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New to forum, new to Prius, new problems

Discussion in 'Newbie Forum' started by Sublimelyoblivious, Jun 5, 2019.

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  1. Sublimelyoblivious

    Sublimelyoblivious New Member

    Joined:
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    Missouri
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    N/A
    First, Hi! Thanks for all the great info on here, I apologize for my first post being issues, but that makes it fun right?

    I purchased a 2012 Prius v wagon in March. Seemed fine. Recently started having weird vibrations or rumbles when letting off the throttle, sometimes while accelerating. It was apparently not alarming or noticeable to passengers. I asked a mechanic friend (who does not work on Prii) to drive it and after research he was worried it was transmission related and maybe needs a fluid change or worst case scenario...
    I needed a software update so I asked Toyota to take it for a spin and tell me what they thought. Fuel injectors are gummed up. So ran some cleaner through it. But, doesn't seem to have helped. Now this is getting worse. It's much more noticable and also includes a rattle. Happened on a steep incline once and seems to occur consistently when the bar is around the halfway point on the meter. A little above or below and the car acts a fool.
    I've asked others with varied responses. Spark plugs, coil packs, cat converter. I research on here and I'm thinking definitely the EGR valve and related components. More research leads me to the TSB for the warranty enhancement. I called Toyota and scheduled a look-see, but that's 2 weeks away. But the guy basically said that my problem didn't involve rough idle at cold start but they would check. I'm pretty convinced this is why it's acting boggy and weird at times.


    Before realizing this might be the issue i was convinced to run a bottle of seafoam in my fuel. So that's where I'm at. I don't think that will necessarily hurt (I hope) but I also don't think it will help.
    *I have a few other issues with this car as well
     
    #1 Sublimelyoblivious, Jun 5, 2019
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  2. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

    Joined:
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    Vehicle:
    2019 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    How’s the engine coolant level?
     
    #2 Raytheeagle, Jun 5, 2019
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  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
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    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    How many miles? It may be too far gone, the head gasket is failing, but anyway:

    DIY cleaning of the EGR and intake manifold is not that tough, and probably the shortest distance between two points, comparing to the hoops you'll need to go through with a dealership.

    The simplest way to see where you're at, is to check the degree of carbon build up in the EGR pipe, a stainless steel connecting pipe between the EGR valve and intake manifold. Watch @NutzAboutBolts video #16 here:

    Nutz About Bolts Prius Maintenance Videos | PriusChat

    Good thread:

    EGR & Intake Manifold Clean Results | PriusChat

    Another:

    Oil Catch Can, Eliminate that knock! | PriusChat

    Somewhat tools worth having:

    E8 Torx socket (mandatory)
    E6 Torx socket (optional, but good to have, to remove the throttle body studs from intake manifold)
    3/8" ratchet wrench, regular and long handle, flex head, you can never have enough
    1/4" ratchet wrench, or 3/8" to 1/4" reducer
    Ratchet extensions: you can never have enough
    Long needle nose piers, straight and bent tip
    Ratcheting 12mm box wrench (optional, but makes disconnection of the EGR cooler from exhaust easier)
    Torque wrench (3/8" and 1/4" both good to have)
    Floor jack and safety stands (or ramps): basically some method to raise front, if you need to take underpanel off, which you may need to, both for access and to recover dropped items.
     

    Attached Files:

    #3 Mendel Leisk, Jun 6, 2019
    Robert Holt, Sublimelyoblivious, Skibob and 2 others like this.
  4. Sublimelyoblivious

    Sublimelyoblivious New Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
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    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    N/A
    Coolant level is good. It has 117k miles. But I don't feel qualified to take it apart myself. I basically know how to change oil, on my truck.
    I watched a dozen or so videos about the Prius EGR cleaning, and it intimidates me.
    I have been looking over the catch can, and wondered if a local shop would install that for me? I'll drop in this afternoon and ask.

    Question: why did you go right to head gasket? I've read that, too. Does the bad EGR lead to blown gasket?

    My basic status is while I understand a great deal about what I've learned, I am not necessarily qualified to do that work. Aka, I'm scared to.

    (I also have a missing fender liner, that I *think* I can handle installing) but outside of that? A little nervous Nelly to do that myself.
     
