on and off so rapidly during the power up and power down fade of the dome lights that I'm afraid it would damage the relay/LED controller after a while.

    Do you know of a place I can tap into the dome lights where the voltage is stable/doesn't fade? Is there some signal wire near the footwell I can use that is just ON or OFF instead of changing?
     
  12. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    The problem U are facing is the reason of "WHY" I didn't recommend your suggested tying point.
     
  13. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    I would recommend getting the signal mirrors with puddle lights, which illuminate along with the dome light.
     
  14. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    I most certainly expect to do so. However, this does not change my resolve to try as hard as possible to come up with a solution that allows me to do this too.

    Thanks for your help.
     
  15. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Were those a Toyota option? And if so, do they just on/off illuminate, or do they fade in/out along with the dome light?

    If they just on/off, then you know it's possible, and you could skip buying the mirrors (unless you want the mirrors) and just glance in the wiring diagram manual to see how they're designed to tie in, and that would be great giant hint you could follow to tie in the underbody lighting.

    If they fade with the dome light, then it's not quite so simple, but you've got a couple options: use a Schmitt trigger to watch the dome voltage and power your relay when it crosses a threshold and stop when it crosses back (a Schmitt trigger has two slightly different thresholds, one for each crossing direction, exactly so it doesn't do what your relay was doing and buzz on and off when the signal is near the crossing). Or, it might look extra cool to build a voltage follower and really have your underbody LEDs fade on and off like the dome light. :)

    That would be a lot like my own first car project out of college, when I bought a Mazda 323 and it really bugged me that in the factory radio (!) the illumination didn't dim with the rest of the dash, even though the radio did have a separate terminal for illumination power. I didn't want to risk just adding it to the load on the dash dimmer, so I made a follower using an LM358 opamp and LM317 regulator, worked great. These days it's probably as easy to get a variable switching regulator as it was then to get the 317.

    I get the sense that this project you've given yourself will require you to go a bit deeper in electronics than you have before ... maybe that makes you afraid of TMI but it sounds pretty cool to me. My favorite way of learning new stuff always has been to give myself a project I can't do without learning it. :)

    Anyway, if you're game to do it, you are still likely to find the wiring diagram to be an important reference for you. The questions you are running into are exactly the sorts of questions it answers. You may very well find a generous PriusChatter to solve them all for you, depending on who is between projects and has the time to do it (that isn't me at the moment, unfortunately), but if you don't find someone to step up, at least you know where all the information you need is, and the forum is still here when you have specific questions about it or you get stuck; a lot of people who might not have time to work the whole thing out for you probably still have time for pointers when needed.

    -Chap
     
  16. DavidSpivey

    DavidSpivey Junior Member

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    Thanks for the information, Chapman. I am similar to you about learning things as I go along. A month ago, I would have said I know nothing about cars. Now I can say I know slightly less than nothing. :-D
     
  17. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe the puddle lights fade on and off along with the dome lighting.
     
  18. mrbigh

    mrbigh Prius Absolutum Dominium

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    I do not have them connected in that way; my white puddle lights go on solid as I approach the vehicle and touch the door handle; but this are only a few LEDs load.
     
  19. xliderider

    xliderider Senior Member

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    Then, perhaps you can help the OP out by telling him what wire you use for power to your puddle lights? The OP will use a relay to switch power to the load, so only a light current will be needed to switch the relay via the coil. Main power will come from the engine fuse box.
     
  20. sfv41901

    sfv41901 Masta S

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    David,

    What trim level Prii do u have?

    If u have the footwell lights, maybe u can u this to serve both ur needs. They turn on when u unlock (can't remember about approach) & they stay on with the headlights

    VS980 4G ?