1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

PG&E buys Via Motors e-Rev electric pickups

Discussion in 'Environmental Discussion' started by Pinto Girl, Jan 11, 2012.

Page 1 of 2
  1. Pinto Girl

    Pinto Girl New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    3,093
    350
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Think of the pickup truck from Via Motors as an electric generator on wheels.

    The truck, unveiled Tuesday at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit, runs on electricity. But it also can supply electricity - enough to power whole houses.

    And for Pacific Gas and Electric Co., it might just be the ideal vehicle.
    PG&E has been testing two of the pickups since 2010. And the San Francisco utility liked the results enough to join Via at Tuesday's unveiling, with a PG&E executive saying his company was ready to order more.

    The trucks could respond to small power outages, temporarily supplying electricity to blacked-out homes, PG&E Corp. Senior Vice President Greg Pruett told reporters at the auto show. The trucks can supply a maximum of 15 kilowatts of electricity at any given moment - more than the typical house requires.

    PG&E field workers also could use the pickups to run their power tools.

    Runs power tools

    To illustrate the point, Pruett fired up a circular saw plugged into one of Via's trucks.

    "If you're a contractor, think about rolling to a work site and being able to plug that into your vehicle and run it off your truck all day long," Pruett said.

    Many of the electric cars now hitting the market are small passenger vehicles, made for commuters. Via, however, targets the other end of the size spectrum. The company, based in the Detroit suburbs, has focused on electrifying large vehicles: trucks, SUVs and vans.

    Via does not build its trucks from scratch. Instead, it installs its advanced hybrid power train in vehicles made by other companies. Its pickup trucks, for example, were originally Chevrolet Silverados that Via bought from General Motors.

    Once converted, the trucks work much like a Chevy Volt. For about the first 40 miles of any trip, they run on power from their lithium-ion batteries. Then a gasoline-powered generator kicks in to recharge the battery and power the electric motor. The company calls its products e-REVs, for "extended range electric vehicles."

    Appropriately enough, the former GM executive who spearheaded development of the Volt now serves on Via's corporate board. He told auto show reporters Tuesday that the electrification of transportation was inevitable.

    "It's going to happen no matter what, so it makes all the sense in the world to start with the vehicles that are most popular with the American public and frankly use the most gasoline," said former GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz.

    $2,700 fuel saving

    Each Via truck has saved PG&E about $2,700 per year in fuel costs, when compared with a conventional pickup, Pruett said. The utility has about 3,500 similar vehicles in its fleet, and converting all of them would save PG&E about $9.5 million each year. The trucks, Pruett said, also require far less maintenance than their gasoline-powered peers.

    PG&E has not yet determined how many more of the trucks to buy. For the moment, Pruett said, the utility's next purchase will probably be "in the lower double digits." But the number would likely grow, he said, as Via increases production.

    Via and PG&E would not disclose how much the utility will pay for the trucks. But David West, Via's chief marketing officer, said the trucks currently cost anywhere from the high-$50,000 range to the low $70,000 range, with the price based on how many vehicles each customer orders. The company sells only to corporate fleets for the moment, but plans to market to consumers starting in 2013.
     
    #1 Pinto Girl, Jan 11, 2012
  2. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2011
    3,292
    547
    0
    Location:
    2014 Prius c
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    info on via power plant:
    [​IMG]
     
    #2 cyclopathic, Jan 11, 2012
  3. bedrock8x

    bedrock8x Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2008
    1,483
    137
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Complete PR & HW, the fleet price for Silverado likely under $25K, how can it justify the fuel saving of $2700/yr for a price difference of $25K-$45K.
     
    #3 bedrock8x, Jan 11, 2012
  4. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2005
    19,678
    8,071
    54
    Location:
    Montana & Nashville, TN
    Vehicle:
    2018 Chevy Volt
    Model:
    Premium
    It's not just the gas (or oil, or filters, or tranny maintenance, plugs, etc) . . . it's the WAY less maintenance. Why do you think So Cal Edison is still running around with a 10 year old fleet of RAV4-ev's ?
    Hint ... cost savings. They got over 100k on many of their 10 year old fleet, and the nickel packs are still humming along, despite how abused many of the drivers treat them (our meter readers have told me a couple depressing tales of crazy charge cycles):

    http://www.evchargernews.com/miscfiles/sce-rav4ev-100k.pdf

    They don't even have to pay for the juice to charge 'em!
     
    #4 hill, Jan 11, 2012
  5. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2009
    12,470
    6,862
    2
    Location:
    Greenwood MS USA
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Three
    Lets suppose for a moment that you NEED a mobile 15k generator. (My cable company could not repair cable after the 2004 ice storm as all their trucks were providing electricity to the antennas, until the electric company could repair their lines)

    This rig is about $5000
    15KW GENERAC GENERATOR WITH TRAILER | eBay

    There is 20% of your price difference.
     
    #5 JimboPalmer, Jan 11, 2012
  6. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    13,533
    4,063
    0
    Location:
    Austin, TX, USA
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    Isn't the prius phv supposed to have a model that can supply more than that. According to the figures in the article pg&e can save $9.5 million a year if it spends $200 million on new trucks. No wonder they they are buying in the tens and not the thousands of units.

    If you need standby generators, a PHEV diesel truck makes a lot more sense. Unfortunately no one is building one right now. They should come along though.
     
