Prius C 2016 - HV Battery - Dead

Discussion in 'Prius c Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Battery_Issue, Aug 14, 2018.

  1. Battery_Issue

    Battery_Issue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    7
    2
    0
    Location:
    MTL
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius c
    Model:
    Base
    Hi everyone,

    I would really appreciate help as my Toyota - Prius C TE 2016 has been sitting at the dealers for almost 2 months.
    The problem started when we think a friend put diesel in the car. The car put out a bunch of alerts like ‘’PSC system’’.

    The first dealer we sent the car to said that they got the following codes:

    • P3190 – Poor Enginer Power
    • P0A0F -204 – Engine failed to start.

    They supposedly emptied the diesel from the tank, put regular gas in and the car would still not turn on. They charged the hybrid battery and now this is what they are seeing: the car turns on for 30 seconds and shuts down with code P3000.

    In more detail, they are able to charge the battery gets charged to 13.1 volts. Engine turns on for a few seconds and P3000 code comes back. After turning on attempt, batteries 1,2 and 10 go down to 12.1 volts. Batteries 3,4,5,6,7,8 and 9 go down to 8.2volts. They are saying the battery needs replacement. I’m worried the engine is still at fault.

    If you have any thoughts, I’d really appreciate it.
    Thanks for all the help so far.
    B.
     
  2. RobAustin

    RobAustin Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2018
    41
    28
    0
    Location:
    Austin, tx
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius c
    Model:
    One
    ]

    Those battery voltages look all wrong. If the modules are more than 1.2 volts difference the system will throw error codes.

    Are you in the US? What is your milage?
     
  3. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2016
    3,152
    3,654
    0
    Location:
    Columbia, SC
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    ..deleted this post. I must have misread something because when I reread the OP, it seemed to have additional info I didn't see the first time........

    The only way they are charging anything to get 13.1 volts is to be charging the 12v battery instead of the HV battery.

    The HV battery is what starts the engine rotating. The HV battery is depleted from trying to start the engine while it had diesel instead of gas. The HV battery needs to be charged. The Prius C HV battery has 20 individual modules (7.2 volts each, connected in series for 144v nominal, but each module is typically around 7.8 volts in real life operation). Voltage sensing wires are connected to every second module so voltages sensed are typically around 15.6 or so. This is why they are describing voltages for (10) 'batteries'. Your HV battery is in an extreme state of discharge.

    If they are unable to charge the HV battery, or insist you pay to replace the battery, since it probably would not be covered under warranty (caused by diesel), it would be financially reasonable to borrow or purchase the charger portion of the Prolong Charger (make sure it's the correct model for a Prius C) and charge it yourself.
     
    #3 TMR-JWAP, Aug 15, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2018
  4. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2016
    10,375
    14,113
    0
    Location:
    Bay Area, California
    Vehicle:
    2019 Prius Prime
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Welcome to Prius Chat (y).

    Some questions:
    • How many miles on your Prius?
    • How did diesel end up in the tank?
    • Can you scan a copy of the information you have been provided?
    • Is this a Toyota dealer or an independent shop?
    • Did they try running the fuel pump while the fuel rail was off to purge the fuel line?
    • MTL means Montreal?
    Good luck and keep us posted (y).
     
    PriusCamper likes this.
  5. Battery_Issue

    Battery_Issue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    7
    2
    0
    Location:
    MTL
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius c
    Model:
    Base

    You are correct, they are saying it isn't covered under warranty. They say it took them 2 days to charge it to the 13.1volts. Should I ask them to try for 3 days or 4 days?
     
  6. Battery_Issue

    Battery_Issue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    7
    2
    0
    Location:
    MTL
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius c
    Model:
    Base

    Answers here:

    • It has only 7,000 km
    • A friend may have put diesel in there but we are not sure.
    • Only emails were provided which I transcribed
    • This is a Toyota dealer
    • No they didn't try running the fuel pump
    • MTL is Montreal!
     
  7. Battery_Issue

    Battery_Issue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    7
    2
    0
    Location:
    MTL
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius c
    Model:
    Base
    I also got this reply from hybrid battery experts in the US:

    ''The fact that the individual voltages are dropping sporadically is very bizarre. To me this would suggest that there is something wrong with the battery’s’ computer that reads the voltages. The cells should be unaffected.''
     
  8. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    3,996
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Wow... What a post... Seems like there's a great deal of things that has happened to this car that the owner hasn't been told about. Hard to even know where to begin until there's way more information. I'd be suspicious of the shop's methods/mistakes.
     
  9. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    88,604
    39,595
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    country of origin would be a start
     
  10. qettyz

    qettyz Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2017
    181
    205
    12
    Location:
    Finland
    Vehicle:
    Other Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    Is there subcode for example P3000-388 or some?
    edit: that is gen2 code/pdf info. I have no idea if it has changed in gen3...
     
  11. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2016
    3,152
    3,654
    0
    Location:
    Columbia, SC
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    The response you got from 'hybrid battery experts' has me confused. It makes no sense to me. I question if they truly understand your situation and the symptoms.
     
