New battery tech

Nice but one of the problems with solid electrode are the mechanical differences between charged and discharged state. I've seen some impressive photos of charged and discharged LiON, test electrodes. It is one reason why they wear-out.

MIT is doing some interesting work in liquid battery technology where the 'charged' chemicals combine in a cell and the reaction products go to holding tank. The advantage is very low internal resistance, no mechanical issues, and the range is a function of tank size. My interest is aviation . . . looking for a high energy battery solution.

Bob Wilson

 

Good stuff, we don't know which of the new battery technologies will be commercially viable, but we can expect to be at double the density and perhaps 60% the cost per kwh before 2025 given all the possibilities.

 

Going off subject here: Bob, why can model RC airplanes fly on battery but not full scale? Do the electric RC's have more wing per weight?

 

If you are going to carry people then you want at least 1 hr extra fuel which adds quite a lot of battery weight. If there is a problem at an airport you want to be able to land somewhere else and have the extra fuel to do it. With RC, I guess its ok to crash and it happens often. Perhaps musk will work with bezos on some verticle landing electric delivery drones. Then if you run low on fuel, the drone could be picked up in a truck. After densities go up then perhaps we can have piloted battery planes.

Once a Joke, Battery-Powered Airplanes Are Nearing Reality | MIT Technology Review

 

They have but they looked more like powered sailplanes than anything else. Then there are 'solar powered' ones and they really are 'nuts.'

Bob Wilson

 

What is the percent of passenger/cargo payload in the RC plane? Approximately zero, right?

Mike

 

Where did you run into this info? I saw it recently too, but not sure if it was in my Solid State Chem course (MIT) or Solar Energy course (Delft University)

Did look very promissing, but details were scarce.
(I keep reading so bloody much info, but keep forgetting it too, like the solid that could bind H2 at roomtemperature in amounts equal to a same volume high pressure storagetank...)

 

Well some of the do have a fake pilot installed. <VBG>

 

An engine isn't necessary to sustain flight if the wing surface area is large enough to provide a sustainable amount of lift force and the plane starts off with enough thrust. Before powered flight, aeronautic pioneers flew gliders. During WWII, Allied Forces used a glider called the Waco CG-4A to carry up to 5000 pounds of cargo at a glide speed of 65 mph to cross the English Channel during D-day after being initially towed to 150 mph.

 

Ok so you have a problem at the airport you are going to, and what you just let the aircraft die? If you have a pilot and a payload, and we are not at a time of war, you are going to want to be able to let the pilot get out of harms way. That means power. You use gliders only if you don't have to really go anywhere, or if the pilots life is expendable.

 

You miss my point here - just as an efficient land vehicle -like the Prius- does not require the power all the time - an efficient aircraft does not have to have power on all the time. If you have a lighter than air aircraft like an airship - you need even less power for sustained flight. For example, in the 1930s - Luxury Passenger Airships crossed the Atlantic Ocean. The most efficient way to use electrical power on a standard Prius - is to lessen internal power plant-transmission resistance so - on flat smooth road surface- the electrical motor cancels out any internal engine-transmission resistance while the Prius is on a *roll* - extending the distance the Prius goes on its own momentum while the power (plant) off. Essentially - efficiently driving the Prius translates to *gliding* on the roadways. It is because gliders are more efficient energy design that they need less power to sustain flight. For example, the first powered aircraft - the Wright Brother's plane - was based on a previous successful (Wright Brother's) glider design platform. Essentially - the engineering process is: make a glider platform, make a light power plant, adapt the power plant to the glider platform , and test ...(repeat process until you get acceptable flight performance)

Another interesting aircraft platform are man-powered aircraft design( of which there have been are still are prize-competitions for). One recent man powered flight aircraft which was in the news recently was the Sikorsky prize winning human powered quadcopter [1]. These Human Powered Vehicles (HPV) are limited usually to one trained athlete whose output equates to about 1/3 horsepower for about one hour (before he tires out) - that translates to a pretty small electrical motor and poly lithium ion battery pack.Yes - having a power is important, but you don't always need that much power - The power needs for flight is an engineering performance-functional balancing act..


[1] AeroVelo Human-Powered Helicopter Wins Elusive $250,000 Sikorsky Prize! | Inhabitat - Sustainable Design Innovation, Eco Architecture, Green Building