    #6 austingreen, Jan 11, 2012
  7. mojo

    mojo Senior Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2006
    4,519
    390
    0
    Location:
    San Francisco
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Three
    AB32 cap and trade law begins soon.Perhaps carbon credit savings will enter into the equation.
     
    #7 mojo, Jan 11, 2012
  8. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    13,533
    4,063
    0
    Location:
    Austin, TX, USA
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    I reread it. There should be a federal and california tax credits of $20000. I'm not sure what trim of silverado this truck is like for $79,000. If you made it a diesel it might hurt the california credits.
     
    #8 austingreen, Jan 11, 2012
  9. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2007
    4,319
    1,527
    0
    Location:
    Tampa Bay
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    I
    a) Keep them a long time (Remember, if you buy two Silverados in the same time period, it's now a 50k-45k delta. Note that utility fleets are abused something fierce. Electric motors last longer than ICE engines.)
    b) Plan on fuel cost rising. If the fuel savings is 2700/yr today, what will it be five years from now?

    So the justification is probably pretty solid if they use them long enough.
     
    #9 FL_Prius_Driver, Jan 11, 2012
  10. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2009
    13,533
    4,063
    0
    Location:
    Austin, TX, USA
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    N/A
    I've seen plenty of pickups with 500K miles on them. Engines can last forever. Most need transmission work in that time. If you need a generator, it takes up space in the bed, so its a great reason to use a phev instead where the engine is the generator, and the batteries a buffer. This is the volt design for a pick up.

    http://www.viamotors.com/powertrain/
     
    #10 austingreen, Jan 11, 2012
  11. FL_Prius_Driver

    FL_Prius_Driver Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2007
    4,319
    1,527
    0
    Location:
    Tampa Bay
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    I
    Engines do indeed last nearly forever.....when operated and maintained properly. The point is that fleet vehicles are rarely operated properly and subject to all kinds of abuse. (Think of how long a rental car would last compared to your car.) That was all I was trying to point out.
     
    #11 FL_Prius_Driver, Jan 11, 2012
  12. bedrock8x

    bedrock8x Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2008
    1,483
    137
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Do you expect PG&E will bring the eREV to your house and power your appliances when there is downed lines in the neighborhood?

     
    #12 bedrock8x, Jan 11, 2012
  13. San_Carlos_Jeff

    San_Carlos_Jeff Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2005
    871
    160
    0
    Location:
    Northern California
    Vehicle:
    2012 Chevy Volt
    Model:
    N/A
    If there are one or two houses out for an extended period, which happens sometimes, that is what I'd expect.
     
    #13 San_Carlos_Jeff, Jan 11, 2012
  14. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2009
    12,470
    6,862
    2
    Location:
    Greenwood MS USA
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius v wagon
    Model:
    Three
    No, I expect hospitals, police stations, fire stations, and traffic lights to get priority over me. As should be. The ability to get them power RIGHT NOW may save lives.
     
    #14 JimboPalmer, Jan 11, 2012
  15. Pinto Girl

    Pinto Girl New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    3,093
    350
    0
    Location:
    California
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Finally found them: Pics of the original "wouldn't it be great to plug a power saw into your pickup" pickup.

    1967 Ford pickup with optional Cummins genset under the hood. Doesn't quite put out 15kW though.

    _________

    As far as the PG&E dispatching these pickups to assist with small power outages, something about that idea seems lots better suited for a press release than the real world. And I'd think most power-critical facilities are already served by backup generators anyway.
     

    Attached Files:

    #15 Pinto Girl, Jan 11, 2012
  16. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Nope. They'll use the trucks for their own work repairing the lines. A precedent exists: In the event of a power failure they are not required to provide you with emergency power. They are not going to set a new precedent that would require them to provide a service they presently do not have to. And they'll have plenty of use for those trucks themselves. They're not going to burn gas to provide one or two homes with power.
     
    #16 daniel, Jan 12, 2012
  17. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2004
    14,487
    1,518
    0
    Location:
    Spokane, WA
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Not if you're a klutz like me, and the most likely outcome of running a power saw is the loss of several fingers.

    Just saying...
     
    #17 daniel, Jan 12, 2012
  18. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2005
    19,678
    8,071
    54
    Location:
    Montana & Nashville, TN
    Vehicle:
    2018 Chevy Volt
    Model:
    Premium
    Actually, engineer on the Leaf board came up with a capstone mini turbine ($30k ... $1/watt) to charge his Leaf ... and it's on a trailer.
    ;)

    Capstone Turbine Corporation

    Much longer life than standard ice.
     
    #18 hill, Jan 12, 2012
    1 person likes this.
  19. R-P

    R-P Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2011
    804
    288
    0
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Model:
    II
    15kW output, 150kW generator, 4.3L V6 (should easily be >250kW by today's standards).

    :confused:

    Am I missing something or is this yet another, 'we must put in a hefty engine or Americans won't buy it' ???

    Why not a 2.5L V6 with 150kW?

    (Not trying to annoy you guys, seriously wondering (as I have been wondering for decades why your engines are 2-3 times larger for the same cars...))
     
    #19 R-P, Jan 12, 2012
  20. cyclopathic

    cyclopathic Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2011
    3,292
    547
    0
    Location:
    2014 Prius c
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    II
    very simple they buying GM truck, pulling transmission out and retrofitting it with new bits (controller, batteries, etc). It is the smallest engine you can buy truck with
     
    #20 cyclopathic, Jan 12, 2012
(You must log in or sign up to post here.)
Page 1 of 2