PRIUS 2007 RUNS MORE ON ICE, AND HAS GOT ONLY 25MPG

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Dxta, Nov 14, 2016.

  1. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    89,991
    40,367
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    10-4.
     
  2. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2012
    4,910
    2,643
    0
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    How are you measuring the MPG? Just using the MFD?
     
  3. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Using the MFD. I don't know whether its not correct. Would want to try manual means and see what happens.
    And the fact that the engine tuns longer than usual, tells me the car consumes lots of fuel.
     
  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    40,821
    29,305
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Yeah, the mpg drop seems to just be a symptom. The strong clue is that the engine seems to be running more than usual.

    One reason for that could be if the car isn't warming up properly? Which would cause the engine to run a lot. And one cause for slow warm-up could be engine coolant thermostat failing in the way that it doesn't seal good, and opens too soon, cooling too well.

    You could try replacing the thermostat. When it's removed inspect it's gasket for fraying, brittleness. Also suspend both old and new ones in a pot (not touching the bottom), raise the temperature and observe the behavior of both. If you have appropriate thermometer you could clip inside pot, not opening/closing temps.
     
  5. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    OK. would try the temperature thermostat testing/replacement and see what happens. I WOUKD also ensure the engine is properly warmed up.
    WOUKD report back to you on my observations.
    Thanks a lot, Mendel
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  6. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    I recently also filled up the tank with gas. But suddenly noticed the fuel gauge acts funny. It WOUKD display empty, and later on, when the fuel gets to 1/2, it displays full.
    I'm just thinking it coukd be the fuel gauge inside the fuel pump casing that's beginig to act up.
    Any ideas from you, house?
    would appreciate it.
     
  7. andrewclaus

    andrewclaus Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2009
    993
    315
    0
    Location:
    Golden, CO
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    One more thing to consider on the hybrid battery--have you ever heard the cooling fan (grille in the back seat) come on?

    If the battery state of charge appears steady and good, and there's no cooling fan operation, the hybrid battery is probably okay. How old is the 12V battery and what's its condition?

    Is the ICE well-maintained? Changed plugs, PCV valve, clean throttle body and MAF, air filter? Perhaps it's running more because it's putting out reduced torque for some general reason not picked up yet by a sensor.
     
  8. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Great news house! Finally got trouble codes from the car today. But was surprises, ni check engine light. Well, I did use a techstream software to access the car's ECU.
    These were the codes:
    P3000
    C1343
    C1344
    B1653
    B1655
    B1821
    B1271

    I also observed these:
    *when you drive, the triangle red caution light blinks and disappears
    *no check engine light
    *ABS light on
    *hybrid battery discharges within few minutes
    *engine runs more than normal. At stops, where it's supposed to start up the electric mode, the ICE continually run.

    It appears the P3000 us the culprit.
    Pls this is what I would want to do.
    I need your corrections, if I'm wrong.

    My procedures:
    *remove aux battery negative terminal
    *remove service plug, and wait for 10min
    *remove hybrid battery from cabin
    *perform an OCV test, to determine which cells are bad. Can I load test each of the cells using an automotive bulbs(12volts), to determine their volts under load.
    *identify a good battery module from a salvage car
    *replace the bad modules, and charge and discharge the battery pack to the specification of voltage required.

    Pls anyone with ideas how I could go about this?

    Regards
     
    gasgaraget likes this.
  9. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2012
    4,910
    2,643
    0
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Whoa, hold on there, cowboy.

    You said initially you had no lights on the dash, then you said a bit later the ABS light was on, now you produce a list of codes that would have certainly lit up the dash with a few lights. Can't help you if you don't give accurate info. But moving on, it is what it is.

    Before you go diving into the battery assuming it is toast, consider other options.

    Before anything else make sure you save the health check in techstream, so you can refer to it at a later date, especially after you've cleared the codes (see the end of my post).

    The fortune cookie message for these codes are:

    P3000 = HV Battery Malfunction
    C1343 = Rear Hydraulic System RH Malfunction
    C1344 = Rear Hydraulic System LH Malfunction
    B1653 = Seat Position Airbag Sensor Circuit Malfunction
    B1655 = Driver Side Seat Belt Buckle Switch Circuit Malfunction
    B1821 = Open in Front Driver Side - Side Squib Circuit
    B1271 = Combination meter ECU communications stop

    As there are no other HV Battery ECU codes like P0A80 and (but not necessarily) P3011 - P3024, I would take a closer look at the other codes that you have. The P3000 can be set by the ABS ECU simply to tell the HV ECU it is having problems. Why is this important? Because the ABS ECU and the HV ECU work together to manage the regen capture. If the ABS is having a problem it tells the HV ECU and that in turn will disable the regen. (How are your brakes?)

    So, I would look at the codes C1343/5 and see if you can resolve the ABS issue. Then work out what is wrong with the airbag and seatbelt sensor/switch respectively. The B1821 may point to a failed "clock spring" cable in the steering wheel (do all the steering wheel buttons work, out of interest?).

