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Prius v (lowercase v for the Prius v wagon) safety

Discussion in 'Prius v Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Justin Priusv, Jun 8, 2016.

  1. Justin Priusv

    Justin Priusv New Member

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    First off ill explain my issue so that everyone knows I or my family are not in actual danger currently.

    Upon purchase of my 2012 Prius v (lowercase v for the Prius v wagon, not an uppercase V) 5 I was issued two key fobs. The first was discarded by my 2 year old son. At a price of $400+ USD i decided to continue with my backup, and did not replace the first. Yesterday my second key was destroyed and is unusable. The vehicle is parked in my driveway front facing my garage without clearance. Upon contacting the dealership they informed me i would have to have the car towed for reprogramming. With 3 children, I contacted the cheapest tow truck I could find to have my car towed to the dealer. Upon arrival, the tow driver asked me to put my vehicle in neutral so that he could then put it on his flatbed. Without a key, i found, after countless time on google, that the request the driver was giving me was not possible due to the shifting mechanism being completely electronic. Since I called the "cheap" guy, he does not have the portable jacks to lift my car to rotate, and informed me he could drag the car which could potentially damage it. I told him no, and had to pay the driver to leave without being towed. Why the dealership didnt inform me of any of this I do no know. But this post isnt really about my personal story.

    THE SAFETY ISSUE

    Heres the hypothetical. Im driving my Prius and i get a short somehow which completely disable the electronics in my car and i roll to a stop on some train tracks. Who cares about the car, lets even say I am safely able to move my children, what about the after affect of a train hitting the car, what about the passengers of that train, what about derailment and the potential destruction that could cause.

    Another hypothetical. Accident on a freeway, car is unable to run, emergency so severe that the police need to make rash decisions and not wait for a tow truck....but no...no safety override, no nothing...just cops watching further destruction because Toyota decided to release a vehicle without an emergency override. How this got past regulation? I have no idea, but the government inspector needs to be fired.

    Prius v (lowercase v) owners need to file a lawsuit against Toyota for this. It is unacceptable, there should have been a recall long ago. All the posts I see with this issue, and thank the good lord, no actual emergency, is completely ridiculous.

    Toyota, I was a Nissan man and I thought id try you out, I was impressed for a couple years...Now?? Never again, you put me and my family at risk is unacceptable. A safety override in my opinion not being on any and every car should be cause to revoke your license to produce cars....period.
     
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  2. DonDNH

    DonDNH Senior Member

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    When you say your second fob was destroyed, what does that mean? Did you attempt to hold the fob against the start button while hitting the start button? That is supposed to bypass the SKS remote electronic circuit and permit the car to be started.

    There are less expensive alternatives to buying a new fob from Toyota. There are several threads here on PriusChat that describe the process of registering a NEW fob (re-programming a used fob is much more complicated).
     
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  3. rdgrimes

    rdgrimes Senior Member

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    This same person will be be suing Toyota if there's an "emergency over-ride" that gets used to take the car. How silly is this?
    If you lose the key to ANY car, is there an emergency over-ride available? Virtually every auto trans car made today has the shifter locked out when the car is off. Owners are given 2 fobs for a reason, choosing to try to get by with one is the owner's decision. But lets all blame Toyota for our own failings.
     
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  4. E46Prius

    E46Prius Active Member

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    Another hypothetical, a satellite can fall out of the sky on top of your Prius v (again, as noted already it is lowercase v for the Prius v wagon) How come Toyota did not design a falling satellite detection system to warn passengers of an impending satellite? Or worse yet, how come the dealer did not tell you of such dangers?

    Sounds like you're just angry you had to pay a tow truck driver for nothing-- a tow truck driver which (in your own words) was the cheap one and did not have jacks to get your car wheeled onto the flatbed.

    No emergency override? Well cars don't have a lot of things they used to. If your battery dies, no way to hand crank the engine. Car makers should install manual cranks.. just in case.

    Car stuck on the train tracks? Well it would be faster to simply exit the vehicle then to tinker with your car, put it in neutral, and hope gravity will roll you off the track.

    Your scenarios are ridiculous.
     
