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Prius turn on and off repeatedly!!!

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Technical Discussion' started by JSH, Jul 12, 2009.

  1. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    I just had something really weird happen to me today. I went out to roll up the windows and move my Prius. Everything was fine at first. I pushed power and rolled up the windows. I then hit power again and turned the car off. Everything was normal.

    However I decided to move the car about 15 seconds later and the car wouldn't power up. The MFD just started rapidly blinking the start-up screen and all the warning lights came on. I tried to turn the car off but pushing the button didn't do anything. I then inserted the key fob and the car powered down when I hit the power button. (The car flashed the start-up screen for ~ 30 seconds)

    I then attempted to start the car again and again it wouldn't start and went into a continuous loop of powering on then off. This time it was a longer cycle of about 3-5 seconds and the A/C powered up in the cycle. I again tried to turn the car off but pushing the button had no effect. I tried to remove the fob but it wouldn't come out until I turn off SKS by pushing the button on the lower dash. Then the car powered down.

    I attempted to start the car a third time and it powered up like normal. I drove around the block and parked it with no problems.

    Any idea what would case the car to go into a continuous loop of powering on and off? (No, I didn't push the power button multiple times)
     
  2. qbee42

    qbee42 My other car is a boat

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    Low 12V battery is my first guess, or a bad connection to the battery or ground.

    Tom
     
  3. richard schumacher

    richard schumacher shortbus driver

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  4. Flying White Dutchman

    Flying White Dutchman Senior Member

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    copu past from that link above

    --------

    Checking 12v Battery Health
    You can easily check out your battery status/charging system using the MFD in maintenance mode. No tools required.
    Get your Prius into "Accessory Mode" - Press the power button without touching the brake pedal.
    Put the MFD into "Maintenance Mode" - Press and hold the "Info" button on the MFD while turning the headlights on and off 4 times.
    Press the "Menu" field on the screen.
    Press the "Display Check" field.
    Press the "Signal Check" field.
    The 12v battery voltage will be one of the items listed, it should be above 12 volts. If it is lower, either the battery needs replacement or the charging system is not functioning correctly - see step 7.
    Put a small load on the battery by pressing the power button again without touching the brake pedal. The voltage should stay above 12v. If it drops significantly, you need a new battery.
    Now get your Prius into "Ready Mode" - step on the brake and press the power button. The battery voltage should immediately rise to 13.8 volts (Your Prius uses constant voltage charging). If it is lower, the battery will never charge; if it is much above 14 volts, your 12v battery will get cooked.
    Shutting the car down will reset the system back to normal operation.
    If you need to get a new 12v battery, you can opt for a dealer replacement or get a better battery at a lower price at: 12 Volt (12v) Toyota Prius Auxilary Battery for 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008 and 2009 with installation kit and free shipping
    and install it yourself.

    JeffD
     
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  5. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    Thanks for the testing procedure, I'll check battery voltage tonight. The car did start up like normal this morning when my wife went to work.


    Some questions on battery replacements:
    How much is a stock Toyota battery? $168 for the optima kit (now reduced to $138) is about twice what I expect to pay for a battery.

    I also see that Auto Zone stocks the following battery for the Prius:
    Duralast 51R-DLG
    27.7 lb
    500 Cold Cranking Amps
    650 Cranking Amps
    8 year warranty with free replacement for the first 3 years
    $89.99

    That seems to be a more reasonable price for a battery.
     
  6. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    If that Autozone battery is the correct sealed battery with proper sized posts, and provision for the external vent tube, go for it.

    I'd ask to see it first
     
  7. 2009Prius

    2009Prius A Wimpy DIYer

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    Yes this seems a much better deal if the battery does fit. Please let us know how it works out for you. Thanks and good luck! :)
     
  8. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    I'll do that. The description says that it vents to the outside.
     
  9. Bear68

    Bear68 Member

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    Bear in mind the factory original 12VDC battery is rated at about 325 CCA and I don't believe it will weigh in at anything near 27 lbs! I would believe 12-13 lbs at the max. I routinely lift them in and out one handed......
     
  10. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    According the the diagnostic test the battery is dead. When I first went into the diagnostic screen the voltage was 11.5. This dropped to 10V when I hit power then up to 14.2V when I hit power again. So it seems the battery is dead and the car is cooking the battery trying to charge it.

    I'll explore my options a bit more next week. Right now I'm getting ready for a 5 day motorcycle trip. I'm just happy to know that nothing is wrong with the car.
     
  11. richard schumacher

    richard schumacher shortbus driver

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    I'll bet a nickel that that Duralast is not a drop-in replacement. Take a good look at the original Toyota before buying something else. Even the Optima has different terminals and needs replacement clamps or cables.
     
