Red Triangle & ABS light on after charging HV battery – please help

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by Epiphany2000, Aug 27, 2016.

  1. Epiphany2000

    Epiphany2000 Member

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    Hello PriusChat folks,


    I finally got around to using the Prolong Battery Charger (from hybridautomotove.com) that I’ve had since last Christmas. Over the past few days, I did two full discharge/charge cycles of my traction battery. I had intended to do 3 full discharge/charge cycles, but time constraints limited me to 2 cycles. This morning, I disconnected the charger and let the car sit for a little over an hour before turning it on. That’s when the trouble started.

    Upon turning on the car, I got the infamous red triangle, as well as the ABS light. The “grinding” noise that one often hears after turning off the car (which I believe is normal) is happening almost constantly, and the car computer thinks that I’m almost out of gas (even though I have only driven 50 miles since my last fill-up). I disconnected the 12v battery for a few minutes to try to reset things, but to no avail.

    My 12v battery is a bit old (in fact, I have a new battery coming in 3 days from now), but it’s been holding up quite well. Just a few minutes ago, I started charging the 12v battery in the hope that it might help clear up the issue, but I’m not very optimistic about the prospects.

    Besides charging the 12v battery, my only other thought would be to clear the DTC codes. Unfortunately, my laptop is not currently set up with Techstream, and I’m not exactly sure where my ODB cable is. Over the course of the day, I’ll get Windows 7 back on my laptop, and try to find the cable.

    I fear that the battery charging might have blown a sensor, which will end up costing me thousands of dollars, but only time will tell.

    Any suggestions would be most appreciated. Thanks in advance.
     
    #1 Epiphany2000, Aug 27, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2016
  2. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    @Epiphany2000 , when I delete the duplicate, you'll have to upload the photo again (and delete the attachment link that you currently have).
     
  3. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Did you put back the orange plug and lock it in place?

    Charge the 12v and report back.
     
  4. Epiphany2000

    Epiphany2000 Member

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    The orange plug was not removed. Doing so is not part of the charge/discharge procedure. The only time I ever removed the orange plug was when I installed the wiring harness (which attaches to the charger) a few months ago. The car ran fine after the harness installation (until the current problem, of course).

    Here’s the photo that was deleted (per my duplicate post) earlier.

    MFD - small.jpg

    The car seems to recognize the HV battery, and I was able to drive the car up and down the street. I would not drive it any further than that, however, as the power brakes are not working.

    I found the Mini-VCI cable and am in the process of restoring Windows 7 on my laptop so that I can run TechStream. I plan to read & clear the DTC codes and take it from there. Charging the 12v battery will take many hours. I’ll do so, but I don’t think that’s the problem.

    I have a really bad feeling about this, but I’ll keep doing what I can. Thanks for the help.
     
    #4 Epiphany2000, Aug 27, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2016
  5. andrewclaus

    andrewclaus Active Member

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    The grinding noise may be the ABS accumulator, for which there is a new warranty extension. Maybe, just maybe, it's a complete coincidence and you can get the ABS fixed by Toyota on their dime.
     
  6. Epiphany2000

    Epiphany2000 Member

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    Thanks for the information. Here's what techstream revealed:

    PC Pic.jpg

    I have many other screenshots, but this one seems to be the most revealing. As the dialog box indicates, I was not able to clear the codes. It looks like I'll be taking my car to Luscious Garage next week. If there is anything good about this situation, I'm stating a new job next week, as I don't expect the repair bill to anyone less than 4 figures. I guess we'll see...

    As before, any suggestions are much appreciated. Although I've been absent for quite some time, the PC community is still the best!
     
  7. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    You may be having a brake actuator error, that has an extended warranty
     
  8. wjtracy

    wjtracy Senior Member

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  9. Epiphany2000

    Epiphany2000 Member

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    Thanks for the link regarding the brake actuator issue. It looks like it only applies to certain vehicles manufacturer between 2004-2009 (gen 2). When I take the car to Luscious Garage, I'll have them research the issue. I'll also give Toyota a call myself.

    I checked under the hood and found no blown fuses. Still no changes in the car's behavior as of yet. I'll post an update once the car has been diagnosed.

    I hate to say it, but this may just be the end of my almost perfectly functioning Gen 2 Prius. :cry:. I could very well be wrong, but like I said I have a very bad feeling about this...
     
    #9 Epiphany2000, Aug 28, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2016
  10. Epiphany2000

    Epiphany2000 Member

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    Here's a quick update...

    On the evening of 2016.08.28 through the morning of 2016.08.28, I charged the battery with my CTEK Multi US 3300 battery charger. I did not record the total charging time, but I estimate it to be around 10 hours. Upon checking the charger in the morning, the charge indicated was still showing - it had not switched to maintenance mode. When charging my battery in the past, I always remember it being in maintenance mode after charging it overnight.

    I then left the battery charger on during the day on 2016.08.28 for a total of approximately 12 hours. Once again, the charger was still in charge mode upon my return.

