Oil usage in Gen 4

Discussion in 'Prime Main Forum (2017-Current)' started by johnamerc, Jun 17, 2018.

  1. johnamerc

    johnamerc Junior Member

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    Time to retire my 2010 Gen 3 after 276K miles. P0303 code remains even after extensive trouble shooting. Mechanic says mechanical issues, " the engine is tired." Also EGR valve recently replaced after the expiration of the 3/31/17 unlimited mileage warranty extension expired for $$$. Oil usage is through the roof for the past years or so . . . 1 Qt every 1 K miles now. Even lower miles per quart on hilly roads, e. g. I-26 between Asheville, NC and Bristol, TN and from Asheville to Murphy NC. plenty of 6% to 8% grades.

    Would like a Prius Prime as I am moving to a house that is 2.5 miles from my office. Plus the gas engine would last longer?

    Concerned about the number of oil usage posts for Gen 3. Will I be sending good money to Toyota only to have oil consumption be an issue with the new generation? Doubt if the are many Gen 4 w/ 100K miles so the jury is likely still out.

    My gen 1 went 345K miles never using more than 1 qt per 5,000 miles. 1/4 qt between 5,000 mile changes was common. I believe oil was 5w30 then.

    Wondering if Toyota made a mistake switching to 0w20 ?

    The majority of my Gen 1 miles were in Upstate NY. My latest Gen 3 has made numerous trips in the winter months to Florida and Georgia. Plus I drove it harder ( higher speed) on those trips.

    A new Prime is likely to hit $26,000 or more. A lot of money thrown at a Toyota experiment in viscosity.

    What to do?

    John
     
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  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    no one knows how long the engine will last. you either experiment, or you don't. personally, i consider 276k a pretty darn good run. there is no consensus on the oil burning problem in some gen 3's, but some are doing fine at high miles.

    you would definitely use the engine less on a prime.

    you can probably find a base prime netting out under 20k after rebates, discounts and tax credits, before ttl.

    what other new vehicle would you expect to get 300+ out of the engine?
     
    #2 bisco, Jun 17, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2018
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  3. PT Guy

    PT Guy Active Member

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    "I am moving to a house that is 2.5 miles from my office. Plus the gas engine would last longer?"

    You will have zero oil usage and infinite engine life,'because the engine will never run.

    No one knows the life of this engine...they haven't been out long enough. No problems are cropping up yet.

    There is nothing at all wrong with 0W-20 oil in an engine designed for it. Keep in mind that the 90,000 hp Boeing 777 engines use a 5 weight oil. I know, nothing at all similar in the engines, but the point that they were designed for it. I've run diesels that used 30 wt. crankcase oil to put out 5,000 hp per cylinder...because that's how they were designed.
     
  4. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    Sorry have to disagree with you. Manufactures are being pushed to run 0W-20 in the US to meet CAFE standards. Not so in other parts of the world. I am running 0W-40 with no issues. Higher weight oils are recommended outside the US.
     
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  5. orenji

    orenji Senior Member

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    You seem disappointed to get to 276k miles. There are few cars that ever reach these types of mileage. Toyota's are know for longevity. But reaching near 300k miles is pretty rare.
     
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  6. Roy2001

    Roy2001 Active Member

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    Surprised you are not happy with 276k miles.
     
  7. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    How about you keep the gen3 for those trips, and get a used Leaf for your commute.

    The new Camry calls for 0w16, and much of Japan's car fleet uses it. They are trying out 0w8 there now.

    Improving fuel economy standards are a pressure for the use of thinner oils, but it is improvements in engine technology and motor oil formulation that makes it work. Ford has been using 0w20 in their engines for 17 years now, and I think Honda has using it longer. How many cases of excessive engine wear have those manufacturers had? CAFE fines are cheap compared to warranty claims and bad press.
     
  8. johnamerc

    johnamerc Junior Member

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    Thanks for all the replies. Still P0303. When code is reset it returns within a 100 miles or so. Will see if 0W30 oil helps w/ consumption. Quite hot here for upstate NY. That certainly encourages oil consumption. 279,300 miles now creeping higher.
     
  9. PT Guy

    PT Guy Active Member

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    0W-8 & 0W-16 oils are quite different from our usual oil viscosities that end with 5s & 0s. Not interchangeable. They were given these odd ball numbers as a means of identification.

    About viscosities...the design engineer first needs to look at the pressures developed in the bearings. This is expressed in psi. How hard does the connecting rod push down on its bearing, and how hard does the crankshaft press down on its main bearings? All bearings inside the engine get this analysis. A bearing can be made larger to reduce the psi and allow lighter viscosity oils with their reduced drag. Some don't need to be larger--the pressures aren't excessive in the first place. All this is discovered in the lab and on the test stand and computer simulation.

    Hydrodynamic lubrication is where a rotating journal in a sleeve bearing rides up on its film of oil. The oil pump merely supplies cool oil to the bearing. The rotation of the journal can build this hydrodynamic oil wedge up to a pressure of several thousand psi. Higher viscosity oils have higher film strength, but they also generate more heat during rotation. That heat results in greater viscosity loss, so it isn't a clear benefit in an engine designed for lower viscosity oils.

    So...trust the design engineers. Here is a good description of hydrodynamic lubrication:
    Journal Bearings and Their Lubrication
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    In what way are they different? the numbers just refer to a range of oil viscosities.

    The 2018 Camry has a factor fill of 0w16, and Toyota allows 0w20 for future fills.
     
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