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New Prius owner with questionable hybrid battery

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by Prij1, Sep 8, 2022.

  1. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    The background:
    • Purchased a 2007 Prius with 80k miles.

    • Great condition for a 15yo car. It was a corporate car maintained regularly at a dealer.

    • Seller provided a recent $1500 receipt for a refurbished hybrid battery and installation.
    • Average fuel economy showed 45 mpg. It seems to hover between 40-45 over the past couple weeks.

    • Mechanic got the battery from a wholesaler but wouldn’t give the name. The housing color is green.
    I subsequently got the Dr Prius app:
    • Life expectancy test topped out at 40%. This was achieved during the morning.
    • Prior tests done during this heat wave was as low as 25%
    I’m wondering whether the Dr Prius results can be questionable… or I used it incorrectly… or there’s a scam going on.

    The mechanic gave a 1 year warranty but I didn’t like their vibe so I want to be careful how I approach them.

    What could be going on? What do you recommend as next steps? Thank you for assisting this Prius rookie!
     
  2. alftoy

    alftoy Senior Member

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    Meg&Bear and ANDRAS RIMELY like this.
  3. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    congrats and welcome!

    regardless, there is no warranty unless you get dash lights and appropriate trouble codes.

    drive and enjoy, repair if and when necessary. it's a 15 year old car, keep expectations low, and hopefully you'll be pleasantly surprised.

    make you you do all required maintenance.
     
  4. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    Drive the PP out of the car. When it dips a little more below that 44 miles or whatever you're saying by then you'll know it's either you're driving habits or it's the car coming from gas cars and pretty much driving with a heavy foot which is me all my life I just moved to prii. About 4 years ago and even when I first sat in the first one I was getting 47 miles to the gallon and the car I was driving was rated for 47.1 new from the factory. And that said car was approaching your car's age two owners right at 260K. That same car the '09 is still getting that mileage today and it went down to a low of 37 ice engine on all the time when my hybrid battery was seriously failing fan on in the back never turning off all that like you read about here sounds like you may be headed to that soon. And if you do hit that if you can muster the belief that a new battery is a good thing do it because I bought a brand new Toyota battery and the car went right back up to 47.1 even with bad brakes. And is never look back since this was about 9 months ago something like that 7 months ago and this is an old '09. We also have two generation 3s we don't want to go into that now
     
  5. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    Mechanic and seller are different people.

    Mechanic seems like a small family business. FWIW their Yelp and Google ratings are about 4.5

    80k is legit per clean Carfax.

    Are Dr Prius test results enough evidence for the warranty? Or an independent assessment from my mechanic or a Toyota dealer?

    Actually the seller and mechanic never provided any warranty document which is another reason I’m suspicious.
     
    #4 Prij1, Sep 8, 2022
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 9, 2022
  6. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    no, you need a code with any company.

    and with no warranty, it would be an issue anyway. is doc prius always correct? i don't think so. but that doesn't help you determine the health of the battery.
    see if you can run the block voltage test under load, and post the results here.
     
  7. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    Here are my block voltage readings when the mIn/max voltage difference was highest (0.40v), while cruising at 40mph.

    How does this look? And please let me know if the reading should be taken under a different situation.

    9C09C35F-07B7-4714-8C14-81D67C3301C6.png
     
  8. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    BTW I’m guessing many have seen the article from Arts Automotive that shows their assessment of battery condition based on min/max volt difference. I’m hoping this is a good measure since my battery seems fine!

    0.20V = 100% acceptable efficiency
    0.45V = 75% acceptable efficiency
    0.70V = 50% acceptable efficiency
    0.95V = 25% acceptable efficiency
    1.20V = 0% acceptable efficiency
     
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  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    agreed, and art knows what he's talking about. you can sleep peacefully now :)
     
  10. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    I appreciate everyone’s responses and walking me off the ledge as I learn this new world!

    I decided to check the block voltage again this morning and then this happened. It didn’t stay this way, but given how much it fluctuates it was hard to see any patterns. What does this mean and should I be concerned?