  12. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    3,996
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Sounds like they're charging your 12volt battery not the hybrid battery. The hybrid battery needs to be charged, that's the problem, not the 12 volt. If they were charging the individual modules of the hybrid pack they'd be around 8volts each, If they were charging the whole pack it'd be way over 200volts total. They don't get it...
     
  13. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2016
    3,152
    3,654
    0
    Location:
    Columbia, SC
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Again, if they charged a battery and were able to only get 13.1 volts, it's because they were charging the 12v battery instead of the hybrid battery. One day or 100 days, it won't make a difference if they're charging the wrong battery.

    Your hybrid battery located UNDER the rear seat in a Prius C (if I remember correctly for 2016) has been horrifically discharged. This could easily have been done due to multiple attempts to start the car without clearing the diesel out of the system. Once the hybrid battery drops below a certain state of charge, it will no longer attempt to start the car. Unfortunately, if you disconnect the 12v battery, the computers will reset and go to a default value for the HV battery SOC. This default value will be much higher than the actual state of charge of the hybrid battery which may allow (trick) the car to try to start the engine again, further depleting the battery until it gets to a condition like you have.

    So....I'll mention it again....the hybrid battery needs to be charged, not the 12v battery. (although if the car sits for several days without being used, the 12v battery may drain and weaken due to normal minor 'car off' current draws).

    And remember a Prius C only has 20 modules in the HV battery(144v nominal), not 28 like the regular Prius (202v nominal).

    I think we also forgot to mention something from your first post. You stated the engine would turn on for 30 seconds..... what you actually (most likely) experienced at the time was the HV battery spinning the engine trying to get it to start. The engine was never actually running under it's own power. Each time there is an attempt to start the engine, the hybrid battery depletes further. If the engine never actually starts, the HV battery never gets recharged.

    If your DEALER is not recognizing this, well.......I don't know what to say. Your HV battery is a 2016, regardless of how far it is discharged, it should recover fully when recharged. If you have a ton of money to burn, buy a new HV battery and as long as the diesel is cleared out, the car will probably start just fine. If you're not made of money, and the dealer can't charge it, then buy the charger portion of the Prolong kit and do it yourself or provide it to them. They could connect it and charge the battery. The Prolong charges at ~0.350 amps so it will take one full day to charge it.
     
    #13 TMR-JWAP, Aug 15, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2018
  14. Battery_Issue

    Battery_Issue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    7
    2
    0
    Location:
    MTL
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius c
    Model:
    Base
    Hi TMR-JWAP.

    They are definitely charging the HV battery: they can't possibly be that incompetent. This is a Toyota dealer in Montreal. They have the Prolong charger: they had to order it in and that's what they used to get the charge of the HV battery up to 13.1 volts as described for 2 days.

    They are saying the HV battery is damaged and can no longer hold its charge. I still can't believe this. I think the engine is at fault I think maybe what is happening is exactly as you said, the engine is not really running for 30 seconds on its own power which is why the battery is getting depleted so quickly..how can I convince the dealer to look into the direction of the engine? I think if they order the new battery we will have the same problem and only then they will start to look into the engine..
     
  15. Battery_Issue

    Battery_Issue New Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2018
    7
    2
    0
    Location:
    MTL
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius c
    Model:
    Base
    I just got a piece of information from the dealer about their diagnostic.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    3,996
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Wow... Dealerships are so incompetent... I'd contact Toyota customer service rep for Canada/North America at this point, as well as get a lawyer to write a letter stating that their incompetence destroyed your hybrid battery trying to start a broke down engine too many times without repairing the engine.

    The very fact they're using an after-market hybrid battery charger from Prolong that Toyota doesn't even authorize (Did Toyota ever Authorize dealers to use Prolong?) is more than enough information in and of itself for this stealership to be at fault and in trouble with their authorization/certification to repair Toyota's in the first place.

    But maybe things are wacky in Canada? Who knows? Looking forward to what you post next about this! So crazy!
     
  17. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2016
    1,868
    710
    0
    Location:
    Lagos
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius
    Model:
    II
    Take the car somewhere else!
     
    PriusCamper likes this.
  18. PriusCamper

    PriusCamper Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2012
    3,996
    1,503
    0
    Location:
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Vehicle:
    2007 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    The Prolong charger doesn't charge up to 13.1 volts, it charges the entire pack not just two connected modules/books within a hybrid pack. For them to say they're using Prolong Charger but not saying the total charge of the total hybrid pack being below ~200 volts is more proof they're not telling you the truth...
     
  19. ericbecky

    ericbecky Hybrid Battery Hero

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2004
    4,332
    3,097
    1
    Location:
    Madison, Wisconsin
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    I wonder if they incorrectly hooked up the HV charger.

    You could look at the instructions on Hybrid Automotive's web site and then go look at your car.
    Maybe they forgot to put the orange plug back in when trying to charge the HV batterynorbwhen they tried to measure the HV battery voltage.

    So weird.
     
  20. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2016
    11,159
    10,763
    0
    Location:
    Central Virginia
    Vehicle:
    2017 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    Since they said Montreal a reasonable guess would be Canada ;)
     
    bisco and Raytheeagle like this.
Loading...