  12. daniel

    daniel Cat Lovers Against the Bomb

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    A friend of mine who I respect on such matters, replaced his 12 v battery with an aftermarket one. I don't know which, and he's out of town now. I'd suggest posting a new thread with "aftermarket 12-v battery" in the title, for suggestions. The title of this thread won't draw people who have battery suggestions, but supposedly there are better batteries than the OEM.

    For me, I replaced mine with a Toyota OEM battery when it was about 4 years old. I figured 4 years is pretty good for a car battery.
     
  13. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    I decided to simply purchase the Optima battery and installation kit recommended above. I decided on the Optima because:

    • Optima's have a good reputation on EV forums
    • $138 for an Optima is a great deal
    • I know it will fit as others have used it
    • With tax + core charge the Duralast cost $115
    (I bought a motorcycle without a battery. When I buy a battery for it I will have to pay a core charge. Instead I will simply exchange the Prius battery to avoid the $15 core charge)
     
  14. richard schumacher

    richard schumacher shortbus driver

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    I'm happy with mine. Have fun installing it!
     
  15. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    The Optima battery installed quite easily, it only took about 45 minutes and that includes removing the fuse box and positive cable and repositioning it. (The sketch shows in installed one way while the photograph has it installed the opposite way.)

    However, now I'm concerned that the battery wasn't the problem. After I removed the stock battery I checked voltage and put it on my battery charger. When the battery came out of the car it measured at 12.2 V but after about 3 hours on the charger (battery tender trickle charger) the charger turned off and showed the battery was charged. Sure enough the voltage measured 13.8 volts. That is a little low for a new battery but still pretty good. I'll have to check it with a load to be certain. I've had batteries in the past that show good voltage but still are bad.
     
  16. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    You got a good price.
    Many of us who went to the optima bought here:

    12 Volt (12v) Toyota Prius Auxilary Battery for 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008 and 2009 with installation kit and free shipping

    It includes the necessary adapter kit, and it's shipped right to your door, for the ultimate in "hate driving around shopping" experience.

    Also, if i remember, the Prius doesn't put a ton of amps back into the battery (stock, or optima) as a typical 'ice only' car would, because the battery presumably isn't going to experience any deep discharge as would be the case from multiple hard cranking startups. Rather, the charge delivered back to the aux battery is pretty small ... and that may be why the new battery doesn't seem to be fully up to par.


    .
     
  17. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    That is where I purchased my kit. They have dropped the price from $239 to $163. Optima is also offering a $25 factory rebate so that dropped the price to $138. No tax and free shipping. (I was amazed they managed to fit the battery and kit into a USPS flat rate box!)

    I charged the Optima battery with my battery charger before I installed it in the car. I have no worries about the Optima battery.

    I am worried about the charging system in my Prius. When I removed the stock battery from my car it was dead (12.2 volts). However, just for grins, I hooked up the stock Toyota battery to my battery charger just to see what it would do. Usually a dead battery will charge and charge for hours but will never rise in voltage. That is not what happened. Instead the stock battery showed fully charged after 3 hours. That makes me believe that my problem is not a bad battery but instead a problem with the charging system in my Prius.

    I didn’t have much time last night to experiment but I did hook up my inverter to the stock Toyota battery to see if it would power a load. It would run the inverter’s fan and a 100W light bulb but the voltage sagged from 12.9V down to 12.3V. It would not run my circular saw but neither would the fully charged and functional battery in my motorcycle. The circular saw says 120V / 0.9 amps but it drew enough amps to blow the 10 amp fuse in my multimeter. That was the end of my experiment.

    Tonight I will hook the stock Toyota battery up to my motorcycle and see if it will crank.
     
  18. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    I would suggest fully charging the OEM battery you removed, then having a place like Napa, AUtozone, PepBoys, etc, do a load test.

    There are different types of load testing. The old fashioned way was to apply a load, through a huge finned heating element, to watch the voltage drop. The modern way is through conductance: a high frequency AC pulse is applied to the battery, the return signal is analyzed

    PBT-300 - Midtronics

    Conductance Testing - Midtronics

    In the meantime, I'd use a DMM to check the voltage right at the battery, with the Prius in Ready. You should have 13.6-13.8 vdc. The bolt that holds the ground wire to the unitbody, any evidence of corrosion when you removed it to remove the battery?
     
  19. JSH

    JSH Senior Member

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    I'm pretty confident that the old battery was ready for replacement. When I hooked it up to my smallest motorcycle (250cc single) it would just barely turn it over. (It would turn one revolution then stop) When I hooked it up to my 440cc twin it wouldn't even turn over the engine but instead the relay only clicked. This was with the battery coming straight off the charger.


    I may do that this weekend. Last night I checked the Optima with the MDF. It was 12.8V at first then jumped to 13.8V in the ready mode.
     
  20. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    If that was straight off the battery charger, then the old battery was due for replacement.

    That sounds right. When you put everything back together, did you put a dab of grease on the ground bolt threads? That will ensure the ground is good for a long time