    A25B116C-8038-4155-A000-F87E1F363264.png
     
  11. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    No real concerns - yet. Brief voltage differences up to 0.5V are normal. Having the pack voltage go "into the red" is kind of a software error. On that screenshot you're braking moderately, which charges the pack. Voltage is higher during charging but will drop some as soon as charging ceases.

    If the pack voltage was 270+V static (at no amps), then the ecu might get unhappy.

    Really, unless (until) you get performance problems along with codes, all you can do is drive the car. Read posts here on the forum. Educate yourself about battery replacement and what else can happen on these cars. Enjoy.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  12. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    @mr_guy_mann and @bisco Thank you for assessing my block voltages!

    So it seems my battery is healthy enough and in fact according to Arts Automotive it is running at about 75% efficiency.

    But going back to my original post, the Dr Prius life expectancy test was only 40% at best.

    How do I make sense of these two conflicting results?
     
  13. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i'm not sure doc prius can be trusted
     
  14. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    This kinda comes full circle to my original post when I said “I’m wondering whether the Dr Prius results can be questionable”!

    If it can be trusted, my layman's interpretation is that my battery is functioning as it should but doesn’t have much life left.

    Or maybe it’s partially trustworthy because the block voltage readings are just readings but the life expectancy test is trying to predict the future.

    Or none of it is trustworthy so if I really wanted to know the battery health I should take it to a Toyota dealer or hybrid mechanic.

    I’d love to hear a reality check!
     
  15. highmilesgarage

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    buy a sleeping pill and throw away that Dr Prius App, you're too obsessed about an app that doesn't tell you WHEN it's going to break. In the world of electronics anything could happen ANYTIME.. you're lucky that the mechanic gave you a 1 yr warranty and you don't have any codes showing up. Did you over pay for this car?
     
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  16. Another

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    Refurbished batteries using used cells are a crapshoot.
    Dr Prius app is useful to a point. Look at your IR readings generally and your cell #9 voltage.
    Looks to me like you may have a failing cell or one that needs further driving to balance it. Hard to know more without knowing where the battery came from.
    Why would anyone not want to disclose the source of the battery unless they already knew it was crap? For $1500, they should have gotten a good replacement with new cells.
    Also as @Tombukt2 noted, unless you’re used to changing driving habits to Hybrid methods, your mpg can be degraded substantially. Use cruise control as much as possible, it really helps.
    Finally, check the MAF, air filter and even plugs despite supposed low mileage.
     
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  17. highmilesgarage

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    this is merely a guess based on what is seen at that instant, if you could tell us what day it will fail then for sure this app is better than Nostradamus. Even Nostradamus make his predictions vague..

    One sided claim from OP (maybe he didn't just politely asked the shop, or the shop just really don't know) I'm interested on where you could get new cells for $1500! I know they are selling modules..
     
  18. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    A new rack of cells in a metal case like you have now from toyoda is was about 1500. It needs you're front end of your battery you're running now! Just bought 7 or so months ago from toyoda 8. Apex NC. ?
     
  19. Prij1

    Prij1 Junior Member

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    That’s what I was wondering too when I asked, politely. I felt some defensiveness and their response was that it was a wholesaler and I don’t need to know because the warranty would be with the mechanic not the supplier.

    Ok I won’t obsess about the battery health since it seems to be running fine now. But you can’t blame a first time hybrid owner for being a bit cautious!

    I will eventually look for the supplier name on the battery and hopefully it’ll be a better known one that will give me a little peace of mind.

    Thanks to all for educating me.
     
  20. Another

    Another Senior Member

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    I'd not over worry it either. Drive it a while and see if it either improves as Prius batteries often do with driving or throws a code in which case you can file a claim.
     
  21. Moving Right Along

    Moving Right Along Senior Member

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    If you have a 1 year warranty with the mechanic, then you don’t need to worry about anything for a year until / unless something goes wrong. If your battery charge gauge starts bouncing up and down rapidly, you have noticeably less power, or your fuel economy drops to the 30s or worse, then it’s time to start asking about fixing or replacing the battery. But if those things don’t happen, then the car is fine and you might as well enjoy it!