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Prius brake issues

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Technical Discussion' started by Jordanakajdizzle, Aug 11, 2021.

  1. Jordanakajdizzle

    Jordanakajdizzle New Member

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    Prius brake issue

    I’ll just cut straight to the chase. I have a 2010 Prius, ~212k miles. Runs great. For the past month or so, there has been this hissing noise from the brake pedal whenever the brakes are depressed continuously, say for sitting at a stop light. Not a long single hiss, but back to back smaller hisses (hiss, hiss, hiss, hiss.) Been meaning to get it checked out, but my mechanic has a consistent week+ backlog, and I’ve been busy (aren’t we all.) Regenerative and mechanical brakes have been functioning totally normally otherwise, no warning lights. So, cut to yesterday. Out of nowhere car starts exhibiting a metal on metal grinding noise whenever the car is moving. Noise is emanating from the passenger front tire. I pull off the wheel, and the pads are very low. So, I change both sets of front pads, noise disappears, problem solved.

    WRONG.

    Pull out of a parking spot this morning, and suddenly my Brake, TCS, and ABS warning lights are illuminated, and car is no longer doing much, if any, regenerative braking. Car will still stop, but you have to depress brake pedal much more firmly to engage the mechanical brakes near the end of the pedal travel. Doesn’t feel unsafe, per se, as the car still brakes strongly, but it just feels like a normal car, no hybrid trickery anymore. Also, the hiss is totally absent now when sitting still with the brake pedal depressed. Mechanic is talking about accumulators or some such, and throwing around numbers like $3000 to repair. For the love of god, let there be some Prius expert on here who can maybe point to it being something even marginally less expensive. Also, from what I’ve described, is the car unsafe to continue driving as long as the mechanical braking system seems to be functioning just fine? I know this has been a smart novel to read, so many thanks in advance for your time and expertise.

    Edit: Just had codes read. C1391
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    find a new mech, most dealers wil do it cheaper than that. a good mech will install a salvage unit for a reasonable price.
     
  3. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Has the mechanic actually retrieved the diagnostic codes from the brake ECU and told you what they are yet, or has all of this accumulators and $3000 talk come from tea leaves or chicken entrails?
     
  4. Jordanakajdizzle

    Jordanakajdizzle New Member

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    No and, to his credit, he said it could absolutely be something simple. Said he wouldn't know until he had it in shop. But, going off my description, that's just what he said his gut was telling him. I do trust the guys though, it's a very reputable shop in Raleigh that does a ton of Prius work, and their reputation with customers is pretty stellar. They've always shot straight with me, did some excellent work on my gf's car as well. I don't know if the brake ECU codes are different than the more generalized C1391 that I pulled at Autozone.
     
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  5. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    C1391 is a failure to hold accumulator pressure, and it is not a code I would be at all surprised to see in your earlier situation, where you were hearing a repeating hiss of escaping fluid.

    However, the really interesting part of your story is how that symptom disappeared after the front pads were changed.

    Did you personally do the replacement? If so, when you forced the pistons back, did you open the bleed screws to let fluid escape, or did you leave the bleeders closed so the fluid was forced back up into the actuator?

    If you forced fluid back, it is possible you flushed out some small piece of grot that had been lodged in an actuator valve, allowing it to close properly again, making your hiss go away. Sometimes people are unlucky that way, but luck is also possible.

    Your current symptoms sound very different from your original symptoms.

    When you approach the car in the morning and open the driver's door, do you hear the pump running under the hood to pressurize the brakes? If so, about how long does it run before it stops?
     
  6. Colorado Boo

    Colorado Boo Active Member

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    It sounds like your regenerative brake system needs attention. I've never worked on them so, definitely, no expert. It might be an easy fix and worth the diagnostic fee at your local Toyota service department to get it looked at.
    Watch this video...very informative...AMD is my favorite Toyota mechanic youtuber...
     
  7. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    That's kind of because, if you ever tried to find the "regenerative brake system" so you could work on it, you wouldn't be able to.

    There's just a brake system, whose controlling ECU has a network connection, and the car's Power Management Control ECU, which runs the powertrain, also has a network connection, and when you press the brake pedal, the brake ECU just says "hey, driver wants to slow this much, how much can you do?", and the Power Management Control ECU says "I can do this much using the powertrain", and the brake ECU says "great, I'll put the brakes on for the remaining amount."
     
  8. Colorado Boo

    Colorado Boo Active Member

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    Good point, Chapman!! I searched on a Toyota parts site for regenerative brake, hoping to see if there's something in the engine compartment that makes that electronic sound when we open the door...couldn't find anything. I'll have to prop open the hood and quickly open the car door and then try to find what part is running but may just be something in/on the e-motor or transfer case.
     
  9. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    That sound when you open the door is the brake accumulator pump, which has nothing to do with regen braking. Its job is to pump plain old hydraulic brake fluid into a high-pressure accumulator so it is there to give you power assist with the plain old hydraulic brakes.

    Many cars would get their brake power assist from engine vacuum, but then many cars tend to have their engines running while you drive.
     
    Paul E. Highway likes this.
  10. Jordanakajdizzle

    Jordanakajdizzle New Member

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    So, got the car back today from mechanic, they diagnosed it as originally surmised, bad accumulator and actuator assembly.

    To answer your questions, I did do the brake job myself, and I didn't open the bleed valves. The electric hum of the pump probably lasts for 5-10 seconds and then cycles every 20-30 seconds any time the car is on.

    Brought the car home today, as I just don't have 3k to spend on it. Cleared the codes with a Bluetooth OBD reader today, and hiss returned. Warning lights returned within 40 miles. Going to attempt the repair myself. Got an OBD II dongle and techstream coming tomorrow. How do you locate the part number on the actuator assembly without disassembling? Can't see much in there, even with a flashlight.
     
  11. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Definitely a leak then.