SARS-CoV-2 Coronavirus (COVID-19)

Discussion in 'Environmental Discussion' started by tochatihu, Jan 26, 2020.

  1. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace Senior Member

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    Any research funded by NIH grants should be available in the US with low markup since the US taxpayers already paid for the research. Overseas sales should command a higher markup.
    Universities using government grant research to start high profit companies using that research is morally wrong in my opinion.
     
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  2. KennyGS

    KennyGS Senior Member

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    I agree, where's my cut? :eek:
     
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  3. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Soon upcoming milestones are 30 million global cases and 1 million global deaths. If we are happy that US is not now leading all others in lung offerings, is there something more to be done? If US is 'on the mend', is there any reason to imagine this great nation would increase assistance to others, with huddled masses yearning to breathe free?
     
  4. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    @Prodigyplace #2741 addresses something (perhaps) broader than this disease.

    US Universities innovate on taxpayers' coin and move to markets with much more private funding. So it looks to me. Putting such transitions on shorter leashes might harm a broadly revered economic model.

    COVID research on taxpayers' coin feels different, for humanitarian reasons. Three (maybe more) US medical 'majors' ought to eschew big vaccine profits. If any can reasonably claim no govt funding, let them offer expensive vaccines. We'll see how that goes...

    More vexingly, most global people who are now looking for protection are poor. If Russian and Chinois vaccines are cheap and available (saying nothing for now about efficacy), and US and Euro are costly (and scarce), how might that shift international perceptions?
     
  5. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    unfortunately, many states seem to be 'trickling up', including right here in good old ma.

    some school systems have already postponed in class learning due to spikes.

    locally, police raided a back to school alcohol rave with estimated 150 high schollers about to go back to class.
     
  6. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

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    Excellent post sharing technical data about vaccines. Perhaps it might help to list the various virus vaccines by mechanism used?
    • polio - there was a notorious failure in the earliest when vaccines initiated polio
    • smallpox - we're aware of the 'cowpox' but what was last used
    • tropical - not necessarily viral but Yellow fever and other disorders
    Thanks,
    Bob Wilson
     
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    it's gonna be a long road to herd immunity...
     
  9. fuzzy1

    fuzzy1 Senior Member

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    Here is one take on the notorious Cutter incident on a killed-virus polio vaccine (repost from earlier PC thread):

    The big polio vaccine blowup happened from Salk's "killed virus" vaccine, due to manufacturing and inspection failures at Cutter Laboratories, the smallest of four companies making the product. The products made at the three larger companies did not display this problem. (Though some indicate Wyeth also had some problems.)

    After Sabin's "attenuated virus" vaccine was proved out, it became the vaccine of choice in 1961. It was cheaper, easier to administer (orally, not by injection), and even produced some 'contact immunity' in close un-immunized people. But in rare cases the virus would reactivate in the gut and cause the disease.

    An improved version of Salk's killed virus injected vaccine was licensed in 1987, and has become the vaccine of choice in the U.S. But worldwide, both are still in use, each with its own advantages. The Sabin oral type remains far cheaper, and a better choice for mass immunizations in developing regions.

    The Cutter Incident: How America's First Polio Vaccine Led to a Growing Vaccine Crisis
     
  10. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    For those interested in sampling the effort of Med School with no financial payoff :) :

    Viruses and Vaccines: A Basic Flowchart of Viral Families | American Scientist

    RNA vaccines: an introduction | PHG Foundation

    Vaccines | Special Issue : Vaccines against RNA Viruses

    ==
    Before genomes were trivially read, viral vaccines were the whole thing, either 'dead' or disabled. Flu vaccines are still like that.

    Subunit vaccines 'part out' virus and just give you one part to make DIY antibodies against.

    Nucleic acid vaccines are the modern, agile and somewhat speculative ones. Here you just get the blueprints, DIY your own viral proteins (only proteins, I believe) and DIY your own antibodies.
     
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  11. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    my doc sent out an email to get your flu shot early. i asked when can i come in? their reply, we don't have it yet.
     
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  12. Raytheeagle

    Raytheeagle Senior Member

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    Try a drugstore ;).

    Or even Walmart:).

    Mask up though (y).
     
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  13. Merkey

    Merkey Member

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  14. Mark57

    Mark57 Senior Member

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    We went to Walgreens Monday and got our flu shots. For once, they had both the under and over 65 versions.

    Everyone is adamant about getting it done ASAP this year.
     
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  15. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    yep .... masks .... slowing the herd. checking Sweden stat's - just a day or so ago, no deaths & no new cases.

    Capture+_2020-09-15-04-54-12-1.png
    .
     
  16. Trollbait

    Trollbait It's a D&D thing

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    Sweden is not the US.
    The government and health officials there made all the same recommendations; working from home, social distancing, less people in restaurants, etc., as the rest of the world. They just didn't hard enforce it, though they may have shut down some restaurants. Their people trusted the authorities, and followed the advice.

    Compared to their neighbors that did enforce a shutdown, Sweden did not fare well. In deaths per million; the US ranks 11th, Sweden ranks 13th, Denmark ranks 60th, Finland ranks 78th, and Norway ranks 87th. Sweden's economy decline as much as those neighbors.
    Sweden & Coronavirus -- 'But What about Sweden?' Well, Let's Take a Look over There . . . | National Review

    And Sweden is still far from herd immunity. A month ago, only 15% of their population was showing antibodies. That is lower than the 40% their officials were predicting, and too low for herd immunity.
    Sweden's COVID Policy Didn't Create Herd Immunity
     
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  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    wegmans has a drive through on october 3rd, that might be the ticket
     
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  18. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Sweden now has 1521 cases per week and 11 deaths per week. It has not shown a second wave seen in several other European countries recently.
     
  19. tochatihu

    tochatihu Senior Member

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    Florida bar bans masks:

    https://www.wfla.com/community/health/coronavirus/we-do-not-believe-in-them-florida-bar-bans-people-wearing-masks

    (which may not be legal)

    ReOpen South Florida staged a protest:

    Target mask protesters play Twisted Sister's 'We're Not Gonna Take it'

    which only seems worth mentioning for the quote "In celebration of Burn Your Mask Day we decided to spread some freedom dust over the shoppers and employees of Target!"

    They might not have been thinking of corona virus electron micrographs as freedom dust, but it was my mental image.

    And Missouri had annual motorcycle rally:

    Will Bikefest at the Lake of the Ozarks become the next Sturgis, causing a COVID-19 spike? | Regional | stltoday.com

    This article does not indicate whether there was local disagreement about proceeding (as there was in Sturgis).
     
  20. hill

    hill High Fiber Member

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    that's true, but the point was that the people that would most likely die, did so upfront, meaning the most sickly and elderly. It's a theory that masks simply slow the inevitable ..... not taking into account overcrowding in hospitals and such which we are now past .
    whether or not some number below 40% is real or not is unknown, because not everyone goes in for testing. Those untested could be another 50% imune already. Or not. Lots of unknown variables that we can assume one way or the other. But as it stands, they're raw data (graph) looks like they have pretty much close to zero'ed out. Next unknown will be whether it goes back up again.
    .
     
    #2760 hill, Sep 18, 2020 at 8:35 PM
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020 at 8:44 PM