    #4 Sublimelyoblivious, Jun 6, 2019
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    boston
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    2012 Prius Plug-in
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    Plug-in Base
    welcome!
    don't trust the dealer to understand the egr problem
     
    #5 bisco, Jun 6, 2019
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  6. Sublimelyoblivious

    Sublimelyoblivious New Member

    Joined:
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    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
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    N/A
    Now I'm really freaking out. I kinda thought I had this figured out and could get Toyota to do the EGR work on warranty enhancement. But concerned they wouldn't clean the parts they didn't replace... not to mention even convincing them this is the issue.
    But now head gasket, too? That prognosis is a little overwhelming.
    What are the odds a person like myself, who has never done anything more than change a tire or oil/ filter change (on a gas engine) could do something as complex as this? (Head gasket, cleaning etc.)
    I live in a little midwestern town. There are no hybrid shops. Toyota is 30 miles from home. What are my options? Because it's sounding like I need to park it until I've found out what is really going on.

    Seems like any 'ol shop could help diagnose a head gasket. Shouldn't need to drive 30 miles if I could drive 3 to look into that....
     
    #6 Sublimelyoblivious, Jun 6, 2019
  7. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Trying to rationalize why that is:

    Both Toyota and the dealership are mostly greed driven. They pay lip-service to various lofty aims, but yeah...

    Also, the dealership gets their playbook from Toyota. Toyota has made a statement about the EGR clogging issue (For Toyota Canada it's Warranty Enhancement Program, SOLH-W31-1A, issued August 2018), but it's very guarded, and stresses "the majority of vehicles will not experience this condition". They underline and italicize that statement.

    I don't blame them; it would be expensive to openly acknowledge they screwed up.

    They could:

    1. Acknowledge the EGR and PCV systems are trouble prone, and pretty much EVERY 3rd gen on the road is inexorably clogging up.
    2. Issue revisions to the maintenance schedule, have a regular EGR condition inspection, and publish unambiguous, practical instructions, make it available both to the dealerships and owners, and educate the dealership in its application.
    3. Lower the price of replacment EGR components, and/or redesign them.
    4. Test/approve an Oil Catch Can for the PCV circuit.

    Or just keep their head in the sand, and deny, hoping they get enough new converts with their new-and-shiny fourth gen, and 3rd gen just blows away.
     
    #7 Mendel Leisk, Jun 6, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2019
    Sublimelyoblivious and bisco like this.
  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Yes. Properly functioning EGR keeps combustion chamber temps down. The EGR's function is two-fold, to reduce exhaust emissions, and to allow the engine to run a little closer to some feathery edge, more efficiently. Trouble is, if the EGR clogs significantly, the engine can go over that edge, overheat.

    And the current PCV design can likely contribute to that clogging, considering the amount of stuff it's dumping into the intake manifold, and speculating that quite a bit does not hang around there, but continues through to the combustion chamber.

    That's my take anyway, lol. Mostly from what I've gleaned from folks here.
     
    #8 Mendel Leisk, Jun 6, 2019
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  9. Sublimelyoblivious

    Sublimelyoblivious New Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
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    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    N/A
    Got it. I apologize, for several reasons. One not knowing a heck of a lot about the inner workings of combustion etc and two all my posts are moderated, therefore take a long time to post officially. (Gotta make sure I'm not a troll)
     
    #9 Sublimelyoblivious, Jun 6, 2019
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  10. Skibob

    Skibob Senior Member

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    Posts are only moderated for a short time to make sure your not a bot. I think the number is 5. After that your good to go.
     
    #10 Skibob, Jun 6, 2019
  11. Sublimelyoblivious

    Sublimelyoblivious New Member

    Joined:
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    Location:
    Missouri
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    N/A
    I just got back from seeing a local mechanic and they couldn't get it to reproduce what I experience when driving it. My only choice at this point is to try to wait it out for the Toyota appointment on the 19th. And run the fuel with seafoam out and see if there's any improvement.
    Basically everyone so far seems to think I'm crazy or imagining it. Or think it's normal shifting from electric to fuel.
     
    #11 Sublimelyoblivious, Jun 6, 2019
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