Our 2010 Liftback got the dreaded 'knock on cold start'.

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by farmecologist, Oct 15, 2018.

  1. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    1,625
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Southern MN
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Hi all,

    Our 2010 Liftback just got the dreaded 'knock' on a cold startup this morning. :( It was about 32 degrees Fahrenheit out. Only has 109K miles. I have never noticed this before.

    Since I have overhauled our 2012 Prius v (wagon) ( see link in signature below ), I am well versed in all of the various regular and not-so-regular maintenance procedures. However, this overhaul was preemptive...it has never knocked, etc...

    Unfortunately, since 'winter is coming', I probably won't have time to do all of the maintenance items I would like to do on the 2010. What do you guys recommend for a knock? I'm thinking cleaning the intake manifold...and possibly spark plugs to start with. Unfortunately, I probably won't be able to get to the EGR cooler until next spring...which was the original plan. Any other ideas?

    Then again, maybe the knock is a one-off event. I'll continue to monitor. Son is driving the car and has not reported anything like a knock ( although I'm not sure he would even notice ). :D

    Thanks!
     
  2. tankyuong

    tankyuong Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2012
    1,366
    598
    0
    Location:
    Central MO
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius c
    Model:
    II
    I wouldn’t do anything til you have time to do the whole egr circuit
     
    m.wynn, Raytheeagle and farmecologist like this.
  3. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    5,302
    3,732
    1
    Location:
    Wilkes Land
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Sorry to hear, mine knocks when outside temp is lower than 40 degrees. Hopefully it's fuel injectors that needs cleaning, techron fuel injector cleaner for the tank.

    In your shoes, I'd inspect the egr pipe. It's the canary in coal mine to see how much possible accumulate carbon build up. It takes less than 15 min to do but will reveal how soon (or how long you can put off) the cleaning of entire egr circuit and manifold.
     
  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    45,063
    32,185
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    @farmecologist you say you got the knock first thing in the morning. Did the car happen to have a cold start and very fast shut down (say a minute or less run time) just prior, say the day before?

    Apart from the EGR, yeah clean the intake manifold and install an oil catch can? Still, EGR goes hand-in-hand with this.
     
    mjoo, Raytheeagle and farmecologist like this.
  5. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    1,625
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Southern MN
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Hmm maybe it did have the fast shutown on prior cold start scenario you mentioned! We were moving the cars around over the weekend so my son could gain access to his hockey shooting area in the garage ( how Minnesota is that for ya )? (y)

    Anyway I will continue to monitor the situation. If it warms up a bit I *may* get some time to mess with the EGR...but I'm not counting on it. I will do the intake manifold though. Not optimal I know...but it is better than nothing I guess. (y)
     
    mjoo, Raytheeagle and Mendel Leisk like this.
  6. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2016
    11,137
    15,248
    0
    Location:
    Bay Area, California
    Vehicle:
    2019 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Go for the oil catch can ;).

    I bet you’ll catch a lot(y).
     
    Mendel Leisk, farmecologist and mjoo like this.
  7. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    1,625
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Southern MN
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Plan was to do that next spring when I do the EGR cooler cleaning, etc...

    I'm happy to say that the ' fast shutown on prior cold start ' idea @Mendel Leisk had appears to be what caused it. We had backed the car away from the garage so we could get our other car out. The Prius wasn't running for more than a few seconds. The next morning it was cold out and knocked when I started it. The knock has not happened since.

    So I think this is case closed. (y) I will update if we notice any more knocking.
     