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  5. Justin Priusv

    Justin Priusv New Member

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    Wow, my story is yes, my fault. But this post is not about me, its about safety. Am i angry i had to pay someone, and now will have to pay another to get it towed? Yes, of course I am. There are hundreds of hypothetical situations that are entirely possible and DO cause safety concerns. If a satellite falls out of the sky, im not going after the manufacturer of the car, but the people that were responsible to make sure safety precautions were met on that satellite. Toyota failed to do this on these cars. Did i say i was looking for an override to steal a car?? NO! Did i ask for an override to start a car without a key? NO! My point here is there is situations that can arise where it is necessary to immediately move a car, any car, at any given time. If i was an officer and needed to save a person in a vehicle, i could say break out a window and do something about it. Toyota has made a situation that could cause REAL problems. Whether or not you think that they are real or not, is your issue.

    To the person that respectfully was trying to offer solutions, they key thing was run over, completely smashed, the holding it to the start button does not work.

    I will pay another tow truck driver and have my car towed. My situation is my fault, and I understand that.

    Through searching google I strongly believe that the Prius v is not the only Toyota vehicle that has only electronic transmission control. Toyota should really consider what ive stated before it does come to something worse.
     
  6. Air_Boss

    Air_Boss Senior Member

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    It's a feature.
     
  7. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    So why are you telling us instead of them? Toyota does not read Prius Chat, it is not in Japanese.
     
  8. Justin Priusv

    Justin Priusv New Member

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    I was simply forced to defend myself. You better believe that Toyota has a public relations department that reviews the public's concerns which includes reading popular forums about their vehicles like this one. I am not telling "them", I am simply informing people of a safety concern, people that may read reviews or information on products they are purchasing. What did i mean by "Toyota should consider"? It meant there are more people that have this issue than me, and have complained about it.
     
  9. E46Prius

    E46Prius Active Member

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    There is no safety concern here. Your general lack of understanding of how cars and the world works is the real issue here, and not anything Toyota did or didn't do.

    Besides... you're convinced there's a serious safety concern now. Either you didn't do your homework or you should get rid of your car and get a more conventional car, possibly with a manual transmission. Or better yet, just stay at home. It's far safer.
     
  10. Kenny94945

    Kenny94945 Active Member

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    I guess the "moral of this story"....always have two sets of keys.

    Towing trick:
    When the vehicle is locked in gear and the vehicle has to dragged by a tow truck...put sand on the ground and drag across the sand.
     
  11. rdgrimes

    rdgrimes Senior Member

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    I guess Toyota is obligated to protect customers from themselves. ;)
     
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  12. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Your v does not have a locking steering column. For the last several decades, most cars have had that feature, intended to make sure you can't roll them away without the key (unless the path the steering wheel was locked to happened to be exactly where you wanted to go). For obvious reasons, the steering wheel lock was not provided with an easy override if you didn't have the key.

    Your v hasn't got that, you can turn the steering freely at any time. Instead of that old familiar antitheft feature, they provided a tranny that doesn't come out of Park without the key, and it also doesn't have an easy override. Is one of these designs inherently more or less safe than the other?

    If anything, there have been accidents caused in some cars by inadvertent key removal while in motion, resulting in a moving unsteerable car.

    By contrast, it's really unlikely for the v tranny to go into Park while you're in motion. It is not on a spring, it will not suddenly park if the power fails, it's actuated by a switched-reluctance motor that the ECU has to affirmatively power both to disengage and to engage it. Even if you inadvertently hit Park while in motion, the car will simply beep and offer you neutral instead (Scottish brogue reminding you of Starfleet regulations optional).

    So if you had that sudden complete electrical failure as you rolled across the train tracks, what makes you think you would end up in Park? For that matter, what scenario at all do you envision where a locked Prius being in Park is significantly less safe than a locked any-other-car that perhaps can be rolled but not steered?

    -Chap
     
  13. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    The tow truck driver should've had a dolly to put under the front wheels to tow it away. I find it interesting that the tow truck driver you called didn't have a dolly. Also, if you read the manual, it actually suggests asking for a flatbed but I realise it can be difficult load it onto a flatbed if your car is in the garage as there may not be clearance to slide the bed under your car.


