Prius+ - It's the Prius v that you wanted but can't have

and here Verso and Rav4 are often cross shopped, so yes, they are directly comparable.

 

Just read that the Prius + (EU model will not only have 2 more seats but a better and smaller battery that will be in the front of the car - Sounds great.

 

i also think families are getting smaller numerically but larger physically.

its interesting but right now we have a unrealistically great lease/purchase on some houses just 15 miles south of town. the lease is about $200 a month below rental rates, they are taking $500 PER MONTH off to put towards a down payment in 2 years.

the houses? 2949 sq feet. very nice and there are like 4 of them. now it seems that the larger houses are not selling.

i am tempted but it goes against my reducing my commuting needs. now its well within the range of the Leaf, but i just dont want the extra drive despite it being south which is a pretty easy drive.

but at the same time. it is still pretty easy to understand the need for a larger car...

 

Fertility rates US, they are definitely lower than in decades past.

Total fertility rate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I need not bring up stats on weight, we all know families are physically larger.

 

The latest generation of Toyota’s Hybrid Synergy Drive® powertrain found in Prius+ includes a lithium-ion battery pack, installed entirely beneath the second row seating, offering no compromise to the seven-seat passenger accommodation or loadspace of the MPV-style interior.

Toyota Prius+, Europe's first full-hybrid seven-seater.

 

YouTube - ToyotaEurope's Channel

 

Missing seats in the US version of the Prius V/+

Add me to the list of highly disappointed US people that the Toyota folks decided that we only get five seats in the Prius V/+ USA. I want a high-mileage vehicle to replace my Toyota van, but I need seven seats total for the kids and friends. The Prius V indeed does not have much of a differentiation from the Prius when it has the same seating (5). We could give up the extra mileage when the seating makes it worth it, but not for more cargo room. With seven seats, it would be the automatic winner for anyone that needs a seven-seater and wants good gas mileage; with five, the market is limited. I suspect Toyota USA did not want to take sales from the Sienna van and the big SUV's, but they get horrid fuel economy.

 

Jim's crazy assumption 1) The Lion battery fits in the console, so there is room for a footwell for a third row of seats, the NiMH battery is larger and fills that footwell, leaving a large console. All 7 passenger + are Lion, all 5 passenger + and v are NiMH.

Jim's crazy assumption 2) Toyota cannot get the Lion battery to last well enough to offer a 150,000/10 year warranty.

Crucial Question: Are more US citizens disappointed because the 7 passenger version is not available in the US, or would more US citizens be annoyed it was offered in non-CARB states, but not where they lived? (not available in Arizona, California, Connecticut, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Vermont, and Washington, nor the District of Columbia)

So, would anyone be happier if Toyota could not offer 7 passenger versions except in flyover states?

 

You want a HUD...if you have an android phone check out Ulysse Speedometer. It's a free GPS speedometer and has a HUD feature..

Pretty cool!

 

Well, in this thread here (link following), a Prius Team (Toyota) member said that it was just a marketing/financial decision, not technical: priuschat.com/forums/prius-hybrid-ev-alt-fuel-news/88002-prius-v-wagon-puzzle-finally-complete-heres-what-we-know-6.html#post1243745 (sorry, my account can't post an URL yet, you will have to copy it into the address bar).

I don't know if they would lose money on the deal somehow if they offered seven seats in the US, but there is also a cost in engineering and building different configurations of a vehicle. In the end, all I know is that I am a customer that wants/needs the seven seats when needed, and wants it in a vehicle that gets great fuel efficiency, and we came sooo close to getting that, but are denied- all that Toyota has for me in the US with seven seats will be the fuel hogs, and I don't want that.

 

Another alternative that might be better for some is to not offer AT-PZEV certification on a 7 passenger v wagon and thus only have to offer an 8 year/100K mile warranty on the li-ion HV battery in all states. That seems to be what Lexus did w/the CT200h except they didn't go li-ion.

I too wished that Toyota offered a 7 passenger v in the US. It would've helped meet the needs of one of my former coworkers.

Side note: If the v (even just the 5 seater) had a non-zero recommended tow rating, one of my friends would be more likely to buy it. He sometimes needs to tow a motorcycle on a trailer to the track. Having a 0 tow rating on the Prius liftback and v kinda rules it out for him. (Yeah yeah, the rating hasn't stopped a number of people from towing here...)

He has a family w/2 small kids, a CR-V that's racked up a lot of miles and an Xterra that was given to him that's a gas guzzler.

 

All of which leads to Jim's crazy assumption 3)

TMC has brands, with themes. We can expect cars with one brand to follow that theme.