  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    45,063
    32,185
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Only thing, it shouldn't be thus, that a simple behaviour one day, not that unusual, brings the car to it's knees, the next day. The Prius, 3rd gen in particular, is definitely "special needs".
     
    farmecologist and Raytheeagle like this.
  9. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2018
    3,618
    2,185
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Depending on the battery charge, you can hit the "EV" button so the engine won't start if you are only rotating vehicles.
    For me, it works 99% of the time. Even with just 2 bars showing, depending on where the charge is for the 2 bars.
     
    farmecologist and Aaron Vitolins like this.
  10. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    45,063
    32,185
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Maybe your climate helps? I find EV is AWOL 99% of the time, even in summer, with a cold engine. I don't even bother trying it anymore. The only time I'll use it is if the engine's been run in the last few hours, it's still partially warmed up. Pretty much just a novelty.
     
    farmecologist likes this.
  11. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    1,625
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Southern MN
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    True. However, I had thought I could back up before the engine started. This usually works for me but I must have dawdled too log this time!
     
    Raytheeagle likes this.
  12. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2018
    3,618
    2,185
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    One of the first threads I read here was that is the oven starts, let it run until it stops.
    So even if you are only moving a little bit, wait for the engine to shut off before turning the car off.
    Move of the time I do that, but if it starts just as I'm ready to turn it of, I turn it off.
    Only once did I have a rough start. But I knew what it was and just let it run until it shut off.
    Haven't had it happen again.

    Here if Florida, I get EV with a cold engine. And moving it out of the drive way to rotate cars I've always been able
    to use it, unless the battery is too low. And I'm only going about 10-20 feet, at less than idle.
    Now if I'm going somewhere, as soon as I hit 10mph, no matter how slow I go, the engine kicks in.
    Other than that, it's pretty much useless for me. I can work the throttle and go 40-42mph on the battery only.
     
    farmecologist and Mendel Leisk like this.
  13. CR94

    CR94 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014
    1,752
    680
    0
    Location:
    Northwestern S.C.
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I'm here to report that the infamous cold-start miss+rattle syndrome stuck my Prius for its first time yesterday morning. That was alarming! Ambient temperature was 43 degrees F (possibly the coldest start this fall so far). That was two days after it last ran, with a rainy day (if that matters?) in between. The last time it ran was a 15-mile trip at mostly low speeds, NOT a very brief run time, as sometimes seems to be associated with the misfire. No maintenance or disassembly of EGR-related components yet, at only about 93700 miles.

    I received the ZF3 notice in September, 2016. "Primary" coverage is long past.

    The EV trick would be more useful if it were not restricted to warm conditions in the US. That goofy restriction has the dual effects of INCREASING air pollution, and increasing contamination of the oil whenever an owner needs to move the car a very short distance. Why???
     
    #13 CR94, Oct 29, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2018
  14. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2018
    3,618
    2,185
    0
    Location:
    Florida
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    NOTHING wants to run when it's cold! :)
     
  15. Grit

    Grit Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2017
    5,302
    3,732
    1
    Location:
    Wilkes Land
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Yikes welcome to the infamous club. How long was the knock? Mine knocks below 40f cold soaks. No EGR & manifold cleaning done yet but will get to them in couple of months w OCC.
     
    CR94 and Raytheeagle like this.
  16. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    45,063
    32,185
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    You always have around 15 seconds of EV after startup, fwiw. Keeping my runtime to 10 seconds max (just counting in my head) I move ours out to the driveway in one pop, or out onto the street in three. Start up, get into gear fast, move. Shut down, Repeat as needed. 60 seconds would make it a LOT easier.
     
  17. Threej

    Threej Member

    Joined:
    Jan 25, 2018
    95
    96
    0
    Location:
    Portland, OR
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    You mean the time from pushing start until the engine comes on? That's more like 5 seconds... I can get about halfway down my driveway.
     
    CR94 likes this.
  18. farmecologist

    farmecologist Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    1,625
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Southern MN
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Hmm...no way startup EV is 10 seconds on our 2010. More like 5 seconds. The time is consistent though.
     
  19. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Sand Pounder

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    45,063
    32,185
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Maybe time is slower up here. :cool:
     
    farmecologist and Raytheeagle like this.
  20. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2016
    11,137
    15,248
    0
    Location:
    Bay Area, California
    Vehicle:
    2019 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    It’s just a Canadian thing:p.

    Or is it retired time:whistle:?
     
    farmecologist likes this.
Loading...