NEW!!! Service Bulletin for Engine Knocking at Startup T-SB 0012-10

Here's what I don't get. The TSB is to address a misfire. But when the engine is making the clanking noise, it doesn't appear to be shaking, at least in the videos.

I'd think that if it were misfiring, it'd run rough and shake.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that it's probably still the VVT-i controller malfunctioning. That's a mechanical noise, not a misfire.

I'm curious, when this happens, does anyone see any smoke (likely black) from the tailpipe? That'd be consistent with a misfire.

Ahhh, Toyota, if only you'd have recalled them instead of issued a Mickey Mouse TSB. But it's a start, anyway.

The intake manifold is not going to "blow up" (whatever that means).

Whatever the problem is might cause no long term performance problems with the engine, or it might.

My belief is that, if the car is subject to CA emissions testing (I don't know whether it is or not), some years from now it might not pass emissions since the engine is worn and is polluting more than it should. If that's not the case, power might be a bit off and it'll burn more oil than usual, and you probably won't notice the difference.

That's how problems like this usually manifest themselves. I contend that it's a valvetrain issue, which might or might not have an effect on engine longevity as the years pass.

The good news is, I don't own a GIII, so I don't have to worry about it.

 

I noticed the same thing when I first saw the videos some months ago, but many have reported initial violent shaking (even rocking from side to side) so maybe the videos didn't capture it (or was too late in doing so).

Of course I was being sarcastic. I predict no long term malfunction even if nothing is done.

 

My problem, I am now leaning towards condensed water in the intake manifold and fuel after a very cold evening.

After the first time it happen I added heet to the tank. It's been more cold at night and no problem starting up with these much colder temps, so far.

The computer must be trying to compensate for the moisture in the air fuel mixture that's getting into the engine. That might explain why the idle goes normal for some people when they floor the gas pedal, signaling the computer for more fuel to burn in the cylinders.

By the way I saw no smoke white or black.

Time will tell.

my2cents.

 

My last one was an '09 Jetta TDI. One of the problems they and newer ones are having is a rough start/no start situation. The intercooler hoses are filling up with a condensation/oil mix and it freezes, so either the car starts and runs rough, doesn't start or starts and ingests the goop and at times, destroys the engine. That right there makes me wary of nailing the throttle on the Prius, especially if it is a condensation problem in the intake.

When the problem first popped up on the forums, I pulled the hoses and sure enough, a fair amount of water and goop poured out. It was to the point that I was cleaning out the hoses ever few thousand miles so I wouldn't have a starting problem. A lot of guys had to have their cars towed to the dealer because of the no start.

That and a lot of other problems led to the decision to trade in the VW and buy a Prius. Now, VW had a fix out, but you had to have a long history of bringing the car to the dealer and have them duplicate the problem. The fix is on backorder, if you can even get it, and worse yet, guys that have had it done have had the problem come back.

 

I just sold my Prius, will the new owner need to monitor this forum regarding TSB's and recalls? I've heard the knocking noise originating in the engine compartment and has occurred less than a handful. Less than 50 degrees, normally when vehicle is not parked inside garage.

I can't say I'm surprised with Toyota's reaction to concerns of Prius owners who have experienced this unnerving rattle during start up in light of TSB being issued.

 

Good grief, color me reassured (with the additional prospect of oil sludge on my mind, a former Toyota problem).

I don't really have time to heckle the dealership over this, so it may be time to trade up.

 

Believe me, you don't know scary problems until you've owned one of the VW clean diesels. Besides the I/C problems, there are problems with the injection pumps where they can go south and take out the fuel system to the tune of $8000. Exhaust systems can go up to $4500 for replacement. Turbos have been exploding, $3600. And on and on.

So far, my Prius hasn't exhibited any of the shake, rattle and roll. If it did, I would go after Toyota to make good on it. If they refuse, I checked on new intake prices and it looks like the parts can be had for under $300, I would do the job myself, or take it somewhere that would.

 

Egads, VW nightmares aplenty!

The dealership is apparently more than happy to do the repair if I pay out of pocket. They are the only ones who I'd trust in the area to get it done.

If I don't interrupt warmup cycles, it doesn't happen in any case. It is hard for me to justify $500 for a repair that should be covered by the warranty.

 

I normally run my car in ECO mode, but lately I've been driving it in Normal to get more heat on those cold days. Maybe the higher engine temps are burning off the condensation and that's why I haven't had the problem yet.

 

We had this problem ie. rough, misfiring engine (intermittent) at startup that ended up being a injector problem. Try a fuel additive . Four cylinder motors always sound horrible when they misfire.

 

They got the code P301 off my car's computer didn't have a check engine light on either.They called it a pending code waiting for it to do it again then the light would come on.So you don't have to have the light on to get it fixed the manifold is on the way.Hope it fixes the problem.

 

Just an update to my situation.

I never heard back from the dealership like Toyota Care said I would. So after about a week I called Toyota Care again, gave them my Reference Number and they said I should expect to hear from the dealership by Monday. Dealer called me back in about 15 minutes after getting off the phone with Toyota Care. They asked me to describe the problem with my Prius and for the TSB number. So I explained again to them. He has scheduled me to come in and leave the car for a day or two. He then called back again saying his manager knew about the issue and they had already fixed one Prius and they would order the parts for mine. Five minutes later called a third time saying parts manager said they had to reproduce the issue before ordering the parts because "the parts are not returnable."

So I'm scheduled to drop it off Tuesday. Not getting my hopes up that the issue will be resolved. We'll see.

 

lol, sounds like they're finagling/backtracking. Well, you've procured more action out of them than I have mine (verbally), though I suspect your dropoff effort may be for naught (as was mine). Here's to hoping I'm wrong. Be sure to give them the procedure that is most likely to make it recur.

I can't understand why they'd need to return the parts...the problem is documented in the TSB. It's clearly a design problem.

 

My dealership will fix the mount issue per the TSB, because the TSB for the mount merely states that the customer "complains" about it. I'll send you a PM.

 

^GRRR, I also mentioned that one but they also denied due to inability to reproduce.

Under Warranty info on both associated TSBs, it states:

"Warranty application is limited to occurrence of the specified condition described in this bulletin."

That looks like an out for the dealership since it can easily be construed to mean occurrence at the dealership.

 

It took two VW dealerships and the factory's intervention before things were starting to get fixed on my &%#@!& VW. Just stick at it. Remember, big fleas have little fleas.

 

I won't beat my head against a wall (well, anymore than I'm doing on here)...the other closest dealership is 2 hours away in Las Vegas.

I suppose I could buy a junker to drive while I leave the local dealership with mine until they tell me the've applied the TSBs. ;-)

 

Do it. And call them twice a day daily and they'll give in in no time.

 

That might be enough to irrevocably burn bridges with them...I'm not sure how wise that would be, lol.