    Scenario #1: Train

    More likely than not, your car isn't going to derail the train. Your v is way lighter than any transport truck that could get stuck at the railway crossing. It'll just decimate your vehicle. Also, if my car was stuck on the railway and the train is coming, I sure as hell am not going to push it away and risk getting hit by flying debris or have the car roll and hit oncoming traffic.


    Scenario #2: Freeway Collision.

    Any vehicle that severely disabled won't be touched by the police. It's evidence for collision reconstruction. Also, no officer is going to risk his life to go into a damaged car, shift the car into neutral and somehow push the car (which is severely disabled which means the wheels probably aren't pointing in the right direction) off the highway when there's the potential that another vehicle can come up and hit the disabled vehicle. You never get out of your vehicle on the highway and if somehow you decide to do so, you better be on the other side of the guardrail.
     
  14. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    prius v keyfob 46052.jpg Concerning the fob: There is (was) a small metal plate that came with the fobs with a number that can make a new fob without towing it anywhere. That number should be stored on your phone, written in your owner's manual (kept in the car) and maybe emailed to yourself and wife for easy access in the future. While expensive if one of the original two is lost, most of us keep two and almost all newer cars have electronic keys these days. If I had been in your position I would not have paid the tow truck driver.
     
    #14 rjparker, Jun 9, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2016
  15. Justin Priusv

    Justin Priusv New Member

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    Updates

    I have had my car re-towed, and my FOB replaced. My feelings after the fact: Still have safety concerns, there is a potential good end result and bad end result to every scenario. Pointing out a good or bad one is pointless, there is always another.

    I posted here to raise a concern, its fair that people disagree. Note to self: don't post on a Toyota lovers forum, you will get mostly hate because people are such lovers of the brand.

    I had hoped that lovers of Toyota would instead think of ways to communicate and help make their favorite brand even better.

    In truth I love my car, the options it has, the room it provides for my family. I wanted to improve the brand, ie: "Toyota should really consider what Ive stated before it does come to something worse."

    This instead turned into a type of political bashing of the other candidate, where instead of improving your candidate, it was preferred to throw eggs at the competition. I still stand that I would not vote for the candidate that can have supporters that cant accept that their candidate is not perfect (not the sole reason to chose a candidate).


    Thank you for the input, this is good information to know, as far as the original tow truck guy goes, I made the mistake of calling the cheap guy. I knew it was cheap, and as a person that would prefer a good society, felt it was my responsibility to pay for a service that I should have known ahead of time could be under par. The guy drove quite a distance to my house, was told I had a Prius, not a liftback, not a c, not a v, and I would not expect any individual to know the details in and out of a specific car.
     
  16. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    you folks are a patient lot.
     
  17. Air_Boss

    Air_Boss Senior Member

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    I hated our Jeep Cherokee and the incompetent dealership from which it was purchased, and hated our Dodge Grand Caravan until every single OEM ancillary was progressively replaced with aftermarket by our local mechanic (different but similarly incompetent dealership) following which it ran reliably like a train for 15 years and was passed along,

    We've had nothing but satisfaction from the Prius v.
     
  18. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    I do not love Toyota, I do love the Toyotas I have owned.

    In your case, if your Toyota had keys you had lost, what scenario that lets you in without a key that keeps anyone else out?
     
  19. Justin Priusv

    Justin Priusv New Member

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    there is an anti scenario to every scenario, what is the point in going further? it was a concern on generally safety that i believed should have been considered at time of design, can the manufacturer lay out every scenario? no absolutely not. are there holes and workarounds to every scenario? yes. so it does not matter how i actually respond to your question because there will be an anti scenario, and i care not to continue pointless arguments.
     
  20. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Well the point would be the lack of a shift interlock like on a regular automatic.

    My question is, what about all the other cars with electronic shifters? (BMW is the most prominent with Jaguar and Chrysler following)

    Also, just a lifepro tip: If you want help from someone, it's best not to come to them guns ablazing. e.g. if you need a plumber to help with your plumbing issues, perhaps don't greet the new plumber with a story of how the last plumber put your family's house and lives at risk and he should've known better and how the company should've fired him and all plumbers.