Lexus: Luxury, slightly sporty (moving to more sporty)
Scion: Youthful, sporty
Prius: Extreme ecological.
Toyota: comfortable appliances

If you drink this koolaid, you can see why a Prius c is not sporty. If it was, it would be a Scion. The Prius v meets AT-PZEV because if it didn't, it would be a Toyota, not a Prius.

These are indeed marketing decisions, not technical. If TMC keeps true to them (which GM didn't) you can see 'reflections' of GM divisions

Lexus = Cadillac (who has a head start on the sporty bit)
Scion = Pontiac in the 60s (by the 80s Pontiac was just plastic cladding)
Prius = Saturn (if Saturn had been even more extreme)
Toyota = Buick (Your daddy's Buick, not the current one)

Three out of four of these 'divisions' have hybrids, it is just a matter of time for Scion. Which division a given hybrid is marketed by will match the car to the image they want to sell.

 

My apologies.

I've ranted about us only getting to view this thing end of December when it has been available for months in the US.

Never realised you DON'T have the 7 seater...

It was (as could be expected) like a Prius convention on the parking-lot...


[ame="http://www.flickr.com/photos/toyotanederland/sets/72157628712765719/"]Toyota Prius Wagon Priview - a set on Flickr[/ame]

 

The above Flikr post has a good pic in it that shows that there is still a good 30cm (1 ft) or so of room in the back even with the +'s third row of seats up. Someone posted that they though that it would be really hard to get into the third-row seats, but the second-row seats slide and fold forward, like in a two-door car passenger seat, making it fairly easy to enter and exit.

 

I obviously hit my head in the third row seat (6'3"), but that also happens in my Gen II on the second row...
Wasn't let down by the interior space! And the room under the floorboard behind the third row was insane. It didn't have a spare, so there was a plastic 'bin' much like on the Gen II (but smaller surface area), but since not having a spare, I think it was over 1' deep Wanted to shout 'ECHO' into it

No automatic adjustment on the rear springs available . Must say it really needs a simple mechanical system like my Volvo, especially since it's a 7 seater.

 

I kind of think that the reason it is offered with 7 seats in the domestic market, and not in the US, is that the load capacity is only 925#. I kind of think that there are fears that the load capacity would be exceeded with 7 seats in the US market, but not the domestic market, especially if hauling adults. Just sayin'.

 

Maybe they see that the mazda 6 hardly sells at all. I think it's the smallest/cheapest 6 seater vehicle really. I guess most people in the US once they go for a third row feel they need to be able to haul half their house at the same time.

 

Tee hee, but just marketing reasons were quoted by the Toyota team... Besides, the load capacity is always low-ball. Even seven 135 pound (61kg) folks would exceed 925 pounds...

 

I think that you mean the Mazda 5... A Toyota team member did mention regarding the lack of the third-row seats in the US, that they have an option for third-row seating for the RAV4 in the US, but that only 5% of people were buying it, as a reason for not offering the option on the Prius v. I don't know that that's a good gauge of how many people would purchase a third-row option for a Prius in the in US market, because:

1) The RAV4 has a third-row seating option? They forgot to tell anyone. I did not know that, though I look at Toyotas first and am in need of a seven-seat vehicle. Cursory browsing of the Toyota.com website shows the RAV4 as a five-seater only. The the interior photos, 360-degree view, and the video tour only show five seats. Thus, most perspective buyers will think that the RAV4 is not in their market and won't look at a RAV4 in the first place, and dealership salespeople will want to steer those that want seven seats to the higher-margin vehicles. In contrast, Hyundai's hyundai.com site shows their RAV4-counterpart (the Sorento) with the third-row seats in. I get that the third row is "in a pinch" seating in the RAV4-- the Prius+ with the third row has some room behind the third-row, which is not the case with the RAV4. [Update- March 2012- the new RAV4 photos on the USA Toyota website show the third-row seating option.]

2) I think that the Prius with seven seats would be unique in the US-market, with no competition in efficiency- all other seven-seaters (or six, like the Mazda 5) are approximately 22/28 EPA MPG vehicles, max., a far cry from 44/40.

 

Re: Prius v Seven-seat option

Hmmm, so in UK/Europe, the Prius+ (Prius v) apparently will only come with seven seats, and in Japan, it's named the Prius Alpha, and buyers have the option of purchasing the five OR seven-seat version, and in the US, the five-seat model is all that is available at this time.

The seven-seat "G" model is listed on Toyota Japan's web site at $2,477 USD more than the five-seat model, presumably due to the cost of the extra seats and substituting a Lithium-ion battery pack in the console for the NiMH pack in the back. You can check my math here:

http://toyota.jp/priusalpha/001_p_001/concept/grade/index.html

Although $2,477 is quite a bit, it would not hurt to give us people in the US the option, I think? If it's a marketing decision only, as was asserted by the Toyota team in another thread.