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Red Triangle of Death, AC & More

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by shelbyelan, Sep 8, 2018.

  1. shelbyelan

    shelbyelan Junior Member

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    I apologize for starting a new thread for this. Before posting, I read as many other threads as I could that might be related but I’ve got a few things going on and I’m not sure what all might be related.

    Overview on my 2008 Prius with 294k miles:

    — Wouldn’t shut off in early June (Replaced combination meter ourselves after dealer’s diagnosis)

    — Smart key no longer works after that (Must push button to unlock, insert key in ignition, and keys can be locked in the car. I figured this was related to combo meter being replaced but have been fighting cancer, having surgeries, etc. and too overwhelmed with trying to get back to work and other life stuff to deal with it.)

    — Red triangle of death (intermittent at first but now steady)

    — Wouldn’t start at all on 6/25/18 on the way to surgery- no stress! Haha. (Wouldn’t take a jump from a starter or from another car, but got over it after a while and started up. Hasn’t done this again.)

    — Check engine light (intermittent at first but now steady)

    — Maintenance (oil change time at least)

    — Display says, “Caution There is a problem with the transmission ‘P’ lock mechanism. Park your car on a flat surface and fully apply the parking brake.” (Intermittent at first, but much more frequently now.)

    — MPG has decreased from about 44 to about 41

    — Codes that came up at auto parts store:

    — P0420 catalytic converter below threshold

    — P3193 Fuel Run out (Came up as current. I hadn’t run out of fuel since 2008 although I had run it low recently.)

    — P3120 transmission control engine control unit

    — C1241 low battery positive voltage or abnormally high

    battery positive voltage (Had the auto parts

    store check the 12V in the back but they said it

    was ok. There was corrosion on one post

    though. This battery is 4-5 years old and was

    thinking to try an Optima as suggested by

    someone in another post.)

    — C1242 open circuit in IG2

    — C1300 malfunction in engine control unit


    I thought I had they hybrid battery replaced about 6 years ago, but I believe I must have been mistaken as it was under $1000. The dealership I thought did that said that in Feb. 2013 they replaced the Hybrid electric water pump.

    Also, my AC is only working intermittently. I’m pretty sure I have a leak and have been recharging it periodically but recently we recharged it on the weekend and it wasn’t doing much that week. Since then it often works fine, but once in a while it doesn’t do much. Particularly, if it’s really hot and I’m just sitting it feels like it’s doing nothing. That doesn’t seem like a leak to me and one of the dealers I spoke with said it could be connected to a problem with the Hybrid system.

    I love my Prius and am grateful that my boyfriend has been able to do a lot of work on it. I can’t really afford a new one as my current medical bills are more than my car payment was. I’m hoping to keep this one going. That said, realistically I understand it can only go so long. When it’s time for it to go, I’d rather not dump a lot of time and energy into it first.

    I know I need to check the radiator fluid and plan to do that this afternoon. Otherwise, where should I start?
     
  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    sorry for your troubles.

    this is a difficult situation. off the top of my head, i'd say start looking around for a decent corolla or some such.
    at 300k, it's only a matter of time, and there is no way to predict what major repairs you may need.

    start with the 12v. don't take their word for it. if your boyfriend has a voltmeter, have him check it after the car has been off overnight. also, check the battery connections for more corrosion and tightness, especially the negative to ground.
    if he can't do that, you should really look for a newer car.

    you may need a prius aware scanner and a subscription to the service manual if you are going to diy.

    all the best!(y)
     
    DLC82SV likes this.
  3. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    Autoparts store code reader will miss many Prius specific codes and can report invalid Prius codes.

    If you plan to stay w/ a Toyota/Lexus, consider getting Techstream w/ mini VCI from Amazon (~$30); doesn't matter who you purchase from, as all the sellers get it from the same 1or2 suppliers in China. Quality control is poor, and you may have to order a replacement. Techstream is the official diagnostic software approved by Toyota and used at the dealers. B/C the stuff on Amazon is a hacked copy and an imitation OBD2 cable, it is best to install Techstream on an obsolete and spare, 32bit Windows OS laptop (XP, Vista, 7), that will only be used for diagnostic purposes. Mac install possible too. Ask friends/family if they work or know someone who works in IT; this person will likely have access to obsolete laptops laying around collecting dust, and should be able to give it to you free of charge. A dealer will charge $100+ to retrieve codes.

    P0420 - Given the mileage, Catalytic converter is most likely in need of replacement. If you live in a CARB State, you are supposed to purchase a CARB certified catalytic converter that is only available from the dealer or dealers who sell genuine OEM parts online at a considerable discount compared to their retail counter prices. Some people are ok to install a used Cat or a universal weld-on/bolt-on Cat. If the car is consuming a lot of oil, any replacement Cat will live a shortened life. Do you know how much oil you have to add between oil changes?