    I then disconnected the charger, and entered the "vehicle signal check" mode in order to get a voltage reading on the MFD. Note that I did not wait for any surface charge to dissipate. Here is the procedure I followed and the results:
    • Switched to ACC-ON - Voltage at 12.1
    • Turned on headlights - voltage dropped to 11.6, then settled at 11.8
    • If I hit the brake, the brake pump turned on, dropping the voltage to 10.9-11.1
    • Waited ~15 minutes (leaving headlights on) - upon return, voltage at 11.5
    • Turned off headlights - voltage at 11.9
    • Switched to IG-ON - voltage dropped to 11.6
    • While in IG-ON mode, the brake pump was going off approximately every 10 seconds. While the pump was on, the voltage was at 10.9. While the pump was off, the voltage would settle at 11.5 - 11.6.



    You can compare this to the results of a test I performed in on 2013.12.23· voltage at the terminals measured 12.3-12.4V

    · Turned on ACC - MFD showed voltage of 12.2
    · Turned on IGN - voltage dropped to 11.9 and remained steady for a couple minutes
    · Turned on
    headlights & started stopwatch (cell phone& radio also running on 12V battery) - voltage at 11.0
    · Voltage climbed to 11.3 within 45 seconds

    • 5 minutes - 11.2
    • 8 minutes - 11.1
    • 11 minutes - 11.0 - 11.1
    • 12 minutes - 11.0 steady
    • 15 minutes - 10.9 - 11.0
    • 17 minutes - 10.9 steady
    • 20 minutes - 10.8


    As you can see, I was testing while in IG-ON mode instead of ACC mode during the 2013 test (dolj correct his suggested procedure after reading my post and changed the language from IG-ON to ACC).

    In any case, I think it’s time for this battery to go. Before all this stuff started happening, I had ordered at 55Ah deep cycle battery. It is scheduled to arrive on 2016.08.30. If all of these problems are simply due to a weak battery, I’d be thrilled. However, I’m not so optimistic.

    I was thinking of borrowing my girlfriend's battery, adapting the SAE posts to JIS (pencil post), connecting it to my Prius, and seeing if this resolves my issues. My main hesitation about installing the new battery is that if it does not resolve the issue, I’m afraid that the cost to repair my car might exceed its value (i.e., the car may be totaled). Thus, I might be throwing away the cost of a new battery. But I suppose I could do worse than burn $113.00.

    I’ve got a lot other things do over the next couple days, and I was able to borrow a relative’s car. Hopefully I’ll have another update in 2-3 days. Otherwise, I have an appointment at Luscious Garage on 2016.08.31.

    As always, all feedback and suggestions are welcome, and I’ll continue to report back.
     
    #10 Epiphany2000, Aug 29, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2016
  11. fotomoto

    fotomoto Senior Member

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    Your 12v is in very poor health.

    Instructions on prolong's site recommend disconnecting the 12v during the long conditioning process to avoid running it down. I use the opportunity to charge it too with a trickle charger while conditioning the HV bat.
     
    edthefox5 likes this.
  12. strawbrad

    strawbrad http://minnesotahybridbatteries.com

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    Mini VCI cables actually suck. I know they are the go to standard for DIY code reading. They are knock offs of a Chinese copy using the cheapest parts available. They run with a beta software version. Even though they are made to the lowest possible standards for most cars they will work.

    On some cars they are nothing but problems. Common errors are not being able to connect, "U" codes, and not being able to clear codes.
    I suspect the MIni VCI cable is causing part of the problems with your car.

    Brad
     
  13. andrewclaus

    andrewclaus Active Member

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    This does not sound good. I'm no expert, but I still think you have an actuator failure and if so, it should be covered by Toyota.

    Re: the MiniVCI, I've had plenty of connection issues and I also blame the crappy old laptop I use. The MiniVCI may not work perfectly diagnosing your car, but I don't think it'll actually harm the car. If someone has evidence of this, it would be good know about it.
     
  14. strawbrad

    strawbrad http://minnesotahybridbatteries.com

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    On most cars they work fine. The Mini VCI is available with two different firmware versions, 1.4.1 and 2.0.4 . All the cheap cables use the early 1.4.1 firmware. I now use a VXDIAG cable that has it's own firmware.

    On my own 2006.

    The 1.4.1 will cause error codes as soon as it is connected. It can not clear the codes. Most of the codes are "U" which are Can Bus errors. The crappy cable causes the can bus errors.

    A 2.0.4 cable will connect and clear the codes. It's really slow.

    The VXDIAG cable connects and performs the health check much quicker than any Mini VCI cable. It's night and day difference.

    Errors caused by a Mini VCI cable do no permanent harm to your car. But you will need a code reader capable of removing them.

    Brad
     
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  15. JC91006

    JC91006 Senior Member

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    Where did you get the VXDIAG cable?
     
  16. strawbrad

    strawbrad http://minnesotahybridbatteries.com

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    Any of the usual suspects. Amazon, eBay, Google, Alibaba, even vxdiag.com .
     
  17. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    Because of Strawbrad's experience, I am no longer recommending Mini VCI. Even though VxDiag costs more, at roughly 3-4x the price of the Mini VCI (US$85-US$100), I think that it is still a very reasonable (read: inexpensive) option.

    I currently have the MVCI, and given the problems I experience in slowness and reliability (read: not reliable) I am going to upgrade to VxDiag. While MVCI mostly works with my car, I have problems trying to use it with other cars.
     
  18. strawbrad

    strawbrad http://minnesotahybridbatteries.com

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    Thanks for the vote of confidence.

    Please report on your personal observations when you get a VxDiag cable. Confirmation of my experience will be valuable to those that follow.

    Brad
     
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