Pssst...Wanna Buy A Tesla?

Discussion in 'Prius, Hybrid, EV and Alt-Fuel News' started by El Dobro, Oct 22, 2013.

  1. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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  2. Former Member 68813

    Former Member 68813 Senior Member

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    I'm not shocked. That's oil state, right?
     
  3. John H

    John H Senior Member

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    nothing to do with oil, or natural gas, or the west texas wind farms, or the hydro electric, or the nuclear power plants. just the automobile franchises protecting their investments.
     
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  4. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    This is probably a good time to point out that we're also the largest wind state:

    In terms of installed wind power capacity, the United States is currently second only to China.[18] As of 31 December 2012, the top five states with the most wind capacity installed are:[19]

    Wind power in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
     
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  5. Scorpion

    Scorpion Active Member

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    OK, that's true.
    But this is Texas.........the state that sends the likes of Ted Cruz to the U.S Senate to argue that we need more "free market" principles and that America "needs to be more like Texas".
    'We need to get the government out of people's lives'........HA!

    And here we have the 'home of the free' blatantly and unabashedly stifling a free-market, innovative startup (founded in that that socialist state, California) just to protect car dealerships overwhelmingly owned by wealthy republicans.

    Yep, the conservatives hate Big Government......when it provides services (food, health-care) to non-constituents (the poor in their state or elsewhere in the country). But when it protects their interests, more government regulations, please!

    I guess it's true: everything really is bigger in Texas - including the hypocrisy! :mad:
     
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  6. Scorpion

    Scorpion Active Member

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    Of course ....I'm referring primarily to the (present, and hopefully short-lived) conservative/republican leadership in that state. Obviously, not everyone (or every city) in Texas is that way.
    (This message a disclaimer/pre-buttal to austingreen ;))
     
  7. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    Texas government works just fine -- if you have enough money to buy a law.
     
  8. ftl

    ftl Explicator

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    "The finest politicians that money can buy"
     
  9. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    We've got to separate that into 3 different statements.
    1) Should america use more free market principals?
    Absolutely.
    2) Does the Texas Law restricting Tesla from being able to sell directly follow Free Market Principals?
    Absolutely not, It a law written to protect the special interests of a small group that provided campaign money, the Auto Dealers association.
    3) Do most Texans Support Ted Cruz
    Also Absolutely not. He ran for a safe republican seat. All he needed to do was win the primary versus anouther republican that people also disliked. Not much of a choice. The bulk of the money came from out of state interests, as does most of his fundraising. Of those groups that don't have tea party or republican affiliations, the groups funding Cruz, all gave Obama more money. Cruz is a national candidate (or disgrace). He didn't close the government, that was Boehner from Ohio doesn't even like texas, with help from his friend Reid from Nevada. I don't like any of the 3, but Cruz hasn't been there long enough to cause the damage to the american people those other 2 have done. Here is cruz's campaign details
    Ted Cruz: Campaign Finance/Money - Top Donors - Senator 2012 | OpenSecrets

    I've lived in california and texas. The politics in california are worse. Totally agree that legislature is bought by the national auto dealers association. They do contribute to democrats and republicans though, got to bribe both sides.

    Most texan's that like small government do it because of crap like this. The texas government sometimes is too big.
    Again, we just can spot the big hypocrites better;-) lots of us local austinites were at the hearing at the capital for tesla. We have a much less corrupt government here than the one in washington, but that is because we try to work to remove bad laws like these. Washington, I don't see much hope for.
     
  10. SageBrush

    SageBrush Senior Member

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    No sh1tt, sherlock.
     
  11. Scorpion

    Scorpion Active Member

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    We already do, to an extreme almost no other country goes to.
    What free market principles are we not using?
    Surely you would agree that when the market fails at something (lack of high-speed rail, health coverage) or causes an externality (financial markets, co2 pollution) the government should step in and try to address the problem and advocate for the public good in a smart way? But for today's conservatives, even setting standards (mpg) is a violation of free-market principles

    Ahh....but he was elected in a statewide election. Just like Rick Perry. No redistricting or gerrymandering here. Agreed that money causes lot of the problems, though.

    I lived in CA before moving to Nebraska. I like it better here (I grew up here) but we also need to look at factors beyond economics and politics. NE has way less population density, is not a border state, and has a booming Ag economy. Income inequality is worse in CA. Ditto for TX.
    You should read the latest Time magazine.....Texas made the cover, it's called "United States of Texas". I disagree with a lot of its points though. Texas hasn't really been creating jobs so much as taking them from other states through low taxes and cheap real estate. TX also benefited from $100 oil. This formula can't work for America as a whole, because it's zero-sum. Someone has to actually create the industries of the future.....like Tesla, Apple, Google..... all from CA.

    I never really understood the obsession on the right with SIZE of government. The issue is really whether the government is doing what it is supposed to be doing in a smart, efficient manner. Government spending has been roughly 20% of GDP for over 60 years. Don't see any reason not to keep it at this level, just need to make sure every dollar is wisely spent to benefit public.
    For Texans, driving electric cars (powered with all that wind) would benefit the state economy more than keeping car dealers in business ever could. That's because every gallon of oil Texans don't consume is one that they can export to other states or countries. So, the fact that the dealers were able to 'capture' the state government is the best proof there is that even 'small' governments are not immune to this sort of stuff.
    Again, the issue isn't whether government is big or small, but whether its laws are smart or dumb (in terms of promoting public good).

    Austin is definitely the progressive part of Texas. It's good citizens there are paying attention and standing up whenever kooky laws like the Tesla block come up. There is no reason why citizens can not re-shape washington in the same way.......just need to get money out of politics first.
     
  12. austingreen

    austingreen Senior Member

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    Well clearly your rant on this pointed out one. We have a regulatory environment in most states to protect established auto dealers against, competition from a new car company. If you are talking about poor regulation, and government give aways to special interests, you can't simply say the problem is we don't have enough government. We have a lot of government by the special interests, for the special interests. Often we do need government involvement here to keep a level playing field, but once it gets involved it tries to unlevel it in favor of those with political clout.

    Do you know the government subsidized BP to drill in the gulf? Then when it spilled it limited its liability, even when there was a large amount of evidence that it violated several safety protocols (it was not simple negligence, it got special wavers from laws, then violated others in the spill). That is not a free market, its a favored market.


    First there is entrenched dead wood in Washington. We need term limits to get them out. One of the special things attached to the bill to reopen the government was a payment of $177,000 to the widow of an 89 year old senator, that died in office, that had over $60 Million dollars at the time of his death. That is right, we couldn't reopen the government until a rich widow got paid. I can't understand why we allow such an exclusive club with benefits for life. The other thing attached was an extra $2B for a damn in kentucky that probably no one really wants but the pork for kentucky and new jersey special interests were what was required for the senate to just do its job badly. Since we have so many safe districts, and sitting congress people are entrenched in a steady stream of cash, we need term limits to pry them out. Next we need to reverse the gerrymandering that makes seats so safe for each party to keep. Then yes, we need to get rid of the big money. I would add, that we need to send more people in government to jail when they are caught actively breaking the law. It still is amazing to me that congressmen can legally insider trade.
     
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  13. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    If we look at Industrial Military Fed lobby spending, we quickly discover there are NO party differences, no matter how many may protest that fact. Both sides' re-election war chests are equallly funded (ergo, our 'DemPublicans' one party system that has 2 fake ideologies - each half blaming the other) by the same lobby. Far be it from any state, not to learn from our Fed leaders.
     
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