    C1241 - 12V battery is in a discharged state. Recharge it w/ a smart AGM compatible charger, clear the codes, and all should be well. Using a regular charger will NOT fully recharge an AGM battery. If the current battery does need to get replaced, an Optima is a poor choice (38Amp Hr); Toyota TrueStart, Bosch, Exide, and AC Delco, are same 45Amp Hr battery that came w/ your car. PepBoys sells the Bosch for $152; shipping might be possible.
    Read Post #5 & #8 (Is my inverter coolant pump slowly failing? | PriusChat)
    How to load test the Prius 12V batt yourself.
    What the measurements mean.
    Examples of Smart AGM compatible chargers.​

    C1242 - This might possibly be a result of the low 12V battery. Recharge 12V, clear codes, and see if this code goes away.

    C1300 - issue w/ the skid control. Maybe a false coder reported by the autoparts store?

    Smart Key not working. Is the SKS button OFF?
    upload_2018-9-9_1-38-29.png

    HV (High Voltage) Battery (aka Hybrid Battery), was NOT replaced. The Inverter Pump was replaced.

    AC System.
    How are you working on it?
    What type of refrigerant did you add, and how much?
    Do you know the specs for the Hi and Lo side?
    Are you using a virgin AC manifold gauge set that has only been connected to Toyota/Lexus hybrids?
    How did you determine you have a leak?
     
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  4. shelbyelan

    shelbyelan Junior Member

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    I can’t imagine how I could have forgotten to mention I add oil almost every time I fill it up with gas. I keep a gallon with me at all times, using that and Lucas for oil leaks.

    The first time we did the AC I remember checking to be sure we were getting the one that didn’t have that oil we shouldn’t have. We got an AC refill kit from the auto parts store and only used it for my Prius. The last time we refilled it, he said the one at Walmart was the same. He said it was R134A and that was used then.

    There was nothing scientific about our reaching that conclusion. Several years ago I had a LOT of work done on the AC after I hit a deer. The body shop reattached the fans wrong so that they were both blowing air out. When that was finally diagnosed properly (thanks to Prius Chat), and fixed it worked fine for years.

    Thank you all so much for your help!
     
  5. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    When you did recharged with the r134, did you also used the recommended compressor oil(ND11)? If you used any outside this, you for to discharge em out from the system, before it causes harm to the AC system.
     
  6. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    The mileage on your car tells a lot about its remaining life.
    You say you top oil after every refills? Might be signs of engine problems already.
    Just hope it doesn't get to replacing that engine.


    Dxta
     
  7. DLC82SV

    DLC82SV Member

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    This is very specific. Our ac systems can not handle any additives at all because of the electric compressor. So if it had anything in it besides ONLY 134a the system may be compromised. Anything at all, leak sealer, universal pag oil, conditioners... All very bad for the compressor that has already been strained by the fans being installed improperly. You can't even use the same hoses or recovery unit on a hybrid as the moisture and contaminants are enough to take out our systems. I just beat lung cancer. If my ac fails, I'm screwed! I can't breathe!

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
  8. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    Although you don't specify how much oil you add between gas fill ups, it is probably more than a few ounces (1-3). Don't waste your money on engine additive oil products that claim to: stop/reduce oil leaks, reduce oil consumpiton, etc. The only thing that stops oil consumption is:
    1) a new engine,
    2) used engine that doesn't burn excessive oil like yours ($450 on up)
    3) engine overhaul w/ new piston rings, rehone cylinder walls, new valve guide seals, possibly new valves, possibly new valve springs, cam seals, and other wear parts.

    Not worth replacing the Catalytic converter until the oil consumption is resolved w/ new/used engine or an overhaul.

    Refilled w/ R134a ONLY? There are many R134a cans on the market that have additives (dyes, o-ring conditioners, PAG oil, etc), that are incompatible w/ the Prius AC system. You need to be absolutely certain R134a only.

    AC likely was never properly repaired from the initial accident and subsequent post repair attempts. You may enjoy reading Lech's postings to gain some insight why few places can work on AC systems competently; click the Postings Tab (lech auto air conditionin | PriusChat).
    I like this perspective he provides here: Air Condition Problem | PriusChat

    You are in a bad spot. Still owe money on the car and have some costly repairs:
    • engine (new/used/rebuilt) - $500 used engine + many hours for your man to install. This would be a 'fun' project, and a big sense of accomplishment for him if undertaken. Price reputable shops installation labor rates.
    • catalytic converter - weld on/bolt on replacement is cheap vs OEM replacement. Call muffler shops for labor rates.
    • AC not working - proper diagnosis and repair can quickly become cost prohibitive
    • other unknown DTCs may still be present that the autoparts store is unable to retrieve due to equipment
    • Guaranteed future cost: the HV Battery will require replacement at some point down the road. New OEM HV Battery is $1800-$2500; good for another 8-10+ years of trouble free operation. Used/Remanufactured/Refurbished/Rebuilt are cheaper, but will ultimately cost you more money and time due to inconvenient breakdowns; many horror stories from unsuspecting victims who thought wrong.
     
    #8 exstudent, Sep 9, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2018
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  9. Landon51

    Landon51 Member

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  10. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    well said!(y)