Petition Project another strike against GW.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stev0 @ Mar 21 2007, 06:14 PM) [snapback]409804[/snapback]</div>

Soundbites: the assassins of truth.

 

reading a great book "Collapse" by Jared Diamond. He is making a strong point I completely agree with, that there is never a single event that causes a major change. It is several events together that tend to push towards are collapse or major interruption. The same with GW/GCC, humans are not the single point of causality. All things being equal, we have a choice in what we humans wish to contribute to the events unfolding in our time.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stev0 @ Mar 21 2007, 06:14 PM) [snapback]409804[/snapback]</div>

Right. And I really believe that a lot of problems with the misunderstandings the public has about things like global warming would be alleviated if we were better at teaching science. The excitement for science that I see in many young kids vs. the utter fear of science that many adults have really makes me think that we're screwing something up along the way.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ZenCruiser @ Mar 21 2007, 06:24 PM) [snapback]409807[/snapback]</div>

Heh. So true. The "trouble" with most science is the results are complex and so can't easily be explained in 10 seconds.

EDIT: I guess I should probably replace "most science" with "most things in life" in the previous sentence.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lywyllyn @ Mar 21 2007, 06:39 PM) [snapback]409811[/snapback]</div>

Mostly agree, except for the "global events" such as a meteor impact significant enough to cause global winter, i.e., as in the theory behind the dinosaur extinction.

 

Okay alright, a collision with a space object is surely to put a kink in your day.

Did you know that on Friday 13th, 2029 an asteroid, about 1000ft in diameter, will come closer to earth, then the orbit of our communication satellites? You will be able to see this asteroid from earth without binocs! It will also miss the moon. This encounter will tell us if it going to hit us in 2040 when it comes around for a second look at us

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Lywyllyn @ Mar 21 2007, 08:34 PM) [snapback]409875[/snapback]</div>

Please tell me you're kidding.

 

Sorry, not kidding

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6914766/

http://neo.jpl.nasa.gov/news/news148.html


I just can't get over the Friday the 13th date... the Universe does have a sense of humor. Doug is that your doing?

 

There is a debate about how to deal with close-approaching asteroids. There's a contingent that wants to use nuclear weapons (sounds like an excuse to build more nukes to me) while some astronomers think that the best tactic would be to gently nudge the asteroid before it gets too close to earth.
I heard someone from NASA on NPR recently describe how busget cuts at NASA only permit traking the largest asteroids (the ones large enough to cause massive extinction if they hit the earth) while the smaller asteroids (on the order of hundreds of meters in diameter) that would result in, say, destruction of a city if they hit earth, go untracked.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(larkinmj @ Mar 21 2007, 10:01 PM) [snapback]409915[/snapback]</div>

Reminds me of the movie, "Armageddon" where the president asks NASA why they didn't see the meteor/asteroid coming earlier, and Billy Bob Thornton's character states that because of the budget cuts, they can only watch a small percentage of the sky and "begging your pardon, sir, but it's a big-nice person sky".

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(larkinmj @ Mar 21 2007, 10:01 PM) [snapback]409915[/snapback]</div>

And how exactly does one gently nudge an asteroid? My biggest familarity with asteroid avoidance is both "Deep Impact" and "Armageddon." Oh--and "Asteroids," played on my trusted Atari. I was never able to budge them...they just blew me up.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(livelychick @ Mar 21 2007, 10:26 PM) [snapback]409944[/snapback]</div>

I've had too much wine for dinner to do the math, but...
hit it with a sufficiently large mass, sufficiently far away, billiards style. A small change in direction becomes a large change in cross range after a long ways. Or equivalently, jam a large roman candle in its side and use propulsion to change the trajectory. The key is to find it far enough away, so reasonable amounts of energy can be utilized.

 

I do not know guys... I think kow (inadvertently) has a point. All the scientists I know are against GW. (Meaning, they'd like to have it stopped.)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(livelychick @ Mar 21 2007, 07:26 PM) [snapback]409944[/snapback]</div>

The principal idea is you don't need to budge it much - just enough so that it misses earth. Earth is a VERY tiny target relative to the trajectory of an asteroid. Spot one far enough away from the point of collision and just firing a 22 bullet at it would shift its trajectory sufficiently to miss earth. For that to work it would admittedly have to be REALLY distant from the collision point (so distant we may not be able to detect it or plot its trajectory to that accuracy), but it makes the point that shifting its trajectory a billionth of a millimeter per hour would be enough to make it miss something so tiny as earth.

Firing a 22 rifle at one isn't practical, of course, but shooting a rocket engine at it that'll keep running for a few minutes after contacting the surface could be enough to make a millimeter per hour shift in the trajectory of an asteroid we've detected a few months or years distant from collision, which is all that's necessary: make it miss the earth.

Blowing one up could be worse than leaving it intact: instead of one strike, now we'd face several possible strikes from the fragments. Better to just give it a small push. Not as fun or spectacular as a Hollywood film, of course, but life doesn't ALWAYS have to match what's in the movies.

The astronomics gurus on this board can correct my figures (I'm sure they're off by orders of magnitude in several places), but the general idea is sound.

Mark Baird
Alameda CA

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(livelychick @ Mar 21 2007, 08:26 PM) [snapback]409944[/snapback]</div>

There are no asteroids. It's just a bunch of liberal BS made up by scientists who want grant money. :angry:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(F8L @ Mar 22 2007, 12:19 AM) [snapback]409968[/snapback]</div>

:lol:

Asteroids have a well known liberal bias. :lol:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(F8L @ Mar 21 2007, 11:19 PM) [snapback]409968[/snapback]</div>

because grants are such a profitable racket... free money for writing a paper!

 

Hey scientists! If CO2 is causing global warming, then how do you explain the global warming on asteroids? Huh? I'm waiting!

 

I blame The Little Prince



Or maybe just Prince

 

I know- it's the asteroids that cause global warming! But wait- there's no such thing as global warming! And there's no such thing as asteroids! I'm very confused. I'll look this up on Conservapedia and get back to you...