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Prius Follies, Take Two

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by padroo, Jul 12, 2018.

  1. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    I found this old story from one of my other forums and thought it would be interesting to look back into 2005 and see if attitudes have changed.


    Prius Follies, Take Two
    The Wall Street Journal

    By Holman W. Jenkins, Jr. (Commentary)
    December 14, 2005

    Since we're still on the subject of fuel mileage – or at least still responding to email after a column two weeks ago on the Toyota Prius – let's spill a few more gallons of petroleum-based ink.

    The Prius is a nifty gadget and comes with lots of extras. But Toyota markets the vehicle on its fuel efficiency, and fans tout its fuel efficiency. And our point was to debunk the idea that saving gasoline is a virtue independent of economics, such that it makes sense, say, to spend a buck to reduce gas use by 50 cents.

    Edmunds.com, the auto shopper site, guided us to Honda's Civic and Toyota's Corolla as conventional alternatives to the hybrid Prius. This was the source of our claim that the Prius retails for $9,500 more than comparable vehicles. In its own research, Edmunds concluded a Prius owner would have to drive 66,500 miles per year or gasoline would have to jump to $10 for the purchase to pay off.

    But don't take our word for it. Kazuo Okamoto, Toyota's research chief, recently told the Financial Times that, in terms of fuel efficiency, "the purchase of a hybrid car is not justified."

    Now, as an economic matter, overpaying for the privilege of saving gasoline is simply a subsidy to other gasoline consumers. Also as a regulatory matter: Thanks to the special genius of our corporate fuel economy rules, Prius buyers directly underwrite Toyota's ability to sell more SUVs and pickups in the U.S. market without paying the fines that Mercedes, BMW and Volvo long ago accepted as a cost of doing business in the U.S.

    But doesn't saving oil have benefits beyond the dollars saved – for instance, postponing the doom of civilization?

    No: If Prius owners consume less, there's less demand, prices will be lower and somebody else will step up to consume more than they would at the otherwise higher price. That's the price mechanism at work. Oil is a fantastically useful commodity. Humans can be relied upon to consume all the oil they'd be willing to consume at a given price.

    But wouldn't using less oil make us less dependent on Mideast imports?

    Just the opposite: In the nature of things, the cheapest oil is consumed first, and Mideast oil is the cheapest. Drive a Hummer if you want to reduce America's reliance on Arab oil. Indeed, if we could all just pull together and drive gasoline prices high enough, we'd be able to satisfy all our fuel needs next door from Canadian oil sands.

    Let it also be noted our primary political interest in the Middle East over the past 50 years has been Israel, which has no oil. Even Saddam would have been delighted to sell us all the oil we wanted if we had been prepared to acquiesce in his extracurricular depredations. Our attempt to reform Iraqi society is costing us many multiples of the real value of Iraqi oil exports to the world market.

    To wit, let's not underestimate the degree to which our overseas entanglements are despite our interest in oil, rather than because of it.

    Not that Toyota is to blame for the mystification of energy economics, which is a hardy perennial without which the nation's pundits could hardly make their gardens bloom on a semi-weekly schedule year after year. Take a bit of fluff from a group called 40mpg.org, a subsidiary of the Civil Society Institute. It recently put out a list of 89 vehicles made by major global automakers that rate 40 miles per gallon or better.

    These cars include the Ford Fiesta, Volkswagen Lupo and Toyota Yaris, none of which is available in the U.S. Only two vehicles sold in the U.S. get 50 mpg or better, compared to 39 such cars overseas. The group underlined its polemical point with a poll purporting to show that 88 percent of Americans believe "U.S. consumers should be able to get the best of the more fuel-efficient vehicles that already are available in other countries."

    Try not to be bowled over by the paradox: In the hyper-competitive U.S. car market, manufacturers are withholding fuel-efficient cars that Americans would be eager to buy.

    All this really proves is the pollster's facility for getting large majorities to affirm views at odds with their own behavior. Such fuel scrimpers sell in Europe because gas retails $5 a gallon, thanks to petrol taxes that feed the welfare state and keep the autobahns clear of poor people. Americans make an equally sensible decision, in dollars and cents, when they skip over fuel efficiency in favor of features more important to them, such as size, comfort and horsepower.

    Several Prius partisans emailed to say they purchased their cars not to save money but to save the earth, or at least make a statement about doing so. That's a perfectly good reason to buy a car (as is wanting to meet girls). However, we doubt their Hollywood coreligionists would be so keen on solidarity if it meant driving around town in a Ford Fiesta.

    In any case, fuel economy plays an ambiguous role in the fight against air pollution. Our considerable progress against the traditional pollutants has come by specifying allowable emissions per mile driven, not per gallon consumed. Meanwhile, CAFE rules raise the cost of a car while reducing the cost of operating it. Being rational even when they don't meant to be, consumers respond by getting more use of out their cars – driving 15,000 miles per year, up from 10,000 since the rules were adopted. (And automakers have met this demand by greatly improving vehicle reliability.)

    That leaves carbon dioxide, aka greenhouse gas, to support the increasingly rickety rationale for treating fuel efficiency as a socially desirable end in itself. Here, we can only suggest Prius fans might do the planet more good by convincing the American public of the merits of nuclear energy, the closest thing to a genuinely "green solution" to energy challenges in the real world.
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    13 years later, the argument hasn't changed much, and she's right on some points.

    funny, you can find these same sentiments against tesla from prius drivers.:p
     
  3. pilotgrrl

    pilotgrrl Senior Member

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    I actually saved money. I got the hybrid tax credit, and over 12 years, I did save quite a bit on gas.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
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  4. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Financial side boils down to total costs, per year or per miles driven, your choice. This was doable in 2005 and more so now after hybrid fleet has matured. My general impression is that hybrids 'cost out' well. Let potential buyers decide whether to be swayed by quantitative information.

    Ethics and amenities sides boil down to intangibles and personal assessments. Always grist for discussions if that is what's needed.

    ==
    All that was never really hard. It's just that posing such questions in attractive, illogical ways is easier.
     
  5. VFerdman

    VFerdman Senior Member

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    This article had no way of accounting for the fact that Gen 2 Prii will run well into the old age of amortization. A well used Gen 2 Prius today costs almost nothing and still runs perfectly and with a $2K battery investment has potential to run another 10-15 years. All while getting fuel economy well above average new non-hybrid vehicle. So if looking past the initial cost vs. fuel savings argument the fact that Gen 2 Prius (which was the subject of the 2005 article) continues to operate at great economy we can note that its cost is now amortized pretty close to $0. Now the fuel economy is pure gain. Again in 2005 there was no information on how well these cars will age, but this is take 2, after all.
     
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