1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Rear License Plate attachment nut gone?

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by nukem, Oct 19, 2016.

  1. nukem

    nukem Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    34
    10
    0
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Long story ... ahhh.

    I needed to change the license plates on the 2010 Prius and right rear license plate bolts wouldn't come lose. With a couple of twists the aluminum (why does Toyota use aluminum Philips screws???) screw head was toast.

    So I gave it some WD40 and waited 20 min. Then took the vice grips to the bolt since the Philips screw driver wouldn't turn. I hear a "clunk" (sound like when you get a stuck bolt loose) and the bolt came out. Yup! Just dropped out.

    The left attachment nut looks like a regular 6M bolt attached somehow to the back door. The right attachment nut is gone. There is now nothing to which the replacement screw can screw into. (lots of swearing and loud yelling ensued.)

    I presume whatever was on the inside of the back door came loose and will rattle around but am not sure how to go about figuring out where this bolt thing went.

    The repair manuals haven't been helpful since they don't talk about attaching the license plate. (Or perhaps I haven't found that section of the 7k pages yet.)

    So presently the license is hanging by one bolt.

    ?Help?

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,571
    48,862
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    how big is the hole in the sheet metal? maybe one of those plastic replacement bolts?
     
    Robert Holt and Mendel Leisk like this.
  3. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,474
    38,106
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    If you can find the nut, install everything, then put some tacks of JB Weld of the nut. Lightly oil the bolt threads too.

    If you can't find the nut, you should be able to find comparable nut at Home Depot. Bring along the bolt to verify compatibility.
     
    Raytheeagle likes this.
  4. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    5,963
    1,979
    0
    Location:
    Edmonton Alberta
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    The best fix is one of those plastic inserts they use for mounting things on drywall. Find one that is a tight fit. Use a stainless screw with it, and perhaps a stainless washer over the plate. No corrosion, local supply, no fuss, no mess.
     
    Robert Holt likes this.
  5. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,474
    38,106
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    This is something else I use, for various applications. Just food for thought.

    Home Hardware

    (Haven't used them for license plates, no problems there.)
     
  6. nukem

    nukem Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    34
    10
    0
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Thanks for everyone's comments.

    Sorry for the delay. It was raining cats & dogs so didn't want to get soaked while checking it out in the daylight.

    Here are the pictures showing location. Apologies. I should have posted those yesterday.

    Today when I needed to go out, I heard the nut or whatever was attached to the back door roll around. Turn right and roll ... roll ... roll. Turn left and roll .... Oh this will drive me nuts. (pun intended ;))

    Any recommendations on how to extricate that nut from the back door?

    @bisco I don't think it is sheet metal. I feels more like the plastic similar to the bumper. The hole looks to be the same size as the one with the attachment nut.

    @David Beale Great idea. I'll have to go and see what those look like. I remember in the old days there were nylon inserts for license plate attachment. I wonder if those are available somewhere? After a quick look Amazon has lots. "Nylon License Plate Nut" or "Clip".

    @Mendel Leisk Also a great idea. Nylon bolts should alleviate the problem with aluminum bolts oxidizing and getting all seezed up.

    Off to the store.
    Cheers!
     

    Attached Files:

  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,571
    48,862
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    there are some threads detailing removal of the inside of the hatch door to replace the spoiler. it's a bit time consuming i think.
     
  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,474
    38,106
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    You can get a flex extension with magnet on the tip. I think the nut and bolt are steel.
     
  9. nukem

    nukem Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    34
    10
    0
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    @Mendel Leisk Where would I get access? Could I get access through the license plate light door?
     
  10. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,474
    38,106
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    You're gonna have to look, lol. I've changed a license plate light bulb, just can't remember what's going on there. Maybe if the hatch is completely raised you can vibrate the nut back up? Also, with hatch being aluminum and the nut steel, maybe you can move the nut through the (non magnetic) hatch wall?
     
  11. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    5,963
    1,979
    0
    Location:
    Edmonton Alberta
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    I think the only way you're going to get it out is to remove the interior panel. Not a trivial job, but doable. If you're worried about doing it ask a body shop. They may do it for free if you're lucky.
    The nut is spot welded to the panel, and too much torque will break it free, which is what happened to you.
     
  12. nukem

    nukem Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    34
    10
    0
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Thanks for everyones help and suggestions! The saga continues.

    I removed the interior panel. Had to visit 3 stores before I found one that carried interior panel removal tools/nylon tools. The removal wasn't as hard as I thought. But, I'm now worried about the reassembly ... not sure how to get this panel to reattach. Would probably make an funny video. :p

    I found the nut that was rolling around in the tail gate. (See attached photo) It looks rusted. If the tailgate/back door is aluminum and this nut is supposed to be similar metal then how come there is rust? Aluminum oxidizes by creating a thin layer, usually white, that in the end stops the rest of the oxidization and protects the metal from further oxidation. The rust in the nut is definitely red. So this nut must be some sort of steel/iron. If that is the case, then how do they weld a steel nut onto aluminum? I didn't think that was possible. I don't suppose the nut and bolt were steel???