    The B1271 I'd not worry about unless it comes up again, as that is a separate and possibly unrelated fault–if it really exists.

    After attending to these things, clear all the codes with techstream and see what comes back. If you get the P3000 without any ABS codes, then I'd look further into the HV Battery. But again before you dive into pulling the battery from the car, you can perform this rudimentary test with TS as well as look at battery voltages and current while under load and discharge to see how the battery is performing.

    Please keep us posted of your findings and progress.

    Hope that helps.
     
    #29 dolj, Nov 15, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2016
  10. Indy John

    Indy John Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2008
    75
    33
    0
    Location:
    Indianapolis
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Your symptoms exactly match those of a failing hybrid battery. Check out the Prolong Battery Charger/Discharger site. It may not be too late to add years to the life of your battery for just a few hundred dollars and a little time to install the required harness and do a few charge/discharge cycles. Absent that, you'll soon be seeing the check engine light/hybrid battery light. Do it now!
     
  11. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Exactly, dolj. There wasn't a check engine light. Was just the abs light that was on.
    When I used the techstream software, I was able to access the car's ECU, and that was where those codes came from.
    For the abs dtcs, the rear brake shoes were replaced because of they were worn out.
    Would try that test you referred me to later thus week.
    Thanks for your response, sir.
    PS: I'd I do a open circuit voltage test on the modules, won't that give me a close state of health like the forced recharge method?

    Thanks for the I for about the prologue charger. Would check it out.
     
    #31 Dxta, Nov 16, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 16, 2016
  12. eman08

    eman08 Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2016
    360
    189
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2009 Prius
    Model:
    ----USA----
    From several posters on here referring to the 2nd gen Prius having green bars alot was an indication of a bad cell or in the stages of failure. I don't think so as I get green pretty often especially around this time a year as I approached Winter as it's about 40-60 degrees and when I'm going downhill hills. In, July I rarely seen Green bars.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  13. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2012
    4,910
    2,643
    0
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    I agree. To add further, it's not the fact you have green bars that is bad, it is the rate at which it goes green and then the speed at which it drains to 1 blue (3 bars) or into purple then back up again to green. If you drive and have the battery in the "oscillate between '5-6' and '7-8' pattern" is not abnormal behaviour.

    Apart from capturing energy on the down side of a hill, I regularly can get green bars (usually 7 bars) and can keep it there for quite a considerable time by DWB (driving without brakes) style of hypermiling on flat highway. This is achieved by long (or longer than usual) braking (from way out) on regen only to reduce speed for lights or other slower traffic. I am able to practice this technique even in heavier traffic without being a nuisance to other road users. I don't go slow or hold up other road users to do this.

    Terrain and environment play big part in how this works, so take with a grain of salt. YMMV.

    It is not only the CEL that is important. Any warning lights should be mentioned.
    So are you saying the light came on and then you replaced the rear brake shoes as a fix? In that case you need to clear those codes, but if I recall correctly, you cannot just clear individual codes discretely, so save the current report, clear all the codes and see which codes come back.


    [On an editorial note, there is an EDIT button (bottom left of any post you have made) you can use if you make a mistake, you don't have to start all over again creating multiple posts that say nothing.]
     
    #33 dolj, Nov 16, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2016
  14. jeff652

    jeff652 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2014
    591
    615
    0
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
  15. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Replaced the brake shoes, and the abs light is still on.
    We suddenly discovered that the ICE runs more, and we also noticed that the battery gauge/meter rises and falls at an alarming rate.
    I have planned to OCV test the battery this week, and to identify the bad modules, and do a charge/discharge cycle.

    Really thank you guys for your help.
     
  16. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    All the signs you've mentioned in the article you referenced are present.
    Were going to identify which modules are bad later this week.
    Appreciate your efforts.
     
    jeff652 likes this.
  17. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2012
    4,910
    2,643
    0
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    The ABS will not go off on its own, you need to clear the code with your code reader (Do you use Techstream?)
    Open circuit voltage test is not enough on its own. You need to follow that with a load test.
     
    #37 dolj, Nov 20, 2016
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2016
  18. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,875
    718
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    WOUKD a headlamp bulb of 55W 12V serve as the load, if I'm testing individual modules? What if I were to test the traction battery as an assembly?
     
  19. jeff652

    jeff652 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2014
    591
    615
    0
    Location:
    Silicon Valley
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
  20. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 14, 2012
    4,910
    2,643
    0
    Location:
    Wellington, New Zealand
    Vehicle:
    2006 Prius
    Jeff has pretty well answered your first question. The only way I know of testing the whole pack is to use Techstream while it is in the car. Back in Post #24 I linked to a rudimentary test procedure you can use. You can replay the recording of the charge/discharge test to look at individual voltages and observe how each behaves. You are looking for blocks that both charge quicker and discharge faster than its peers.
     
Loading...