    When I look at the nut is almost looks like it was glued/epoxied??? Is that possible? Would it hold?

    I've bought some stainless hex head bolts (M6 x 1 x 20 A2), M6 stainless A2 nuts and M6 washers. I won't put any more Philip's pan head screws onto the license. :mad:

    I will need to seal the hole when I install the new bolts & nuts so moisture doesn't get into the tailgate/back door. This nut can't be welded back on without significant difficulties. In addition to the dissimilar metals issue, the place where it's supposed to be attached is underneath a metal cover with about 1/2 to 3/4 inch clearance. You can't remove the cover as it's also welded down. (But that looks like Al & Al). So maybe I'll try epoxy?? Dumb idea??:confused:

    Thanks again!
     

    Attached Files:

  13. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,474
    38,106
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Re-attach the old nut with a good quality two-part epoxy, really butter it up. Do this with everything assembled so alignment will be perfect. Lube the bolt threads so there won't be a repeat. One thing I do: pretty much every time I wash our car I remove the license plate (and reinstall the bolts to prevent water incursion while spraying the hose). This ensures it doesn't seize up.

    The nut IS steel, the hatch is aluminum. All of this can be verified with a magnet.

    On second thought, looking at that pic, maybe use the replacement hardware, that nut is rusted. Kinda strange.
     
  14. David Beale

    David Beale Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2006
    5,963
    1,979
    0
    Location:
    Edmonton Alberta
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius
    They can glue the nut on or use a "holder" made of steel or aluminum, that folds over the edges of the nut. Like they mount diamonds in a ring. The holder is spot welded to the body and then folded over the nut.

    If you glue, DO clean very well and sand the surface. Use "degreaser" on it as well. Then you may get a good bond. And make sure the bolt threads are well lubed, so you don't end up gluing the bolt in. ;)

    You can also get "pop-rivit" type nuts. I've used them on undertrays. A good industrial supply store should have them. They often sell a "kit", with the nuts and the application tool, for around $20. They would install from the outside. More permanent and bonus, you can then choose the thread to one you can actually get nearly anywhere.
     
  15. MrMischief

    MrMischief Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2008
    426
    443
    0
    Location:
    Denver CO
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    Three
    Gorilla Glue, back of the plate, press and hold plate to about where you want it for 10 - 30 seconds, open beer and impress the ladies with your handiness.

    [​IMG]
     
  16. ETC(SS)

    ETC(SS) The OTHER One Percenter.....

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2010
    7,668
    6,485
    0
    Location:
    Redneck Riviera (Gulf South)
    Vehicle:
    Other Non-Hybrid
    Model:
    N/A
    [​IMG] upload_2016-10-26_9-4-5.jpeg
    Drywall anchor.
    take your license plate bolt to a hardware or home improvement store.
    Look for something in the #12 range and work your way down.

    I know that a #6 is about the size of a .22 bore (I use them for snap-caps)
    ...oh wait.
    You're in Canada.

    Bad example. :eek:

    Anyway, if I were guessing, I'd say something in the #8 to #12 range.
    Super easy.
    You should be done before lunch---including drive time to the store.
    Also....they don't rust and if you lose one they don't rattle either.

    Good Luck!
     
    StevenM likes this.
  17. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    54,474
    38,106
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    It's bothersome how that could get so rusty. Lot of automated car washes?

    Ontario's in the salt belt I guess.
     
  18. nukem

    nukem Junior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2012
    34
    10
    0
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    I don't think the rust was the problem. I suspect it was more about a bad weld.

    I appreciate everyone's advice. Just to finish and close this thread, I thought I should add what I did to fix the problem.

    Here is a picture of the license plate nut. IMG_20161024_074101.jpg

    I purchased the two part epoxy. (Permatex Steel Weld 2 part epoxy). Put a bunch on the nut and around the hole. Then put a bunch of the epoxy around the nut when attached. You really have to be careful that you don't get any epoxy on the threaded portions.

    It was a real PITA to keep the nut in the right location. So I used a screw and a bunch of flat washers to attach the nut. Once the epoxy was sticking in place, I removed the screw and washers.

    The following picture shows the "repair". So far it's held. IMG_20161030_121354.jpg

    Thanks again for your help.
     
  19. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

    Joined:
    May 11, 2005
    107,571
    48,862
    0
    Location:
    boston
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    Plug-in Base
    well done, thanks for updating!(y)
     
  20. ATHiker

    ATHiker Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    642
    560
    0
    Location:
    Massachusetts
    Vehicle:
    2016 Prius
    Model:
    Four Touring
    This thread has been very helpful defining the problem on our 2010.

    The nut has rusted to the screw, and in the process of turning the screw, the weld must have broke.

    Now the screw and nut just spin when I turn my screwdriver.

    Car is too old for me to enlist profession help removing the interior panel of the hatch.

    Looking for a thread on that now!